Apple A14 - 5 nm, 11.8 billion transistors

[Eug]

A14 - First announced for iPad Air.

 

[defferoo]

having owned both ipads and iphones, no matter how fast the cpu is, apple will find a generous way to slow your equipment to molasses within 1-2years. will never buy any apple product again. updates forced on me ruined it all.

this hasn’t been an issue for a while. this was a problem in earlier iPhones due to a combination of OS updates and battery degradation (from experience, iphone 5s and iphone 6 were both badly affected). my iPhone 8 plus is still running great 3 years on and my iPad 2017 is also doing well even with an A9 from 5 years ago. part of the reason is that the A9 was a big jump from the A8 so anything that’s come since then has been able to keep up with OS updates.

 

[Mopetar]

I am noticing some pauses in app loading etc. with my A10 iPhone 7 Plus with 3 GB RAM, but I'm thinking it may have more to do with memory than SoC speed.

This mainly started with iOS 13, and has continued with iOS 14.

My A10X iPad Pro with 4 GB does not exhibit this behaviour, but at this point I will not buy another 4 GB device. My next iPhone will have 6 GB RAM. As you can see, I tend to keep my iPhones a very long time.

Interestingly, I haven't this behaviour much with my wife's A10 iPad 7th generation which also has 3 GB RAM, but the usage pattern is very different with different apps, and to be honest I just haven't used that iPad that much.

I'm still running a 6S which I think only has 2 GB of RAM. The only hang ups I've noticed are certain websites, but I think it's a lot of crap JavaScript and other cruft more than anything else. That bloat will suck up any amount of memory.

An OS update about a year ago made a noticeable difference, but a lot of updates seemed to fix a lot of that slowdown. I don't run too many apps, so I can't comment on that. I wouldn't be surprised if half of it is just developers only targeting acceptable performance on the newest devices and not caring if performance is crummy on older models

this hasn’t been an issue for a while. this was a problem in earlier iPhones due to a combination of OS updates and battery degradation (from experience, iphone 5s and iphone 6 were both badly affected). my iPhone 8 plus is still running great 3 years on and my iPad 2017 is also doing well even with an A9 from 5 years ago. part of the reason is that the A9 was a big jump from the A8 so anything that’s come since then has been able to keep up with OS updates.

I have an Air 2 and 6S and both are still holding up. I do get occasional odd behavior such as a sudden shutdown at 11% battery which is almost assuredly a sign of aging, but both devices can still last through a day of solid use. My phone is reporting about 80% of max battery which feels a bit optimistic after all these years, but I honestly haven't measured it for myself or really tracked the life over time. It does feel like it's less than what it used to be, but I'm not sure if it feels like 80% or not.

 

[Eug]

I'm still running a 6S which I think only has 2 GB of RAM. The only hang ups I've noticed are certain websites, but I think it's a lot of crap JavaScript and other cruft more than anything else. That bloat will suck up any amount of memory.

An OS update about a year ago made a noticeable difference, but a lot of updates seemed to fix a lot of that slowdown. I don't run too many apps, so I can't comment on that. I wouldn't be surprised if half of it is just developers only targeting acceptable performance on the newest devices and not caring if performance is crummy on older models

You have stated you have noted such hangups. It doesn’t really matter if its the Apple devs or the third party devs, because it still affects you in mainstream usage. Obviously, it is likely those pauses will disappear on an A14 6 GB iPhone.

It’s up to you whether or not the cost to upgrade is worth it to you. For a lot of people the pauses aren’t deal killers. For me it isn’t a deal killer on my 7 Plus either, but the fact the 2020 Max gets a huge camera upgrade is enough for me to upgrade, esp. since I have a big Apple gift card to spend.

 

[Mopetar]

I've had my current phone for 4 years now and while I could probably hold out for another year, there's enough new shiny goodness in the new iPhone that I do feel the upgrade itch taking hold. The design of the device hearkens back to the iPhone 4 which I think was probably the best looking design that Apple ever had for their phones. I've grown to accept that the camera bulge and the area on the front for the cameras and other sensors aren't going away anytime soon so waiting for those to disappear is a fruitless endeavor.

The displays have obviously improved a lot as well. I was in a store last year and was checking out some of the newer phones just to see if I liked anything and even though the 6S had a pretty good display for its time, the quality of even the last generation devices was immediately noticeable. It was like looking at a Plasma compared to an LCD back in the day.

Between 6 GB or RAM and 5G networking, it just seems like a good device that will easily last another 4+ years without needing an upgrade. I'd rather spend a little bit more on something that will last longer and not give me any trouble in the interim.

 

[Eug]

I don’t know if this means anything but Apple has reduced the battery size of the iPhone 12 Pro Max by 7% as compared to the iPhone 11 Pro Max, while keeping battery life specs supposedly the same.

Note though that the 12 Pro Max has both a bigger screen and 5G. OTOH, despite the bigger screen, the overall volume of the 12 Pro Max is actually less, because it’s thinner.

