Anyone else utterly disappointed at nForce2 mobos?

[OverclockTHIS]

Great round up by Evan Lieb by the way.

Secondly, I was disappointed to learn that most companies haven't incorported the PCI lock on their boards - apart
from Asus...what are these companies thinking? Why are they jerking off? How long has it been since the AGP/PCI lock capabilities on the Intel side of things? Why are these companies screwing with AMD? How are people going to run the 200mhz Barton core in the future - without overclocking the PCI bus(excluding the A7N8x)?

Screw this - next year I'm getting an Intel...AMD had a good run, but too many companies are sitting on their asses not doing much anyway...

 

[mechBgon]

Remember that a BIOS update was required for KT333 boards to support 333MHz-bus AthlonXP's. When the time comes for 400MHz-bus Bartons, the board makers may release BIOS'es as needed. And it hasn't been very long since Intel implemented their own AGP/PCI lock, if you hadn't noticed. i845E and i845G are the first I remember hearing about it.

Maybe I'll add that a chipset that can wring as much as another 10%-15% of performance out of the same CPU, compared to its finest KT333 and KT400 competition, is hardly cause for "utter disappointment" in my book

 

[The Sauce]

Anyone else utterly disappointed at nForce2 mobos?

Nope. I got the ASUS board and LUV-IT!

 

[OverclockTHIS]

Originally posted by: mechBgon
Remember that a BIOS update was required for KT333 boards to support 333MHz-bus AthlonXP's. When the time comes for 400MHz-bus Bartons, the board makers may release BIOS'es as needed. And it hasn't been very long since Intel implemented their own AGP/PCI lock, if you hadn't noticed. i845E and i845G are the first I remember hearing about it.

Maybe I'll add that a chipset that can wring as much as another 10%-15% of performance out of the same CPU, compared to its finest KT333 and KT400 competition, is hardly cause for "utter disappointment" in my book

Don't tell me about Bios updates...and use your brain...KT333 chipset is capable of 1/5th divider ...that equals to 166mhz with everthing on the AGP and PCI running at default specs...same with KT400...it has a 1/5th divider...hence no official DDR 400 support...I'm sure KT400a will have a 1/6th divider or a PCI locking capablities.


I still say apart from Asus, all the other companies suck ass at desingning AMD motherboards...maybe YOU like data corruption and PCI cards interfering with the full enjoyment of trouble free overclocking...I certainly don't.

 

[mechBgon]

Fine, get KT400A then. I don't see why you are objecting to updating the BIOS as new CPUs come out, however. Think about it. You point out the KT333's 1/5 divider? Well, on my Asus A7V333-RAID, that was not present until BIOS revision 1011 or thereabouts. If you had an A7V333-R from before then, what would you do... go out and buy a new board, or update your BIOS? Someone's not using their brain, but I'm not sure it's me.

 

[compudog]

My Asus A7N8X rocks! I think the nForce is certainly proof that there is fantastic potential in the AMD line of CPU's and Intel needs to remain on their toes. If a feature is needed in the community, the manufacturers add it.

 

[KGB1]

Utterly dissappointed? WTH man.. Nforce was created for the sole reason to run a CPU in a computer.... What you think its going to create world peace? Get your a car loan? or maybe even help you out with the ladies. What are you talking about?

I for one LOVE IT. I finally decided on the Epox one WITH Graphics core. I'm usually lazy about graphics cards and don't want to be bothered with it. I'd rather use the GPU included in the system. Great, and no "compatability" issues. 1 less problem to deal with. Plus the 200 FSB (epox supports PCI AGP lock... with a BIOS update when Barton is released) is more than sufficient to feed both CPU and GPU. Whatever VIA dishes out next I don't care. KT400A.... they should have released that instead of giving people the Bull KT400. WHy waste a companies resources when you have a better product waiting at their heels. SiS is out of the Question.. were supposed to be seeing the 746DX by now and NOTHING. I thought maybe SiS might do as they promised, but they havent changed. And their 648 chipset is not as stable and wonderful as they might make it seem.

nVidia really should be commended on what they've accomplished. On the chipset market they've really picked up the pace (much less can be said about their graphic card side )

 

[OverclockTHIS]

Hey, Ace...did I say anything bad about the nForce2 chipset? NO! Read again, fool.

