AP: Sessions to end policy of federal nonintervention in state legal weed

[SlowSpyder]

If Obama had rescheduled MJ, the FIRST thing Trump would've done as president is reschedule it in the worst possible way.

Stick to defending Confederate war statues because we all know you can't tell the difference between MJ and thalidomide you idiot. You seriously are the most wordy dumbass on this forum.

I doubt it, if the market was opened up and flourishing, I don't think Trump would touch it.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

I am aware but mostly wanted to address the idea that the mechanism wouldn't be used to simply reschedule it again.



Not the largest of political barriers AFAIK



Given where MJ is currently scheduled I'm not sure I agree. Also preventing mj research has kind of been a goal of the government so it's easy to fall back on old bad research as justification.



I'm pretty confident Price would have played ball with Sessions on this.

First point, yeah Trump/Sessions could reschedule but the law is a funny thing. If violated then it is up to the courts to settle it, not Congress, not Trump's DOJ.

Violation of the treaty can happen and then the SCOTUS would be forced to recognize that Congress itself has violated the Constitution in violating the treaty. Again we have a matter of standing and that happens when people are harmed improperly.

MJ is on the same schedule as it was back a half century or so ago. At that time there was no scientific use known and the addiction potential then was completely arbitrary. It's not your father's science. I'm not sure what Price you are referring to, but this would be up to the courts to decide after the act.

In any case there was no good reason for this to not be done. Imagine someone saying "well why the fuss over sexual harassment? People are going to do it anyway". Damn poor excuse to not act.

 

[woolfe9998]

I get the idea behind enforcing laws that are in existence, even if I don't like the law. The answer here is to change the law, MJ should not be a scheduled substance. No administration or congress has taken that common sense approach to resolving this silliness.

I don't buy this rationale, of "enforcing the law." The AG can set its enforcement priorities and allocate its resources as it sees fit. Sessions is against legalization of MJ and always has been. This is why he's doing this.

That said, I do agree that Obama should have moved to reschedule. He was a disappointment in that regard.

 

[K1052]

Gardner seems peeved. All he really needs is one other R senator to push for a prohibition in the next funding bill from the DOJ spending any funds on this. Hatch, among a few others, would probably get on board with that

 

[Jhhnn]

I predicted this long before Trump was a thought in the minds of most voters. Instead, people went partisan and defended the Administration especially one apologist made up a whole host of excuses. If cannabis was rescheduled it would be difficult to change it in light of the fact that before a change could be made the actual uses and addictive potential relative to other substances would have to be demonstrated, something very hard to undo, even by Sessions, and millions would have standing then.

The process is that the HHS calls for the latest scientific and medical state of the art information on cannabis. There are two criteria for a drug to be on the C-I list, and one is that there be no recognized medical use. Well, hell, epilepsy to mention only one thing is without doubt appropriately treated by cannabis. The addiction potential exists but it is lower than the opiates/opioids. In my professional estimation (certified NY medical cannabis health professional here among other things) the likely category ought to be C-IV, where most benzodiazepines are. This not only permits wide-ranging research and therapies but the harshest penalties under law both federal and state are for C-I and then C-II.

BTW, the HHS does not have to be the one to instigate this, a request can be made to the HHS sec by the AG who shall (note shall) follow the above procedure. The findings of the HHS and recommendation for rescheduling are binding on the AG who SHALL make the changes. This is not optional. This is not an executive order, this is an act provided for by the Controlled Substances Act. Congress does not have a veto power as they have approved it already under the Act. The CSA was created so we would be compliant with the international treaties on controlled substances and is completely consistent with it.

The only excuse is a lack of moral courage. Obama should have requested this process be implemented in his first term and we would not be having this problem at least as far as the draconian legal penalties and denial of treatment to those in need. Can he ORDER them to do so? No, but Presidents choose those who are of a like mindset and as this is a completely legal and ethical request their denial would be problematic to say the least.

It's perfectly obvious that cannabis will not be legalized at the federal level through administrative means. The bureaucratic thicket is impenetrable. Only ongoing state level legalization will eventually force Congress to act. The issue in the meanwhile has been whether that's an issue of States' Rights, or not. Conservatives' positions stand in stark opposition to their long professed advocacy of States' Rights.

Cannabis has legit uses beyond medical, anyway. It's easily the least harmful intoxicant available, and human beings have sought altered mental states since the stone age. It's only right that it should be legal in a society that allows for other more harmful intoxicants to be sold.