 

[Ajay]

Note though that the 12 Pro Max has both a bigger screen and 5G. OTOH, despite the bigger screen, the overall volume of the 12 Pro Max is actually less, because it’s thinner.

I wish Apple would stop making them thinner. I'd rather have the extra battery life.

 

[Entropyq3]

I wish Apple would stop making them thinner. I'd rather have the extra battery life.

While I agree with increased battery life being a priority, so is reducing weight.
"Thin" doesn't help much with pocket space demands however. Or much of anything. I see that as the legacy of Jony Ive's obsession with a flat pane of glass. (And ports marring the purity of a design.) While I think he did great things at Apple, his perspective was always form over function. Apple has gone far enough (too far) in that direction, and I'm relieved he moved on. Hopefully he is succeeded at Apple by more pragmatic heads, and not devotees that copy his work.

 

[Doug S]

I wish Apple would stop making them thinner. I'd rather have the extra battery life.

You are free to get that, by adding a case that includes some additional battery life and makes your phone thicker and heavier. Those of us who don't want the phone to be heavier to add additional battery capacity we have no use for shouldn't have to pay the penalty for those who do. I charge my 11 pro max every other day - once in a while every third day.

 

[scannall]

You are free to get that, by adding a case that includes some additional battery life and makes your phone thicker and heavier. Those of us who don't want the phone to be heavier to add additional battery capacity we have no use for shouldn't have to pay the penalty for those who do. I charge my 11 pro max every other day - once in a while every third day.

And there are some very nice battery cases. I'm still on an iPhone 7, since it works fine and does everything I need it to. With the battery case I charge it maybe once a week. As long as 10 days between charges.

 

[Ajay]

You are free to get that, by adding a case that includes some additional battery life and makes your phone thicker and heavier. Those of us who don't want the phone to be heavier to add additional battery capacity we have no use for shouldn't have to pay the penalty for those who do. I charge my 11 pro max every other day - once in a while every third day.

Good for you, evidently you don’t stress your phone very much. Why should people who use there phones more be penalized with an oversized case because some have a problem weight? The weight sensitive can just buy a Pro instead of a Pro Max - pretty significant weight loss.

 

[Doug S]

Good for you, evidently you don’t stress your phone very much. Why should people who use there phones more be penalized with an oversized case because some have a problem weight? The weight sensitive can just buy a Pro instead of a Pro Max - pretty significant weight loss.

Because I can't shave off a few mm from a 'max' sized phone to make the battery smaller, while you can add a few mm of battery case to ANY phone to make the battery larger. That's why.

 

[Ajay]

Because I can't shave off a few mm from a 'max' sized phone to make the battery smaller, while you can add a few mm of battery case to ANY phone to make the battery larger. That's why.

Like I said, you could buy a non Max model and save even more weight. I was just opining on my preferences. Anyway, Apple is going in your preferred direction, so no worries.

 

[mikegg]

having owned both ipads and iphones, no matter how fast the cpu is, apple will find a generous way to slow your equipment to molasses within 1-2years. will never buy any apple product again. updates forced on me ruined it all.

Really? I remember my Android phone from 9 years ago that became unable after 1-2 years. I switched back to Apple.

My iPhone 6S lasted for 3 years. Never had a problem. My iPhone XR is 2 years old now and it's still as fast as day 1.

 

[mikegg]

I wish Apple would stop making them thinner. I'd rather have the extra battery life.

I thought the same. Until I got the XR, which is thick and heavy and hurts my pinky when holding it on one hand. It's got more battery life than I need on a daily basis.

My next phone will be the Mini for this reason.

 

[Eug]

A14T Mt. Jade CPU and Lifuka GPU? All 5 nm.

蘋果A15晶片 傳採台積N5P製程 - 財經要聞

蘋果A14及A14X處理器已在台積電採用5奈米製程量產，預期明年會推出新款桌上型電腦A14T處理器及蘋果自行開發繪圖處理器（GPU），同樣採用台積電5奈米製程投片。據供應鏈業者消息，蘋果已著手進行新一代A15系列處理器

www.chinatimes.com

 

[Eug]

Fuel for conjecture?

Lifuka (Apple GPU) is an island that is part of Tonga (A14X).
OTOH, Mt. Jade (A14T), also known as Yushan, is in Taiwan.

 

[awesomedeluxe]

Fuel for conjecture?

Sure, I'll... conject. The A14X is probably a lot like the A12X. Four high perf cores, 7 or 8 GPU cores, and will work in fanless designs. I think pretty much everyone would guess this part exists and is as described.

The A14T is probably the Bloomberg APU. I'll guess 10 GPU cores. It probably goes in every device more powerful than a Macbook Air.

And I'll guess Lifuka is a 10 core slave GPU that works like this. You can throw three of them on there but I think the MBP16 and iMac will only have one. And anything with Lifuka probably gets 8GB of HBM2E.

