Apple attempts to patent kill switch that roots out unauthorized users, detects jailb

[zerocool84]

Just about every mobile operating system manufacturer can remotely delete apps from the smartphones they help provide, but if a recent patent application is any indication, Apple's looking to lock down the whole enchilada on future devices. The basic concept is as simple as the diagram above -- certain activities trigger the phone to think it's in the wrong hands -- but the particular activities and particular remedies Apple suggests extend to audiovisual spying (to detect if a user has a different face or voice than the owner), and complete remote shutdown. While the patent mostly sounds targeted at opt-in security software and would simply send you an alert or perform a remote wipe if your phone were stolen or hacked, jailbreaking and unlocking are also explicitly mentioned as the marks of an unauthorized user, and one line mentions that cellular carriers could shut down or cripple a device when such a user is detected. Sounds great for securing phones at retail, sure, but personally we'd rather devices don't determine our authority by monitoring our heartbeat (seriously, that's an option) and we're plenty happy with the existing Find My iPhone app.

Apple's always looking for more ways to lock down their devices and here with go with something that surely does lock it down. :thumbsdown:

http://www.engadget.com/2010/08/21/apple-attempts-to-patent-kill-switch-that-roots-out-unauthorized/

 

[Bateluer]

Hmm, wasn't Jailbreaking/rooting ruled legal in the courts? If Apple, or Google for that matter, were to brick a phone because it was modded, I'm thinking they'd find themselves in court pretty quick.

 

[Pliablemoose]

That was filed over a year ago.

I don't think Apple will get any more agressive in stopping jailbreakers, they realize a lot of people do it, and feel they have to put up a token resistance.

If Apple was serious about locking down the platform, it'd be locked.

 

[zerocool84]

Hmm, wasn't Jailbreaking/rooting ruled legal in the courts? If Apple, or Google for that matter, were to brick a phone because it was modded, I'm thinking they'd find themselves in court pretty quick.

That's what people were saying in the comments. They're probably going to find some way to use it as an excuse to brick it though.

 

[pm]

Zero, could you put a more negative spin on it? The patent - which seems too trivial to be patentable to me, but I think that a lot and am proven wrong - the patent has some useful functionality too. Locking some jerk who stole my phone out of my phone would be useful because I have a whole lot of stuff on there that that I wouldn't want a thief to have. A remote wipe on my phone would be vaguely handy if it were to be stolen (personally I'm more keen to find out where my phone is and so that I can then find some police and/or beefy friends to go get it back.

Making it black and white - they coded this to nuke jailbreakers - without mentioning that the bulk of the patent is about more security software, is definitely putting a strong negative spin on it.

On the other hand, remotely nuking jailbreakers/unlockers would be bad. But frequently the very first thing that jailbreakers tend to do is to disable these sorts of kill switches. There's a patch out there on Cydia to disable the remote app disabler - which could be used to disable viral apps that Apple missed... or used to track down people who have stolen apps and disable them...

Bateluer, the exemption allows users to jailbreak their phone without violating the DMCA, it doesn't say anything about companies trying to stop them.

If Apple was serious about locking down the platform, it'd be locked.

I don't really agree with this. If you dig into the security stuff on an iPhone, you can see that Apple is constantly trying to make it harder for jailbreakers to jailbreak and, to a lesser extent, unlockers to unlock. The new SHSH keys, secure bootloaders, constant changes in bootloader code, chain of trust in software/hardware.

I honestly don't think it's possible to secure a very complex device completely that connects to unsecured computers and the internet and that can run apps and scripts and has a lot of ways to get stuff into it. If you have something that has no input, or something very simple, then you can secure it... but otherwise, I think it is infeasible to think that you can stop people from exploiting some accidentally-coded hardware buffer overflows.

All that said, I agree with you, Pliable in spirit. I don't think they are doing everything that they could to stop them. The really nasty possibilities - like having future coded versions of iTunes look at the phone when it's connected to detect a jailbroken phone and then erase it or something like that - I think they leave those off the table. I think they could definitely make life for jailbreakers/unlockers much more difficult by playing offense - but instead they are playing a defensive game.

 

[Kanalua]

Just because something is legal (jailb) doesn't mean that you have a "right" to do it. To me Apple's attitude towards their iPhone customers is one of the biggest detriments to having an iPhone. If you jailb your iP4, the latest update reversed that.

Just because it's legal doesn't mean they can't make it against the user agreement or some other contractual agreement. Some thing being legal doesn't automatically make something a right.