The proof is in the results, obviously, and CO is doing swimmingly with legal cannabis. We made Peace with ourselves over it. We highly recommend that everybody else do the same so we won't have to put up with the nuisance of carpet bagging black market growers & shippers.

 

[theeedude]

Cory Gardner is desperately trying to weasel out of the fact that he voted to confirm Jeff Sessions.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

It's perfectly obvious that cannabis will not be legalized at the federal level through administrative means. The bureaucratic thicket is impenetrable. Only ongoing state level legalization will eventually force Congress to act. The issue in the meanwhile has been whether that's an issue of States' Rights, or not. Conservatives' positions stand in stark opposition to their long professed advocacy of States' Rights.

Cannabis has legit uses beyond medical, anyway. It's easily the least harmful intoxicant available, and human beings have sought altered mental states since the stone age. It's only right that it should be legal in a society that allows for other more harmful intoxicants to be sold.

The proof is in the results, obviously, and CO is doing swimmingly with legal cannabis. We made Peace with ourselves over it. We highly recommend that everybody else do the same so we won't have to put up with the nuisance of carpet bagging black market growers & shippers.

Two issues, one is legalization which no one has the authority to properly do until we withdraw from International Treaty on Controlled Substances because of what Trump hates, the Constitution.

The other is the rescheduling, which allows medical access and research as well as drastically reducing criminal penalties. Those blacks by the tens of thousands in jail for selling a C-I drug on the street? They are there because the law put them there. Someone may say "well it's just MJ", but that is the argument Trump and his people use, effectively "It's only the law or Constitution, it doesn't matter when it's in the way".

Yelling TRUMP!!!!!!!!!!! at prisoners who are held over the last many years is small consolation.

 

[Jhhnn]

I don't buy this rationale, of "enforcing the law." The AG can set its enforcement priorities and allocate its resources as it sees fit. Sessions is against legalization of MJ and always has been. This is why he's doing this.

That said, I do agree that Obama should have moved to reschedule. He was a disappointment in that regard.

Yes, Obama obviously should have wasted a lot of effort on that in the midst of the Great Recession, two foreign wars, the threat of nuclear proliferation & Repub obstructionism.

I mean, WTF planet are you from, anyway?

Presented with the unanticipated opportunity to do the right thing for America he found a way to thread the needle & let it happen w/o making it about him at all. His Admin held the door open for greater legalization. As a result, we're now at the point where we can watch Trump's evil elf piss into the wind. Enjoy.

 

[Zorba]

Mandate the use of the telegraph for all communications?

No, kids like retro and telegraph still doesn't require any real human interactions. I think the best way to further undermine support with young people would to make them actually use a telephone to communicate.

 

[woolfe9998]

Yes, Obama obviously should have wasted a lot of effort on that in the midst of the Great Recession, two foreign wars, the threat of nuclear proliferation & Repub obstructionism.

I mean, WTF planet are you from, anyway?

Presented with the unanticipated opportunity to do the right thing for America he found a way to thread the needle & let it happen w/o making it about him at all. His Admin held the door open for greater legalization. As a result, we're now at the point where we can watch Trump's evil elf piss into the wind. Enjoy.

The Obama admin initially signaled low priority enforcement by way of an executive order. It then went back on it, and instituted a crackdown, resulting in multiple raids of dispensaries here in CA and in other states. Then it reversed itself again and moved back to a policy of low priority enforcement, which is now being reversed by Sessions.

I don't think all those other terrible things going on were a great excuse for not pushing to reschedule, particularly in his second term, after it became clear that polling favored legalization. Obama tried to play it politically safe by being a centrist on the issue rather than taking a stand for what he very likely believed was the right thing. I think it's fair to say that Obama was pretty wishy-washy about the whole thing and could have done better.

 

[Jhhnn]

Two issues, one is legalization which no one has the authority to properly do until we withdraw from International Treaty on Controlled Substances because of what Trump hates, the Constitution.

The other is the rescheduling, which allows medical access and research as well as drastically reducing criminal penalties. Those blacks by the tens of thousands in jail for selling a C-I drug on the street? They are there because the law put them there. Someone may say "well it's just MJ", but that is the argument Trump and his people use, effectively "It's only the law or Constitution, it doesn't matter when it's in the way".

Yelling TRUMP!!!!!!!!!!! at prisoners who are held over the last many years is small consolation.

That's a concern trolling straddle, right?