 

[Doug S]

Sure, I'll... conject. The A14X is probably a lot like the A12X. Four high perf cores, 7 or 8 GPU cores, and will work in fanless designs. I think pretty much everyone would guess this part exists and is as described.

The A14T is probably the Bloomberg APU. I'll guess 10 GPU cores. It probably goes in every device more powerful than a Macbook Air.

And I'll guess Lifuka is a 10 core slave GPU that works like this. You can throw three of them on there but I think the MBP16 and iMac will only have one. And anything with Lifuka probably gets 8GB of HBM2E.

Why would they bother with an external GPU that has only 10 cores? That would be a very small chip in 5nm.

 

[MarkizSchnitzel]

You are free to get that, by adding a case that includes some additional battery life and makes your phone thicker and heavier. Those of us who don't want the phone to be heavier to add additional battery capacity we have no use for shouldn't have to pay the penalty for those who do. I charge my 11 pro max every other day - once in a while every third day.

That is not a comment made in good faith.
A hair like increase in thickness and 10% increase in weight would be significant for battery life, yet almost imperceptible for end users.
There is no possible way that Samsung is that much better in engineering and design then apple (same thickness, 30% less weight, 20%+ battery, similar in hand feel), Apple is doing it on purpose.

 

[Eug]

Why would they bother with an external GPU that has only 10 cores? That would be a very small chip in 5nm.

It would make sense to have different external GPUs for different Macs?

eg. entry-level 29" iMac vs. top-of-the-line 29" iMac.

I'm personally interested in a Mac mini but don't give a damn about the GPU, as long as it supports proper 4K DRM and works with 30-bit 5K monitors, etc. without lag.

 

[insertcarehere]

In-house external GPU on the same cycle as A14? Apple must be very confident in their engineer's abilities to beat out what AMD can offer.

 

[name99]

That is not a comment made in good faith.
A hair like increase in thickness and 10% increase in weight would be significant for battery life, yet almost imperceptible for end users.
There is no possible way that Samsung is that much better in engineering and design then apple (same thickness, 30% less weight, 20%+ battery, similar in hand feel), Apple is doing it on purpose.

Seriously dude?
In the same comment that you accuse someone else of acting in bad faith, you're going to claim that Apple are DELIBERATELY (for god knows what reason) creating iPhones that are not what most people want?
OK, then.

 

[Doug S]

That is not a comment made in good faith.
A hair like increase in thickness and 10% increase in weight would be significant for battery life, yet almost imperceptible for end users.
There is no possible way that Samsung is that much better in engineering and design then apple (same thickness, 30% less weight, 20%+ battery, similar in hand feel), Apple is doing it on purpose.

Check Anandtech's battery life benchmarks - the iPhone 11 beats pretty much all Samsung phones despite having a smaller battery. So tell me again why you think Apple should make EVERYONE'S phone 10% heavier just to serve YOUR needs.

 

[MarkizSchnitzel]

Seriously dude?
In the same comment that you accuse someone else of acting in bad faith, you're going to claim that Apple are DELIBERATELY (for god knows what reason) creating iPhones that are not what most people want?
OK, then.

I did not say that. Apple as a trendsetter certainly has a huge impact on what people want though. And people seem to change their mind and claim that what is provided is what they want, even though until recently they claimed otherwise.
Like, rounded backs, until few weeks ago, they were great, because it makes the phone seem slimmer and more comfortable to grab, more natural feel, blah blah. Now, blocky design is more comfortable.

My issue with apple is that they deliberately postpone updates simply because they can. And this is alright, it's the position they have earned with their success. Still sucks though.

Check Anandtech's battery life benchmarks - the iPhone 11 beats pretty much all Samsung phones despite having a smaller battery. So tell me again why you think Apple should make EVERYONE'S phone 10% heavier just to serve YOUR needs.

I'm not saying they SHOULD. I WISH they did. I wish everybody did.

That being said, I am surprised that with all this vertical integration they are so proud of, they are unable to cram bigger batteries in the same body.
How is it possible that Samsung is able to engineer a phone that is smaller, with a bigger screen, lighter AND with bigger battery? Yes, battery life is even worse there, but this is too be expected, because of inherent inefficiencies of android/hardware.
The reason surely is that they are holding back because.. They can. They keep this ace in the sleeve.

It's the opposite with SOCs. They had a great run these past few years.

 

[mikegg]

How is it possible that Samsung is able to engineer a phone that is smaller, with a bigger screen, lighter AND with bigger battery? Yes, battery life is even worse there, but this is too be expected, because of inherent inefficiencies of android/hardware.
The reason surely is that they are holding back because.. They can. They keep this ace in the sleeve.

Yes, Apple is "holding back" their flagship product because they want to keep an "ace" in their sleeve.

That makes a ton of sense. NOT. What's with these silly conspiracy theories?

The reason Apple doesn't cram huge batteries into their phones is that they determined from data and research that users would rather have other features than a bigger battery.