AP declares Clinton winner of Democratic primary

nageov3t

Lifer
Feb 18, 2004
42,816
83
91
AP declares Clinton winner of Democratic primary

Hillary Clinton has earned enough delegates to become the presumptive Democratic nominee, making her the first woman ever to win a major party nomination, the Associated Press reported on Monday night.

A combination of pledged and superdelegates put Clinton over the mark in her contest against Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders, according to the AP count.

Clinton's historic victory — coming as a surprise, only hours before voters head to the polls on the last multi-state day of the Democratic primary — is likely to be tempered by her opponent Bernie Sanders’ reluctance to bow out of the race.


Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2016/06/ap-declares-clinton-winner-of-democratic-primary-223972

it's a bit anticlimactic, but based on blow-out wins in the US Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico, and heretofore undeclared super delegates coming off the fence in an AP poll today, looks like Hillary passed the magic number a day earlier than she was expected to.
 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Mar 5, 2001
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it's a bit anticlimactic, but based on blow-out wins in the US Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico,
"But, but, but, Bernie has been on a long winning streak, winning one state in a row! As a result, all the Super-delegates are going to change their vote to Bernie. It's not fair! <stomping feet> I want a goose that lays golden eggs and I want it now!"
 

sportage

Lifer
Feb 1, 2008
11,493
3,159
136
BERNIE...
Lets talk about Bernie.

I've been quite aware of Bernie Sanders for a long long time. A long time.
What is fascinating, just recently during this election process have millions of others discovered this Bernie fella ever existed.
His millions of followers probably never caught Bernie on the nightly news shows, mostly always MSNBC, and certainly never on Fox.
They never seen Bernie ranting about the republican agenda vs the progressive agenda.
And FYI, Bernie had been ranting on a regular basis during the ENTIRE GW Bush administration, in case you never noticed.
Another fact Bernie's millions of followers probably had no idea of.

Bernie and Ted Kennedy went hand in hand.
They had the same mindset when it came to helping people, helping the middle class, and sharing outrage over what harm republicans were doing to both.
The reason the millions of Sanders supporters never heard of Bernie, and the reason Bernie was only getting 3% tops in his early polls as a new candidate, was that most people had no clue what Bernie was all about.

Bernie was a strong voice for the middle working class, but his voice was often smothered by others much more in the lime light i.e. Ted Kennedy and Elisabeth Warren.
One had to be a loyal MSNBC fan to ever catch sight of Bernie Sanders or have a clue what Bernie stood for.
Again, Ted Kennedy raised the very same concerns as Bernie, however while Ted attracted all the attention, Bernie was quietly shoved off onto MSNBC.

Once Bernie gained national attention, and that only because Ted Kennedy passed away and Bernie decided to run for president, did the masses discover this unknown guy with the last name of Sanders.
Who is this grumpy cantankerous old man?
And is he actually speaking my concerns? Is he really on my side? Is he saying everything I want to hear from a politician? Wow!
When did this happen?

And thus this do or die love affair developed between presidential candidate Bernie Sanders and millions of followers that had never heard of this guy before.
They began to realize this old man is pretty damn cool.

Well... frankly followers of Bernie, there is very little difference between Hillary Clinton and your Bernie Sanders.
Both are in fact on the same page.
And if you are a young college educated progressive/independent, you should fully understand this.
However... and a BIG however, there is definitely a Grand Canyon width of difference between Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump.

If Sanders supporters fail to get their way with Bernie, which now will be the case, the tragedy for the Sanders folks would be turning against and refusing to support Hillary.
With Hillary as president, students will still be able to live that dream of a college education.
No, it might not be free but your costs will be lessened and your financial burdens affordable under a Clinton administration.

And under a Trump administration?
Forget about your college education or having any hopes of one.
Going to college and graduating strapped with huge amounts of debt will become those good old days of past under a Trump administration.
Under a Trump administration, not only will tuition rise to incredible levels, expect none but for the very few from extremely wealthy parents to have a shot.
Under a Trump administration, tuition will become so costly that no bank, not a single one would take the risk of investing into your educational future.
Unless mommy and daddy are loaded with money, you will have no path.
No bank is ever going to risk or accept the potential loss of lending money to the college hopeful. Not when tuition is sky high, and the ability of the graduate to repay completely unrealistic in the eyes of the bank.
Unless you plan on graduating as a neurosurgeon, no bank will believe you able to repay your loans.
Strapping a student with thousands in debt will no longer be a factor.
No bank will ever give that loan in the first place.
Not under a Trump administration.

So my point for Bernie supporters, those Bernie or bust folks, THINK!
THINK HARD!
As far as Bernie Sanders goes, he is not going to be "The Man".
The man is going to be a lady.
And pissed off as you might be, THINK! Think really hard.
You can have Hillary, which is pretty damn close to having Bernie, or you can have Donald Trump.
And if you chose or enable Donald Trump out of anger and frustration, expect to get screwed.
Screwed as you can't imagine.
A screwing from president Donald Trump that will enable the full republican agenda.
That republican agenda promising every citizen a hard cold painful uneducated future.
And a US Supreme court straight out of medieval times.
The very future envisioned by none other than Paul Ryan, every republican in congress, and your new president Donald John Trump.

