Anyone watch Ahmadinejad's speech @ Columbia University yesterday?

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moshquerade

No Lifer
Nov 1, 2001
61,504
12
56
Originally posted by: oddyager
I find it curious that the Columbia supporters of his visit were all spouting free speech yet this same school prohibits ROTC, Army, etc from going there to talk?

that was my only problem with this whole thing. it reaked of a double standard.

as for Ahmadinejad, at first i thought the bastard shouldn't even be allowed on our soil, but then i reassessed and realized that hearing his rhetoric and propaganda first hand only strengthened the negative views held of him. it was a good thing.
 

Turin39789

Lifer
Nov 21, 2000
12,218
8
81
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: michaels
Originally posted by: oddyager
I find it curious that the Columbia supporters of his visit were all spouting free speech yet this same school prohibits ROTC, Army, etc from going there to talk? Regardless, bastard's screwed up my morning commutes into Manhattan.

WTF
They prohibit them from recruiting due to their discriminatory hiring practices.

Such as?

They discriminate based on sexual orientation.

There are no gays in Iran or the Army! :p
 

TheNewbie

Senior member
Jul 17, 2007
740
0
0
I'm taking a long shot here, but maybe in Iran if a guy likes to f*** other guys up the *** (or the other way around) its considered standard practice rather than gay?
 

moshquerade

No Lifer
Nov 1, 2001
61,504
12
56
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: michaels
Originally posted by: oddyager
I find it curious that the Columbia supporters of his visit were all spouting free speech yet this same school prohibits ROTC, Army, etc from going there to talk? Regardless, bastard's screwed up my morning commutes into Manhattan.

WTF
They prohibit them from recruiting due to their discriminatory hiring practices.

Such as?

Columbia doesn't like the Army's "don't ask, don't tell" policy, and yet Ahmadinejad is vehemently against homosexuality to the point that he is delusional enough to believe there are no homosexuals in his country. Well, he can't kill them all. They exist in hiding.

If Columbia stifles military recruiters from their campus because of their stance on homosexuality and let's a man speak who has homosexuals killed on sight I don't see where anyone can call this any less than hypocrisy on Columbia University's part.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: michaels
Originally posted by: oddyager
I find it curious that the Columbia supporters of his visit were all spouting free speech yet this same school prohibits ROTC, Army, etc from going there to talk? Regardless, bastard's screwed up my morning commutes into Manhattan.

WTF
They prohibit them from recruiting due to their discriminatory hiring practices.

Such as?

Columbia doesn't like the Army's "don't ask, don't tell" policy, and yet Ahmadinejad is vehemently against homosexuality to the point that he is delusional enough to believe there are no homosexuals in his country. Well, he can't kill them all. They exist in hiding.

If Columbia stifles military recruiters from their campus because of their stance on homosexuality and let's a man speak who has homosexuals killed on sight I don't see where anyone can call this any less than hypocrisy on Columbia University's part.
It would be hypocrisy on Columbia's part if they didn't let Military representives speak which they do. I'm sure they won't allow the Iranian Government to recruit there either because of their homophobic policy.

 

ElFenix

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
102,393
8,552
126
Originally posted by: Vonkhan
There's a war in his backyard and you expect him to do nothing? ... esp. after the US's role in establishing a dictatorship in Iran in the first place

Grow up
if anyone put reza shah in power it was the british. his son was put in power by brits and the soviets (for fear that the father would align himself with nazi germany). iran had basically been an absolute monarchy since 1501, 275 years before the declaration of independence. so i'm not sure how you could claim that US americans established the dictatorship in iran.
 

mugs

Lifer
Apr 29, 2003
48,920
46
91
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: michaels
Originally posted by: oddyager
I find it curious that the Columbia supporters of his visit were all spouting free speech yet this same school prohibits ROTC, Army, etc from going there to talk? Regardless, bastard's screwed up my morning commutes into Manhattan.

WTF
They prohibit them from recruiting due to their discriminatory hiring practices.

Such as?

Columbia doesn't like the Army's "don't ask, don't tell" policy, and yet Ahmadinejad is vehemently against homosexuality to the point that he is delusional enough to believe there are no homosexuals in his country. Well, he can't kill them all. They exist in hiding.

If Columbia stifles military recruiters from their campus because of their stance on homosexuality and let's a man speak who has homosexuals killed on sight I don't see where anyone can call this any less than hypocrisy on Columbia University's part.

If Columbia prohibited anyone from the military from SPEAKING on campus, or if they allowed Ahmadinejad to RECRUIT on campus, then you'd have a point. Do they do either of those things?