If Trump can simply announce that we're withdrawing from various treaties it's perfectly obvious that Obama did the same thing in allowing legalization to proceed. We already made a limited withdrawal from anti cannabis provisions of the controlled substances treaty. As a practical concern, it's done & over.

As far as locking people up over cannabis goes, we in CO have done what we could to avoid it & are powerless to dictate to other states. Our representatives would obviously favor federal legalization as well. Less enlightened States need to take responsibility for their own actions.

 

[soulcougher73]

Out of Touch party at it again. They gunna grab our Weedz!!

 

[ch33zw1z]

hide ya babies, the devil weed is coming for ya! anxious? have a drink...

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

That's a concern trolling straddle, right?

If Trump can simply announce that we're withdrawing from various treaties it's perfectly obvious that Obama did the same thing in allowing legalization to proceed. We already made a limited withdrawal from anti cannabis provisions of the controlled substances treaty. As a practical concern, it's done & over.

As far as locking people up over cannabis goes, we in CO have done what we could to avoid it & are powerless to dictate to other states. Our representatives would obviously favor federal legalization as well. Less enlightened States need to take responsibility for their own actions.

Violating a treaty is not withdrawing. You seem to be having trouble with the concept of law and the Constitution. One reason I detest Trumpettes is they will distort and make up things regarding laws and the Constitution and sonova gun you did just that. What Obama did was decide to NOT enforce federal law, which in this universe is legal, but did not change the fundamental issues which we are dealing with now. Among them is the supremacy of the Constitution over state law. Do I need to quote the relevant section of the Constitution? Because you know I can.

From the perspective of the law you are indistinguishable from Trump saying that he commands the DOJ. This is not a matter of states rights because Federal law is supreme in if you disagree I'll remind you that are part of the SUPREME law of the land. You have just given Obama powers that Trump dreams of but does not have.

Don't be a Trumpette.

 

[Zorba]

The Obama admin initially signaled low priority enforcement by way of an executive order. It then went back on it, and instituted a crackdown, resulting in multiple raids of dispensaries here in CA and in other states. Then it reversed itself again and moved back to a policy of low priority enforcement, which is now being reversed by Sessions.

I don't think all those other terrible things going on were a great excuse for not pushing to reschedule, particularly in his second term, after it became clear that polling favored legalization. Obama tried to play it politically safe by being a centrist on the issue rather than taking a stand for what he very likely believed was the right thing. I think it's fair to say that Obama was pretty wishy-washy about the whole thing and could have done better.

While I agree Obama should've pushed for re-scheduling. I am not sure it would've been successful until at least a year after Colorado and Washington legalized (2013 I believe). Remember Nevada had voted down legalization not that long before that. So you would've been looking at ~15 before it would've probably been successful, and I have feeling it was a political decision to not add another wedge issue to the 2016 election. It may have also been a belief the process wouldn't have ran its course by the time the election rolled around, not sure who long the process normally takes.

Its like gay marriage, even though the USSC found the bans unconstitutional, I really don't believe they would've had this finding in 1995 or prior to the majority of the country being pro-gay marriage. So in the case, even though the law is supposed to be based on science, I have a feeling that would tend to break a certain way based on public opinion.

 

[vi edit]

So now there's this...Freedum Caucus is asking for Sessions to step down.

https://www.politico.com/story/2018...freedom-caucus-mark-meadows-jim-jordan-324022

Of course this is Jim "I Hate America" Jordan's way of trying to torpedo the Russia investigation. But the timing is interesting. You have Sessions announce this right after California lights up their legal weed industry. It's a very unpopular move with the 40 and under crowd. So he's hated for that. Then you have the Derp State GOP actively trying to sabotage all things Russia and blaming it on Sessions.

So KK Keebler is a bit of a pickle here. Makes move that is unfavored by one end of political spectrum. Is being hung out to dry by the opposite end. If he steps down amid the pressure that gives way for Trump to appoint a stooge that isn't recused from Russia stuff anymore.

So basically...we're all fucked. YAY!

 

[woolfe9998]

While I agree Obama should've pushed for re-scheduling. I am not sure it would've been successful until at least a year after Colorado and Washington legalized (2013 I believe). Remember Nevada had voted down legalization not that long before that. So you would've been looking at ~15 before it would've probably been successful, and I have feeling it was a political decision to not add another wedge issue to the 2016 election.

Its like gay marriage, even though the USSC found the bans unconstitutional, I really don't believe they would've had this finding in 1995 or prior to the majority of the country being pro-gay marriage. So in the case, even though the law is supposed to be based on science, I have a feeling that would tend to break a certain way based on public opinion.

