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anyone with concrete knowledge here?

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Originally posted by: JohnCU
Originally posted by: Evadman
Originally posted by: JohnCU
wait, it's concrete and not cement?

We can't tell from here 🙂. Are there rocks or other aggregate sticking out of the cracks? And not stuff that just fell in there from another source.

it looks bumpy so i guess so.

hey, maybe some of those old star wars or GI Joe figures you lost back when you were 6 fell in there as well. Should probably check for that.
 
Originally posted by: Evadman
Originally posted by: ironwing
Originally posted by: Evadman
Wow, lots of fail in this thread. Cement != Concrete. Cement is the glue that binds aggragrate (rocks, gravel, sand or other stone) together. Cement + aggragrate = Concrete. No one in their right mind would ever make anything out of cement; it would fail under its own weight. It would be like pouring Elmer's glue into a shape of a driveway and expecting it to hold up your car.

You forgot water man! Without water, cement and aggregate are nothing but rocks and dust.

True. The water causes a exothermic reaction with cement. When the water leaves the concrete is then 'cured' but that can take 30+ days for maximum strength. Up to that point it's just green. After curing, the water isn't 'bound' in the concrete as an ingredient tho. Technically 😛


Actually concrete can cure under water.....so I dont think it needs to evaporate for the curing process.
 
This stuff is the best I've heard of:

http://www.creativestonesystems.com/

They use 3M pebbles with a type of glue ("polymer"), you can get porous or non-porous depending if you want it to drain. iirc they said there can be a shift/crack up to 1-1/4" and it will stretch, so there's plenty of room for expansion, plus they can probably just pop some more pebble mixture in big cracks as needed.
 
Originally posted by: bctbct
Actually concrete can cure under water.....so I dont think it needs to evaporate for the curing process.
True, but that is special concrete. If too much water gets into concrete, any concrete, it will fail quickly. Underwater concrete is designed to keep excess water out of the curing process.
 
Originally posted by: bctbct

Actually concrete can cure under water.....so I dont think it needs to evaporate for the curing process.

It's a reaction between portland cement and water, so concrete doesn't dry. In fact, you have to keep it "moist", which is why you see burlap ontop of fresh sidewalks sometimes. Don't let water pool though, that actually makes the top layer crack and fall apart, thus the exposed aggregate you see on crappily made sidwalks.

And they kinda have made "concrete" that doesn't crack too much. It's called pre-stressed concrete. You make it curl like an upside down "U" before loading it, so it becomes flat when loaded. Absolute genius, except you need the grade-A shit to make it.

It's been said before, but OP could use expansion joints, cut it into sections or repave with something more flexible. Frost-heave from infiltrated water will probably make it worse in the winter.
 
How old is the driveway?

Ultimately the only way to really fix a cracked driveway is to rip it up and pour it right.

you can pour a driveway all together as long as it has control joints. Control joints are usually added to concrete driveways to control where it cracks (good name, eh?). There's a couple ways of doing this, usually either tooling them in while pouring or sawcutting shortly after. sawcutting usually looks a little sharper.

If the driveway has no control joints (no formed or cut lines in it for the whole of the driveway), you probably have a successful lawsuit on your hands. That'd be one stupid contractor, who probably shouldn't be licensed.

If the driveway has control joints but has cracked in other areas as well, that could be due to lots of things - age, trees roots, burrowing animals, soil settling or bad soils that weren't properly dealt with, drainage issues, or crappy concrete. if you do rip it up, make sure to fix any underlying problems as well - which will probably involve a good contractor and / or a soils + structural engineer.






 
Originally posted by: Evadman
Originally posted by: bctbct
Actually concrete can cure under water.....so I dont think it needs to evaporate for the curing process.
True, but that is special concrete. If too much water gets into concrete, any concrete, it will fail quickly. Underwater concrete is designed to keep excess water out of the curing process.


I believe the mix is the same, its the technique that is different. The concrete is filled from the bottom always raising the top that is already in contact with the water. I could be wrong because I have never been involved in that type of project.

 
Originally posted by: WaTaGuMp
Originally posted by: bctbct
Originally posted by: WaTaGuMp
Ok brainiacs, go invent concrete that doesn't crack and you will be very wealthy.


fiber mesh/steel

Tilt ups have that and the panels can still get cracks.