Edit: I must have opened this tab a long time ago, because Red Dawn beat me to the obvious by over an hour :eek:
 

JS80

Lifer
Oct 24, 2005
26,271
7
81
Originally posted by: oddyager
I find it curious that the Columbia supporters of his visit were all spouting free speech yet this same school prohibits ROTC, Army, etc from going there to talk? Regardless, bastard's screwed up my morning commutes into Manhattan.

They have it backwards, they think it means freedom to be [forced] heard. He can speak whatever he wants, but the constitution does not guarantee him being heard. Not surprising coming from leftists.
 

Vonkhan

Diamond Member
Feb 27, 2003
8,198
0
71
Originally posted by: ElFenix
Originally posted by: Vonkhan
There's a war in his backyard and you expect him to do nothing? ... esp. after the US's role in establishing a dictatorship in Iran in the first place

Grow up
if anyone put reza shah in power it was the british. his son was put in power by brits and the soviets (for fear that the father would align himself with nazi germany). iran had basically been an absolute monarchy since 1501, 275 years before the declaration of independence. so i'm not sure how you could claim that US americans established the dictatorship in iran.

As of now, Iran is a democracy. I was refering to the below ...

From wiki:

Under the direction of Kermit Roosevelt, Jr., a senior CIA officer and grandson of the former U.S. President Theodore Roosevelt, the CIA and British intelligence funded and led a covert operation to depose Mossadegh with the help of military forces loyal to the Shah, known as Operation Ajax.[3] The plot hinged on orders signed by the Shah to dismiss Mossadegh as prime minister and replace him with General Fazlollah Zahedi, a choice agreed on by the British and Americans. Despite the high-level coordination and planning, the coup initially failed, causing the Shah to flee to Baghdad, later leaving for Rome. After a brief exile in Italy, the Shah returned to Iran, this time through a successful counter-coup. The deposed Mossadegh was arrested, given a show trial, and condemned to death.[citation needed] The Shah commuted this sentence to solitary confinement for three years in a military prison, followed by house arrest for life.[citation needed] Zahedi was installed to succeed Prime Minister Mossadegh.

The American Embassy in Tehran was reporting that Mossadegh had near total support from the nation and was unlikely to fall. The prime minister asked Majles to give him direct control of the army. Given the situation, alongside the strong personal support of Eden and Churchill for covert action, the American government gave a go-ahead to a committee, attended by the Secretary of State, John Foster Dulles, Allen Dulles, Kermit Roosevelt, Ambassador Henderson, and Secretary of Defense Charles Wilson. Kermit Roosevelt returned to Iran on July 13 and on August 1 in his first meeting with the shah. A car picked him up in the midnight and drove him to the palace. He lay down on the seat and covered himself with a blanket as guards waved his driver through the gates. The shah got into the car and Roosevelt explained the mission. The CIA provided $1 million in Iranian currency, which Roosevelt had stored in a large safe, a bulky cache given the exchange rate 1000 rial = 15 dollars at the time. [4].



The Communists staged massive demonstrations to hijack the prime minister?s initiatives. The United States had announced its total lack of confidence in him; and his followers were drifting to indifference. On August 16, 1953, the right wing of the Army reacted. Armed with an order by the shah, appointing General Fazlollah Zahedi as prime minister, a coalition of mobs and retired officers close to the Palace, attempting what could be counted as a coup d?etat. They failed dismally. The shah fled the country in an humiliating haste. Even Ettelaat, the nation?s largest daily newspaper, and its pro-shah publisher Abbas Masudi, published negative commentaries on the shah [5].

In the following two days the Communists turned against Mossadegh. They roamed Tehran raising red flags and pulling down statues of Reza Shah. This frightened the conservative clergies like Kashani and National Front leaders like Makki, who sided with the shah. On August 18, Mossadegh hit back. Tudeh Partisans were clubbed to be dispersed[6].

Tudeh had no choice but to accept the defeat. In the meantime, according to the CIA plot, Zahedi appealed to the military, and claimed to be the legitimate prime minister and charged Mossadegh with staging a coup by ignoring the shah?s decree. Zahedi?s son Ardeshir acted as the go-between for the CIA and his father. On August 19th the thugs organized with $100,000 of the CIA funds finally appeared, marched out of south Tehran into the city center, other mobs joined in. Gang with clubs, knives, and rocks controlled the street overturning Tudeh trucks and beating up anti-shah activists. As Roosevelt was congratulating Zahedi in the basement of his hiding place the new prime minister?s mobs burst in and carried him upstairs on their shoulders. That evening Ambassador Henderson suggested to Ardashir that Mossadegh not be harmed. Roosevelt furnished Zahedi with $900,000 left from the operation Ajax funds. The shah returned to power, but never extended the elitism of the court to the technocrats and intellectuals who emerged from Iranian and Western universities. Indeed, his system irritated the new classes, for they were barred from partaking in real power. [7]
 

FeuerFrei

Diamond Member
Mar 30, 2005
9,144
929
126
Yes, it's kind of funny that he'd categorically deny that any homosexuals exist in Iran. How can anyone know these things?