Which is why I said he should have done it in his second term. With the polling showing strong support for total legalization by then, I doubt a decision to reschedule would have caused the dems any problems in 2016. Perhaps you're correct as to why he didn't do it then, but if so it was a political miscalculation.

 

[Zorba]

So now there's this...Freedum Caucus is asking for Sessions to step down.

https://www.politico.com/story/2018...freedom-caucus-mark-meadows-jim-jordan-324022

Of course this is Jim "I Hate America" Jordan's way of trying to torpedo the Russia investigation. But the timing is interesting. You have Sessions announce this right after California lights up their legal weed industry. It's a very unpopular move with the 40 and under crowd. So he's hated for that. Then you have the Derp State GOP actively trying to sabotage all things Russia and blaming it on Sessions.

So KK Keebler is a bit of a pickle here. Makes move that is unfavored by one end of political spectrum. Is being hung out to dry by the opposite end. If he steps down amid the pressure that gives way for Trump to appoint a stooge that isn't recused from Russia stuff anymore.

So basically...we're all fucked. YAY!

It might be pretty hard to get a stooge AG push through the Senate, now that they could only lose two votes and they've made some enemies.

 

[Sunburn74]

Shouldn't we be blaming Trump? He can stop sessions if he wants and can reschedule.

 

[crashtech]

I can't believe that, in part due to shit like this, I am finding more common cause with Democrats than Republicans these days.

 

[Zorba]

Which is why I said he should have done it in his second term. With the polling showing strong support for total legalization by then, I doubt a decision to reschedule would have caused the dems any problems in 2016. Perhaps you're correct as to why he didn't do it then, but if so it was a political miscalculation.

I just think it would've had to been later in the second term, and then how far in advanced of the election would it have been finalized. I could see it being used as yet another wedge issue, where I doubt any republican would vote dem over it, but old dems might vote republican because of it. Based on everything else Obama did wrt to pot, I just really think it was a political calculation. And like you said, likely a miscalculation.

I do think the next dem president will push for re-scheduling early in their term, but the publican opinion is swinging heavily that way.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

This is just stupid. Do the people in office even represent the people anymore? First net neutrality and now this. And it's not just a Republican problem. A democrat was president for 8 years and never did a thing about it either. And Obama even seemed to be pro legalization if I remember correctly? What a shame.

 

[Jhhnn]

The Obama admin initially signaled low priority enforcement by way of an executive order. It then went back on it, and instituted a crackdown, resulting in multiple raids of dispensaries here in CA and in other states. Then it reversed itself again and moved back to a policy of low priority enforcement, which is now being reversed by Sessions.

I don't think all those other terrible things going on were a great excuse for not pushing to reschedule, particularly in his second term, after it became clear that polling favored legalization. Obama tried to play it politically safe by being a centrist on the issue rather than taking a stand for what he very likely believed was the right thing. I think it's fair to say that Obama was pretty wishy-washy about the whole thing and could have done better.

The Cole memo was issued in August of 2013. Please cite the alleged federal raids on State legal dispensaries after that date. We've had several dispensary raids since then in CO but those guys were far from legal.

You can go on with all this back biting Blame Obama bullshit all you want but it won't change the fact that he did more to advance the cause of legalization by doing nothing than he would have achieved any other way. He didn't re-schedule it- he let us de-schedule it & redefined the argument entirely. He advanced the cause tremendously by framing it as States' Rights. We've been winning ever since.

When other States get sick & tired of wasting their own efforts enforcing pointless laws against their own citizens they'll join us. For now, it's just another one of those irrational things that conservatives believe in & likely one of the first they'll abandon simply because a lot of seniors find comfort in it where they can.

 

[brycejones]

This is just stupid. Do the people in office even represent the people anymore? First net neutrality and now this. And it's not just a Republican problem. A democrat was president for 8 years and never did a thing about it either. And Obama even seemed to be pro legalization if I remember correctly? What a shame.

I don't think this is fair. Obama actually did a lot to move legal weed along and one of the biggest was giving the states space in which to move forward. Its easier to make the argument to end prohibition at the federal level after you been able to show all the hand wringing really isn't valid based on what has happened already at the sate level. There is much more political cover to move forward now than there was 5 years ago.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

Colorado D's wins the internet today.

Colorado Senate Dems‏ @COSenDem


We'll give Jeff Sessions our legal pot when he pries it from our warm, extremely interesting to look at hands.