So, there you have it.
The difference between Bernie, Hillary, and Donald.
Two of which are very much alike.
One of which is entirely different from the other two.
Can you tell the difference?
You better learn asap, for you own good?
 

Paratus

Lifer
Jun 4, 2004
16,613
13,296
146
I have felt a great disturbance.

As if a million souls suddenly cried out and were silenced because they hunched over their keyboards and began furiously typing. ;)

Well now we have the clusterF of the conventions. I'm sure both will run perfectly smoothly.
 

buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
I have felt a great disturbance.

As if a million souls suddenly cried out and were silenced because they hunched over their keyboards and began furiously typing. ;)

Well now we have the clusterF of the conventions. I'm sure both will run perfectly smoothly.
For the Dems it pretty much is in Bern's hands right now.
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
32,200
14,875
136
I have to wonder though, based on the shift by many people who have abandoned both of the major parties and now consider themselves independents, if Bernie were to have run as an independent from the beginning, would he have had a better chance at the presidency. Would he have been the most viable third party candidate we have seen in decades (like way more so than Ross Perot)?
 

Paratus

Lifer
Jun 4, 2004
16,613
13,296
146
For the Dems it pretty much is in Bern's hands right now.

You know I would think both conventions will go relatively quiet. But with how screwed up this election has been there is asignificant non-zero chance of contested convention shenanigans and possible third party declarations.

I guess we shall see.
 
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Nov 25, 2013
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I have to wonder though, based on the shift by many people who have abandoned both of the major parties and now consider themselves independents, if Bernie were to have run as an independent from the beginning, would he have had a better chance at the presidency. Would he have been the most viable third party candidate we have seen in decades (like way more so than Ross Perot)?

I suspect that the only way the US ever gets a 3rd party president is to actually have a functioning 3rd party.

It strikes me that too many Americans are still in love with the idea that a 'strong man' will come and take care of everything for them (historically Americans do seem to have a predilection for them. You do like your generals :)). But, that's how you get a Trump or a Chavez or a Putin or a Franco. Trump was just lucky enough to have, and smart enough to use, an existing party that was ripe for someone like him in that it already had a core base of stirred up reactionaries who were just waiting for strong daddy to come along and fix things up.
 

buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
You know I would think both conventions will go relatively quiet. But with how screwed up this election has been there is asignificant non-zero chance of contested convention shenanigans and possible third party declarations.

I guess we shall see.
Bernie is promising a contested convention. Will be surprised if he drops out any time soon.
 

tweaker2

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
14,476
6,896
136
I see some wishful thinking on the part of some Trump supporters such that many or most of Bernie's supporters will refuse to vote for Hillary in the general.

Dream on guys, dream on. Not gonna happen. ;)
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,326
6,040
126
I watched a bit of MSNBC tonight and they had a Sanders supporter talking about not giving up, the delegates pledged too early, only Sanders can beat trump, but would not answer the democracy question that the super delegates are voting for the person who got more votes than Sanders has. It was a pretty sad denial of reality. For me, it looks like Clinton wins and I vote for Trump. If Clinton wins I believe in four years the status of money owning our democracy will not have changed. With Trump, who knows, who knows if he won't actually precipitate a revolution. Being rational gets you squat.
 

tweaker2

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
14,476
6,896
136
I watched a bit of MSNBC tonight and they had a Sanders supporter talking about not giving up, the delegates pledged too early, only Sanders can beat trump, but would not answer the democracy question that the super delegates are voting for the person who got more votes than Sanders has. It was a pretty sad denial of reality. For me, it looks like Clinton wins and I vote for Trump. If Clinton wins I believe in four years the status of money owning our democracy will not have changed. With Trump, who knows, who knows if he won't actually precipitate a revolution. Being rational gets you squat.

There's a part of me that would very much like to vote for Trump. It's solely based on the premise that, in a wild ass long shot, he will turn the deeply corrupted establishment old boy network of the very wealthy and their lapdog politicians on its head and proceed to kick their crooked asses until the skinny guy Tiny Tim sings "Tiptoe Through the Tulips" once again.

If after his confirmation he solemnly promises on the very elegant coiffure he so religiously primps and preens to perfection that the very first thing he will do upon being sent to the White House will be to carry out with unswerving diligence the complete dismantling of that house of well heeled self-serving cretins and give control of the gov't to the working class of whom represent the vast majority of the people of America, I'd seriously consider voting for him. ;)
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
1,909
126
How convenient. The AP declares for Clinton the day before the California primary and after Sanders explicitly asked the media to let the process play out.

The superdelegates exist to either protect OR over rule the will of the voters. That is their only function in the process. Despite it being hypocritical and unlikely, a win in California certainly gave Sanders a compelling argument for the weeks leading to the convention.

Sanders has nothing to lose politically and there are members of his inner circle and supporters itching for a fight on the convention floor or willing to entertain a 3rd party run just to spite the Democrat establishment. Many have said that the superdelegates overturning the will of the voters is undemocratic. It is also undemocratic to stack the process against a predetermined outcome and I think its impressive what Sanders was able to accomplish.