However, if what he says is true, I have to give him props for having a country devoid of homosexuality. One of the only things Iran has going for it.
 

moshquerade

No Lifer
Nov 1, 2001
61,504
12
56
Originally posted by: mugs
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: michaels
Originally posted by: oddyager
I find it curious that the Columbia supporters of his visit were all spouting free speech yet this same school prohibits ROTC, Army, etc from going there to talk? Regardless, bastard's screwed up my morning commutes into Manhattan.

WTF
They prohibit them from recruiting due to their discriminatory hiring practices.

Such as?

Columbia doesn't like the Army's "don't ask, don't tell" policy, and yet Ahmadinejad is vehemently against homosexuality to the point that he is delusional enough to believe there are no homosexuals in his country. Well, he can't kill them all. They exist in hiding.

If Columbia stifles military recruiters from their campus because of their stance on homosexuality and let's a man speak who has homosexuals killed on sight I don't see where anyone can call this any less than hypocrisy on Columbia University's part.

If Columbia prohibited anyone from the military from SPEAKING on campus, or if they allowed Ahmadinejad to RECRUIT on campus, then you'd have a point. Do they do either of those things?

Edit: I must have opened this tab a long time ago, because Red Dawn beat me to the obvious by over an hour :eek:

I am speaking of the ROTC. From what I have read (many sources confirmed) Columbia has not let the ROTC on campus since 1969 because it considers it a discriminatory group because of its policies toward gay individuals.

Is Ahmadinejad not discriminatory against gay individuals?

My point isn't that hard to comprehend.
 

moshquerade

No Lifer
Nov 1, 2001
61,504
12
56
Originally posted by: FeuerFrei
Yes, it's kind of funny that he'd categorically deny that any homosexuals exist in Iran. How can anyone know these things?

However, if what he says is true, I have to give him props for having a country devoid of homosexuality. One of the only things Iran has going for it.

:confused:

I do hope you are kidding.
 

Turin39789

Lifer
Nov 21, 2000
12,218
8
81
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: mugs
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: michaels
Originally posted by: oddyager
I find it curious that the Columbia supporters of his visit were all spouting free speech yet this same school prohibits ROTC, Army, etc from going there to talk? Regardless, bastard's screwed up my morning commutes into Manhattan.

WTF
They prohibit them from recruiting due to their discriminatory hiring practices.

Such as?

Columbia doesn't like the Army's "don't ask, don't tell" policy, and yet Ahmadinejad is vehemently against homosexuality to the point that he is delusional enough to believe there are no homosexuals in his country. Well, he can't kill them all. They exist in hiding.

If Columbia stifles military recruiters from their campus because of their stance on homosexuality and let's a man speak who has homosexuals killed on sight I don't see where anyone can call this any less than hypocrisy on Columbia University's part.

If Columbia prohibited anyone from the military from SPEAKING on campus, or if they allowed Ahmadinejad to RECRUIT on campus, then you'd have a point. Do they do either of those things?

Edit: I must have opened this tab a long time ago, because Red Dawn beat me to the obvious by over an hour :eek:

I am speaking of the ROTC. From what I have read (many sources confirmed) Columbia has not let the ROTC on campus since 1969 because it considers it a discriminatory group because of its policies toward gay individuals.

Is Ahmadinejad not discriminatory against gay individuals?

My point isn't that hard to comprehend.



The ROTC is a recruitment program. I do not believe that Ahmadinejad was recruiting followers at Columbia.


 

moshquerade

No Lifer
Nov 1, 2001
61,504
12
56
Originally posted by: Turin39789
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: mugs
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: michaels
Originally posted by: oddyager
I find it curious that the Columbia supporters of his visit were all spouting free speech yet this same school prohibits ROTC, Army, etc from going there to talk? Regardless, bastard's screwed up my morning commutes into Manhattan.

WTF
They prohibit them from recruiting due to their discriminatory hiring practices.

Such as?

Columbia doesn't like the Army's "don't ask, don't tell" policy, and yet Ahmadinejad is vehemently against homosexuality to the point that he is delusional enough to believe there are no homosexuals in his country. Well, he can't kill them all. They exist in hiding.

