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Apple sells bonds while sitting on a huge hoard of cash

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phucheneh said:
Uh, it's not 'morals.' It's 'this is the tax rate on the income you made.'

I don't know how LOL WHAT INCOME LOL is an appropriate response. Fuck Apple; fuck this country; fuck Steve Jobs' rotting corpse, along with those that follow his innovative ideas regarding how to be a pathetic piece of shit.
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Lol you do realize that nearly every corporation in existence spends time trying to find tax loopholes, right?
 
BoberFett said:
dumb shit
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Go back to Fox News and the P&N forum, kthanks.

Oh noes, we are hindering the mighty corporations. What do we expect, all...taxing them and shit...

So leave. Pack your fucking shit; don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out. No, not 'shuffle your money around.' Rather, get the fuck out of this country and go sell your trash somewhere else.
 
BoberFett said:
Why would Ghana want to give up their portion of the taxes to the US? Sounds like global tax agreements only help the US, and screw over countries that are "tax dodging" countries. Countries where the money is stored will never agree.
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"Global" tax is basically the 21st century version of the white man's burden.
 
sdifox said:
So only during taxtime a corporation is not a person? Very convenient. Individuals have to pay tax on global income.
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Do foreign individuals pay income tax to the USA?

Of course they don't.

US citizens (and greencard residents) pay US income tax on global income, so do US corporation.

What you're missing is that the foreign companies making the profit and accumulating the cash are not US corporations: They are foreign corporations. I.e., incorporated in another country. It's just that their (foreign) stock is owned by Apple USA.

Fern
 
Mixolydian said:
Ok now you're just being nuts.
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It's a perfectly coherent analogy. Lots of people breaking/subverting laws and not getting caught. So why bother with them?

Don't blame me when your logic is exposed as shit. I'm tired of this 'b-b-but everyone does it!' bullshit that seems to have so fully saturated this country.
 
phucheneh said:
It's a perfectly coherent analogy. Lots of people breaking/subverting laws and not getting caught. So why bother with them?

Don't blame me when your logic is exposed as shit. I'm tired of this 'b-b-but everyone does it!' bullshit that seems to have so fully saturated this country.
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You're a victim of misinformation.

These tax rules are NOT loopholes. These rules were purposefully enacted by Congress for specific reasons. I see no reason to think Apple is doing anything other than what Congress intends them to do.

If someone, an individual or a corporation, is doing something in a gray area, or outright illegal, they would not attempt it with so much publicity.

The IRS is aware of Apple's situation and I would bet Apple is under audit 365 days a year (well, actually less since IRS employees don't work everyday). The IRS probably has its own office in Apple's building. When I was with the large multinational CPA firms our big clients like Apple had an IRS office in them so the IRS can audit all year long.

Fern
 
sdifox said:
So only during taxtime a corporation is not a person? Very convenient. Individuals have to pay tax on global income.
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No idea. Is this $$ that people brought into the US, earnings on stock holdings traded in the exchanges, monies that they can access via a brokerage?

Fern may answer but the point is simple. Congress made the rules, bitch to them. And the corps paid the tax on the earnings in the country that it was earned. If they don't bring it here, why should there be a tax? Heck, why should there be a tax anyway? How much would that "already" taxed $$ help the US economy if the fed didn't want another cut and the corps used it for investments here?

Seems stupid to double tax it and have very little of it brought here stimulate our jobs/industry. Now, the US gets no tax, no job/economy stimulation.
 
phucheneh said:
It's a perfectly coherent analogy. Lots of people breaking/subverting laws and not getting caught. So why bother with them?
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No laws are being broken here. You seem to have a hard problem wrapping your head around this.
 
Fern said:
Do foreign individuals pay income tax to the USA?

Of course they don't.

US citizens (and greencard residents) pay US income tax on global income, so do US corporation.

What you're missing is that the foreign companies making the profit and accumulating the cash are not US corporations: They are foreign corporations. I.e., incorporated in another country. It's just that their (foreign) stock is owned by Apple USA.

Fern
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They are owned by Apple. If I have a house out of country, I have to pay capital gain on it. So should corps.
 
highland145 said:
No idea. Is this $$ that people brought into the US, earnings on stock holdings traded in the exchanges, monies that they can access via a brokerage?

Fern may answer but the point is simple. Congress made the rules, bitch to them. And the corps paid the tax on the earnings in the country that it was earned. If they don't bring it here, why should there be a tax? Heck, why should there be a tax anyway? How much would that "already" taxed $$ help the US economy if the fed didn't want another cut and the corps used it for investments here?

Seems stupid to double tax it and have very little of it brought here stimulate our jobs/industry. Now, the US gets no tax, no job/economy stimulation.
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As a citizen, we (Canadians and Americans are both taxed on global income) are supposed to report all income. Foreign income is taxed at the local rate and if that is lower than the Canadian tax rate, you owe the Canadian government the difference.

The corps argued successfully that the corp is a person. Thus, they should be taxed as a person.
 
sdifox said:
They are owned by Apple. If I have a house out of country, I have to pay capital gain on it. So should corps.
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If and when Apple (USA) sells the stock of the foreign subsidiary they will pay tax on it.

There is no difference.

You're still failing to realize that Apple USA Inc. and Apple Foreign Inc. are two separate and distinct persons. They are two legally different persons. This is unlike your analogy where we have only one person.

Fern
 
highland145 said:
You're a generous fellow.

Is this $$ that you brought back into the US?

Edit: I trust Fern to know the reasons/why. Again, bitch at your reps.
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Nope. You don't haveto bring themoney back to Canada. Global income means exactly that, as long as you are Canadian or Americn citizen. You owe tax. Hell, IRS is going after decendants of American citizens that have never been to America.

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/globe-...icans-in-canada/article586970/?service=mobile

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/taxseason/story/2012/02/27/f-tax-season-irs-fatca.html
 
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Fern said:
If and when Apple (USA) sells the stock of the foreign subsidiary they will pay tax on it.

There is no difference.

You're still failing to realize that Apple USA Inc. and Apple Foreign Inc. are two separate and distinct persons. They are two legally different persons. This is unlike your analogy where we have only one person.

Fern
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Then why is Apple USA issuing bonds?
 
sdifox said:
Nope. You don't haveto bring themoney back to Canada. Global income means exactly that, as long as you are Canadian or Americn citizen. You owe tax. Hell, IRS is going after decendants of American citizens that have never been to America.

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/globe-...icans-in-canada/article586970/?service=mobile

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/taxseason/story/2012/02/27/f-tax-season-irs-fatca.html
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That right there tells you that out tax system/IRS is effed up, including taxing corps that repatriate $$.
 
sdifox said:
Oh US tax code is fucked up to hell.
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The question is why can't we get a piece of that action?

"Oh, you don't want to pay...we take your organ transplant."
"Oh, you move to another country...we take your grand kid's savings account."

etc, etc.
 
sdifox said:
-snip-
http://m.theglobeandmail.com/globe-...icans-in-canada/article586970/?service=mobile

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/taxseason/story/2012/02/27/f-tax-season-irs-fatca.html
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The first story about Janet Selby doesn't add up.

She's 47 yrs old, back then she wouldn't have been issued a social security at birth as we do now. Nothing was computerized back in 1966. back then you only applied for your SS# when you were older and about to get a job. I got mine when I was 13 yrs old.

Without a SS# the IRS would have no way to know about her, even if they did they couldn't identify her.
 
sdifox said:
It's because they are exercising tax avoidance.
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In your opinion....not most of the rest of the world.

And I don't blame them. We've already agreed it's effed.

I would like our reps to get a clue and let them bring that $$ back home without penalty.
 
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