Help us Obi Wan Comey, you're our only hope!!!
 
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Raghu

Senior member
Aug 28, 2004
397
1
81
The superdelegates havent voted yet. How can Hilly be nominee already? Maybe AP meant to say - likely to become the nominee.
 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Mar 5, 2001
49,606
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I have to wonder though, based on the shift by many people who have abandoned both of the major parties and now consider themselves independents, if Bernie were to have run as an independent from the beginning, would he have had a better chance at the presidency. Would he have been the most viable third party candidate we have seen in decades (like way more so than Ross Perot)?
Doubtful. He'd have been seen as the loony old guy who was a socialist (not a socialist democrat). His big gain of widespread attention, imho, was when he said, "forget about the damn emails." People took notice of him and thought, "gee, an honest politician concerned with the issues. This is refreshing." And, for a lot of people, that's all it took - just a superficial view of his ideas, and that he was the trustworthy guy.

How convenient. The AP declares for Clinton the day before the California primary and after Sanders explicitly asked the media to let the process play out.
It's the Superbowl. 15 seconds left on the clock. Team A ahead by 16 points. Team A has the ball. Team B has zero time-outs remaining. Are you the guy who says, "Hey, Team B still has a chance! If they fumble the kneel down, and Team B picks up the ball and runs it in, then gets a 2 point conversion. And, kicks on-sides, and recovers and runs it in with time expiring, and scores another 2 point conversion, then... " Yeah, don't be that guy.
 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
45,890
32,677
136
How convenient. The AP declares for Clinton the day before the California primary and after Sanders explicitly asked the media to let the process play out.

The superdelegates exist to either protect OR over rule the will of the voters. That is their only function in the process. Despite it being hypocritical and unlikely, a win in California certainly gave Sanders a compelling argument for the weeks leading to the convention.

Sanders has nothing to lose politically and there are members of his inner circle and supporters itching for a fight on the convention floor or willing to entertain a 3rd party run just to spite the Democrat establishment. Many have said that the superdelegates overturning the will of the voters is undemocratic. It is also undemocratic to stack the process against a predetermined outcome and I think its impressive what Sanders was able to accomplish.

Help us Obi Wan Comey, you're our only hope!!!

Sanders got fewer votes than Clinton. It really is just that simple. The supers are never going to overturn the will of both the party and the voters despite what Sanders has been claiming. He's done and running a spoiler campaign to screw her past this point will only earn him a place in the history books as a bitter angry old man who lost and did so ungracefully instead of as an idealistic champion of the people. Should Clinton choose somebody like Warren for the VP slot she'll probably co-opt enough Sanders supporters to win the general.

It's over. He lost.
 

swamplizard

Senior member
Mar 18, 2016
690
0
16
Good morning,

Let's see how today plays out without counting super-delegates, who are not supposed to pledge until the convention. And, yes I do think there will be massive rallies in both Philly and Cleveland this year. The political revolution has just gotten started and there are those who will pick up the ball and refuse to accept further disenfranchisement.
 
Dec 10, 2005
23,985
6,787
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Good morning,

Let's see how today plays out without counting super-delegates, who are not supposed to pledge until the convention. And, yes I do think there will be massive rallies in both Philly and Cleveland this year. The political revolution has just gotten started and there are those who will pick up the ball and refuse to accept further disenfranchisement.
You're not disenfranchised if you vote and your candidate loses.

And if we're going to play the 'let's not count the super delegates game', then let's stop adding those delegate numbers to the total delegates required to win. Which means that after today, Clinton will have > 50% of the pledged delegates.

All these supposedly angry people, but where are they in the off-year elections? Where are they when voting for their state governments? You can't just vote for the guy who will be at the top and then stop paying attention for 4 years (and later cry about how it didn't turn out how you wanted).
 
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Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
1,909
126
It's the Superbowl. 15 seconds left on the clock. Team A ahead by 16 points. Team A has the ball. Team B has zero time-outs remaining. Are you the guy who says, "Hey, Team B still has a chance! If they fumble the kneel down, and Team B picks up the ball and runs it in, then gets a 2 point conversion. And, kicks on-sides, and recovers and runs it in with time expiring, and scores another 2 point conversion, then... " Yeah, don't be that guy.
You apparently did not see the final seconds of Super Bowl XLIX. Anything can happen before the convention when the superdelegates officially cast their vote.

The democrats are Team A. They will most likely win regardless. So instead of fielding the quarterback that will most likely secure the victory, they instead put in the franchise favorite quarterback because it is his turn to win the big game even though he is facing allegations of doping charges.
 
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werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
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Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2016/06/ap-declares-clinton-winner-of-democratic-primary-223972

it's a bit anticlimactic, but based on blow-out wins in the US Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico, and heretofore undeclared super delegates coming off the fence in an AP poll today, looks like Hillary passed the magic number a day earlier than she was expected to.
Thanks. I wondered what happened in the middle of the night to change things. I had forgotten about those primaries.