If Columbia stifles military recruiters from their campus because of their stance on homosexuality and let's a man speak who has homosexuals killed on sight I don't see where anyone can call this any less than hypocrisy on Columbia University's part.

If Columbia prohibited anyone from the military from SPEAKING on campus, or if they allowed Ahmadinejad to RECRUIT on campus, then you'd have a point. Do they do either of those things?

Edit: I must have opened this tab a long time ago, because Red Dawn beat me to the obvious by over an hour :eek:

I am speaking of the ROTC. From what I have read (many sources confirmed) Columbia has not let the ROTC on campus since 1969 because it considers it a discriminatory group because of its policies toward gay individuals.

Is Ahmadinejad not discriminatory against gay individuals?

My point isn't that hard to comprehend.



The ROTC is a recruitment program. I do not believe that Ahmadinejad was recruiting followers at Columbia.
are you so sure of that?
 

Turin39789

Lifer
Nov 21, 2000
12,218
8
81
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Turin39789
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: mugs
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: michaels
Originally posted by: oddyager
I find it curious that the Columbia supporters of his visit were all spouting free speech yet this same school prohibits ROTC, Army, etc from going there to talk? Regardless, bastard's screwed up my morning commutes into Manhattan.

WTF
They prohibit them from recruiting due to their discriminatory hiring practices.

Such as?

Columbia doesn't like the Army's "don't ask, don't tell" policy, and yet Ahmadinejad is vehemently against homosexuality to the point that he is delusional enough to believe there are no homosexuals in his country. Well, he can't kill them all. They exist in hiding.

If Columbia stifles military recruiters from their campus because of their stance on homosexuality and let's a man speak who has homosexuals killed on sight I don't see where anyone can call this any less than hypocrisy on Columbia University's part.

If Columbia prohibited anyone from the military from SPEAKING on campus, or if they allowed Ahmadinejad to RECRUIT on campus, then you'd have a point. Do they do either of those things?

Edit: I must have opened this tab a long time ago, because Red Dawn beat me to the obvious by over an hour :eek:

I am speaking of the ROTC. From what I have read (many sources confirmed) Columbia has not let the ROTC on campus since 1969 because it considers it a discriminatory group because of its policies toward gay individuals.

Is Ahmadinejad not discriminatory against gay individuals?

My point isn't that hard to comprehend.



The ROTC is a recruitment program. I do not believe that Ahmadinejad was recruiting followers at Columbia.
are you so sure of that?



Which sentence are you referring to?
 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
51,943
44,805
136
Originally posted by: FeuerFrei
Yes, it's kind of funny that he'd categorically deny that any homosexuals exist in Iran. How can anyone know these things?

However, if what he says is true, I have to give him props for having a country devoid of homosexuality. One of the only things Iran has going for it.

Yea, no danger of catching the gay over there.
 

moshquerade

No Lifer
Nov 1, 2001
61,504
12
56
Originally posted by: Turin39789
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Turin39789
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: mugs
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: michaels
Originally posted by: oddyager
I find it curious that the Columbia supporters of his visit were all spouting free speech yet this same school prohibits ROTC, Army, etc from going there to talk? Regardless, bastard's screwed up my morning commutes into Manhattan.

WTF
They prohibit them from recruiting due to their discriminatory hiring practices.

Such as?

Columbia doesn't like the Army's "don't ask, don't tell" policy, and yet Ahmadinejad is vehemently against homosexuality to the point that he is delusional enough to believe there are no homosexuals in his country. Well, he can't kill them all. They exist in hiding.

If Columbia stifles military recruiters from their campus because of their stance on homosexuality and let's a man speak who has homosexuals killed on sight I don't see where anyone can call this any less than hypocrisy on Columbia University's part.

If Columbia prohibited anyone from the military from SPEAKING on campus, or if they allowed Ahmadinejad to RECRUIT on campus, then you'd have a point. Do they do either of those things?

Edit: I must have opened this tab a long time ago, because Red Dawn beat me to the obvious by over an hour :eek:

I am speaking of the ROTC. From what I have read (many sources confirmed) Columbia has not let the ROTC on campus since 1969 because it considers it a discriminatory group because of its policies toward gay individuals.

Is Ahmadinejad not discriminatory against gay individuals?

My point isn't that hard to comprehend.



The ROTC is a recruitment program. I do not believe that Ahmadinejad was recruiting followers at Columbia.
are you so sure of that?



Which sentence are you referring to?

the second.

 

Turin39789

Lifer
Nov 21, 2000
12,218
8
81
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Turin39789



Which sentence are you referring to?

the second.


I certainly do not consider his visit a recruiting program and I am certain that the decision makers at Columbia also did not consider it a recruiting visit.