Hairline cracks are never a problem if there is steel reinforcing in non-structural components.. When the cracks separate it begins to turn to rubble and allows large quanitites of water below grade that causes heaving and freeze problems.

Residential crews typically cut corners i.e. not proper thickness, too much water, bad air entrainment etc. They go with a mix that is easy to pour and finish.
 
Originally posted by: Evadman
Originally posted by: ironwing
Originally posted by: Evadman
Wow, lots of fail in this thread. Cement != Concrete. Cement is the glue that binds aggragrate (rocks, gravel, sand or other stone) together. Cement + aggragrate = Concrete. No one in their right mind would ever make anything out of cement; it would fail under its own weight. It would be like pouring Elmer's glue into a shape of a driveway and expecting it to hold up your car.

You forgot water man! Without water, cement and aggregate are nothing but rocks and dust.

True. The water causes a exothermic reaction with cement. When the water leaves the concrete is then 'cured' but that can take 30+ days for maximum strength. Up to that point it's just green. After curing, the water isn't 'bound' in the concrete as an ingredient tho. Technically 😛

Originally posted by: JohnCU
it looks bumpy so i guess so.

Then forget about crack repair, like another poster mentioned, it will just fail again anyway. If the driveway is new, it was probably poured to thin, didn't have enough rebar or tension backup, correct expansion joints, or the ground moved enough to overcome the above remediation points.

If you don't like the cracks, the 'best' alternative is to figure out what the failure point was, then repour the driveway with a solution to that failure point.

Other solutions that I can think of off the top of my head (in the order I would do them) are:
1. Live with them. However, if they are large enough to impede automotive or foot traffic:
2. Pack the cracks with asphalt (it gives with the expansion/contraction of existing concrete)
3. Enlarge and undercut the big cracks, then pour a repair. (4" or wider is needed for good strength)
4. Repour the driveway in a 6" thick slab minimum, adding a heat system because I don't like shoveling snow, and I am not pouring the damn driveway again.

No matter what, the repair will be very visible unless the slab is repoured.

actually concrete never stops curing. Even today the Hoover Dam is continuing to cure out. As it cures, it continues to achieve higher stress limits.


For a residential driveway 5" is sufficient. 4" is even acceptable in many areas. And the drive will typically be reinforced with wire mesh or fiber mesh. Rebar would be overkill.

and just like death and taxes, one thing is certain, CONCRETE WILL CRACK.
 
Concrete cracks...it's the nature of the beast.

No matter what you do, how well you prepare the sub-surface...it's gonna crack.

Expansion joints help to control WHERE it cracks...but it's still gonna crack.


MOST people don't know the difference between cement and concrete...and use the words interchangably.

I've been involved in one way or another, with the placing and finishing of several hundred thousands of cubic yards of concrete over the years...

I H-A-T-E the stuff...
 
I'm not expert at this...

but I think they could have the cracked section cut out, and fill it back in as a separate segment, then lay a more durable asphalt over the top?
 
Originally posted by: bctbct
Originally posted by: Evadman
Originally posted by: bctbct
Actually concrete can cure under water.....so I dont think it needs to evaporate for the curing process.
True, but that is special concrete. If too much water gets into concrete, any concrete, it will fail quickly. Underwater concrete is designed to keep excess water out of the curing process.


I believe the mix is the same, its the technique that is different. The concrete is filled from the bottom always raising the top that is already in contact with the water. I could be wrong because I have never been involved in that type of project.


on maritime construction jobs, we poured thousands of yards of concrete every day.

The mix is "special" only that it's usually a bit "richer" (6 or 7 sacks of portland cement per cubic yard as compared to 4 or 5 for normal concrete)

Pouring concrete underwater isn't particularly difficult, BUT, you can't let it fall...the portland cement will dissapate into the surrounding water and you'll be left with sand and gravel.
For deep pours, we use a "tremie" pipe, which is a long pipe attached to the hose on a concrete pumper and supported by a crane. That allows the concrete to be pumped to the bottom of the pour where it doesn't have to fall a long distance. (you can't let concrete fall very fall out of water either...it "breaks up" and develops bad rock pockets and such that are a PITA to eliminate...usually requiring the concrete be broken out and replaced.)

http://danbrownandassociates.c...al_shaft_049_small.jpg

http://www.adelaide.edu.au/spa...mcs/site/diaphragm.jpg

http://www.ebsaryfoundationco....amdblackpointcombo.jpg
 
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