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

Just because something is legal (jailb) doesn't mean that you have a "right" to do it. To me Apple's attitude towards their iPhone customers is one of the biggest detriments to having an iPhone. If you jailb your iP4, the latest update reversed that.

Just because it's legal doesn't mean they can't make it against the user agreement or some other contractual agreement. Some thing being legal doesn't automatically make something a right.

Well it is legal so it is a right. But Apple is within rights to combat that by preserving what it wants as a user experience for its phone.

I suppose you could say the same with Motorola's locked bootloader?

 

[Kanalua]

Well it is legal so it is a right.

If only this was true.

 

[LikeLinus]

If Apple was serious about locking down the platform, it'd be locked.

Famous last word. Apple has tried to do this in the past and has failed. Just about every company has tried to and hackers have always found was to do it.

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

If only this was true.

??? Jailbreaking is legal. You have a right to do it. Apple is within rights to lock the system down too.

All jailbreaking means is you are trying to hack into the phone. This was legalized. It doesn't mean Apple can't design a more elaborate scheme to prevent you from doing it effectively.

 

[mmntech]

??? Jailbreaking is legal. You have a right to do it. Apple is within rights to lock the system down too.

All jailbreaking means is you are trying to hack into the phone. This was legalized. It doesn't mean Apple can't design a more elaborate scheme to prevent you from doing it effectively.

That's the ruling of the law right there.

I have a bit of a love/hate relationship with Apple right now. A quick Google search shows about 10% of users have jailbroken their iPhones. That's 10% of users who aren't happy with Apple's "user experience". It's a sizable number.

Instead of improving that experience, say adding Flash support like every competitor has, they keep pouring money into locking it down. I wish they'd just be honest and say "we want to keep the monopoly on app sales." Quit lying to me by pretending you're limiting the phone to protect me.

 

[Janet55]

they will still be able to jailbreak the iphone, its so much like computer softwares DRM that all they have to do is emulate some sort of isolated data that mask's the fact that you've hacked it, making that "switch" think that nothing is wrong... it might take an extra day to figure out (XDA_devs), but i see no hope for apple stopping the jailbreak's. It is the hard war between apple technical staff and the Dev-team. SONY has tried for years to prevent people from home-brewing (hacking) their PSP's but they fail every time as well, and thats with hardware security features built into the damn battery packs and constant firmware updates... LONG LIVE OPEN SOURCE!!!
(BTW: I am using iphone, and I support iphone all the way ~~~as i can use frash on my iphone 4, and what's more combining my iFunia iphone auxiliary tools, enjoy movies and videos are so freewheelingly! ~~~my iphone 4 is so nice.)

 

[Patranus]

Hmm, wasn't Jailbreaking/rooting ruled legal in the courts?

Nope. Try again.

 

[rudeguy]

Nope. Try again.

you are wrong...the federal appeals court said it is, SCOTUS may rule on it later:


http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...rfai=CnCcPUodyTNn1JozmNPOmheYPAAAAqgQFT9BQU-w

 

[Pliablemoose]

Technically the LOC (Library of Congress) says jailbreaking & unlocking are exempt from the DMCA, not the courts.

Further, the LOC's decision does not protect those who write the jail-breaking programs

 

[Patranus]

you are wrong...the federal appeals court said it is, SCOTUS may rule on it later:


http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...rfai=CnCcPUodyTNn1JozmNPOmheYPAAAAqgQFT9BQU-w

Nope. Try again.

Technically the LOC (Library of Congress) says jailbreaking & unlocking are exempt from the DMCA, not the courts.

Exactly.
If Apple pursues this matter in court, I wouldn't be surprised to see the regulators overturned.

Also, something might be legal to do but if you cannot get your phone to work on any carrier because it being jailbroken is a violation of the companies terms of service or getting your phone to sync with your computer because your phone violates the sync software terms of service, it is really a moot point.

 

[rudeguy]

Nope. Try again.



Exactly.
If Apple pursues this matter in court, I wouldn't be surprised to see the regulators overturned.

Also, something might be legal to do but if you cannot get your phone to work on any carrier because it being jailbroken is a violation of the companies terms of service or getting your phone to sync with your computer because your phone violates the sync software terms of service, it is really a moot point.

my fault. I just read the blurb that said "appeals court rules jailbreaking legal"

 

[shortylickens]

Aside from the gaming companies, I dont know anyone who punishes their customers like Apple does.
The phones, computers, software, its ridiculous. I wouldnt mind their products so much if I didnt have to deal with Steve's bullshit.