I can't say 100% that some nutjob wasn't positively influenced by it. I also can't be sure that the purpose of his visit wasn't to steal pens and notebooks.

I don't pretend to be able to understand the motivations religous fanatics, but I do believe it rational to consider his visit fundamentally different than that of a ROTC program.


*edit - nesting shortened
 

imported_Tango

Golden Member
Mar 8, 2005
1,623
0
0
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: oddyager
I find it curious that the Columbia supporters of his visit were all spouting free speech yet this same school prohibits ROTC, Army, etc from going there to talk?

that was my only problem with this whole thing. it reaked of a double standard.

as for Ahmadinejad, at first i thought the bastard shouldn't even be allowed on our soil, but then i reassessed and realized that hearing his rhetoric and propaganda first hand only strengthened the negative views held of him. it was a good thing.

You can't. He's obviously covered by diplomatic immunity, being the president of a sovereign country.
 

moshquerade

No Lifer
Nov 1, 2001
61,504
12
56
Originally posted by: Turin39789
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Turin39789



Which sentence are you referring to?

the second.


I certainly do not consider his visit a recruiting program and I am certain that the decision makers at Columbia also did not consider it a recruiting visit.

I can't say 100% that some nutjob wasn't positively influenced by it. I also can't be sure that the purpose of his visit wasn't to steal pens and notebooks.

I don't pretend to be able to understand the motivations religous fanatics, but I do believe it rational to consider his visit fundamentally different than that of a ROTC program.


*edit - nesting shortened
you can consider all you wish, but i still maintain that not allowing one group on campus because of their views on homosexuality and allowing another with even more radical views about the same group isn't being consistent.
 

imported_Tango

Golden Member
Mar 8, 2005
1,623
0
0
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Turin39789
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Turin39789



Which sentence are you referring to?

the second.


I certainly do not consider his visit a recruiting program and I am certain that the decision makers at Columbia also did not consider it a recruiting visit.

I can't say 100% that some nutjob wasn't positively influenced by it. I also can't be sure that the purpose of his visit wasn't to steal pens and notebooks.

I don't pretend to be able to understand the motivations religous fanatics, but I do believe it rational to consider his visit fundamentally different than that of a ROTC program.


*edit - nesting shortened
you can consider all you wish, but i still maintain that not allowing one group on campus because of their views on homosexuality and allowing another with even more radical views about the same group isn't being consistent.

Columbia has the (right in my opinion) policy of not allowing hiring sessions on campus if the company/organization doesn't follow equal opportunity policies. The ROTC doesn't, thus is not allowed to have hiring sessions on campus.

Columbia University do invite many members of the army for speeches. They just cannot recruit.

Iran president Ahmadinejad was not on campus to recruit people.

Don't you see what's the point?

You want to recruit ------> you need to follow equal opportunity rules.
You want to speak -------> You can be just any kind of asshole.
 

ElFenix

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
102,393
8,552
126
Originally posted by: Vonkhan
Originally posted by: ElFenix
Originally posted by: Vonkhan
There's a war in his backyard and you expect him to do nothing? ... esp. after the US's role in establishing a dictatorship in Iran in the first place

Grow up
if anyone put reza shah in power it was the british. his son was put in power by brits and the soviets (for fear that the father would align himself with nazi germany). iran had basically been an absolute monarchy since 1501, 275 years before the declaration of independence. so i'm not sure how you could claim that US americans established the dictatorship in iran.

As of now, Iran is a democracy. I was refering to the below ...

From wiki:<snip>
i find your first statement, that iran is a democracy, to be laughable.

as for your giant wikipedia quote, it doesn't support your claim that the pahlavi's were put into power by the US americans. they were already in power by the time the americans showed up. it really just shows american incompetence in interfering in the internal affairs of other countries by describing how the shah had to flee. and, again, apart from a brief period in the early 1900s, persia and then iran had been an absolute monarchy, from the safavids through the pahlavis.
 

sadguy

Member
Jun 27, 2005
157
0
0
Originally posted by: destrekor
Originally posted by: sadguy
Originally posted by: michaels
I can't believe they let this ***** speak there. This bastard has people freakin stoned, hung and everything else you can imagine. And to top it off this ass is engaged in a war by proxy with us by supplying weapons and possible more to insurgents in Iraq.

Where's the proof of supplying weapons to insurgents?

He also questioned 9/11. More leaders around the world should do so.

shut the hell up troll.
take it to P&N

You sthu first. Where's the proof of supplying weapons to insurgents? Seems like it's the "WMD" propoganda all over again. Accusations with zero proof.