Secondly, I'm dissapointed at the overclocking features of 99% of the nForce2 motherboard manufacturers - APART FROM ASUS AS THEY ARE THE ONLY ONES WHO HAVE IMPLEMENTED THE PCI LOCK FOR THE MOST TROUBLE FREE/ NO DATA CORRUPTION OVERCLOCKING.

Epox might have all the fancy voltage settings, but it won't do you jack shyt if your hard-drive craps out on you and you lose all the data because of a high PCI bus.

Asus is the only way to go for an AMD system...the rest of the companies are crap and can go straight to hell for all I care.

Originally posted by: KGB
Utterly dissappointed? WTH man.. Nforce was created for the sole reason to run a CPU in a computer.... What you think its going to create world peace? Get your a car loan? or maybe even help you out with the ladies. What are you talking about?

I for one LOVE IT. I finally decided on the Epox one WITH Graphics core. I'm usually lazy about graphics cards and don't want to be bothered with it. I'd rather use the GPU included in the system. Great, and no "compatability" issues. 1 less problem to deal with. Plus the 200 FSB (epox supports PCI AGP lock... with a BIOS update when Barton is released) is more than sufficient to feed both CPU and GPU. Whatever VIA dishes out next I don't care. KT400A.... they should have released that instead of giving people the Bull KT400. WHy waste a companies resources when you have a better product waiting at their heels. SiS is out of the Question.. were supposed to be seeing the 746DX by now and NOTHING. I thought maybe SiS might do as they promised, but they havent changed. And their 648 chipset is not as stable and wonderful as they might make it seem.

nVidia really should be commended on what they've accomplished. On the chipset market they've really picked up the pace (much less can be said about their graphic card side )

 

[KGB1]

Well overclock this, I think I made myself clear when Epox has AGP and PCI lock feature too. So Epox is the real winner in my book.

1 being Why is ASUS implementing Serial Ata onboard when I can buy a perfectly good PCI card for it down the road WHEN i NEED it.

Asus reliability to me has been shot, its down hill mostly to me. (itexcept the PT533... that RDRAM is a real motherchucker.. I'm telling you no DDR will beat ..)
I
'm going into more Tyan and Iwill territory these days. I dont care much about overclocking as much. SNDS (Sudden Northwood Death Syndrome) but thats another matter.

 

[UsandThem]

APART FROM ASUS AS THEY ARE THE ONLY ONES WHO HAVE IMPLEMENTED THE PCI LOCK FOR THE MOST TROUBLE FREE/ NO DATA CORRUPTION OVERCLOCKING.

I think we already got that point

Asus is the only way to go for an AMD system...the rest of the companies are crap and can go straight to hell for all I care.

I'm sure they will all do that just for you

maybe YOU like data corruption and PCI cards interfering with the full enjoyment of trouble free overclocking...I certainly don't.

I think I would sacrifice overclocking if it was causing date corruption. Overclockers are such a small percentage of the people who buy hardware, it is always nice to get extra performance for free, but I would take a 3% peformance loss to keep stability.

Lastly, you sound a little freaked out and wired about this subject. It is just a freaking motherboard, it is not the end of the world.

 

[OverclockTHIS]

Originally posted by: KGB
Well overclock this, I think I made myself clear when Epox has AGP and PCI lock feature too. So Epox is the real winner in my book.

1 being Why is ASUS implementing Serial Ata onboard when I can buy a perfectly good PCI card for it down the road WHEN i NEED it.

Asus reliability to me has been shot, its down hill mostly to me. (itexcept the PT533... that RDRAM is a real motherchucker.. I'm telling you no DDR will beat ..)
I
'm going into more Tyan and Iwill territory these days. I dont care much about overclocking as much. SNDS (Sudden Northwood Death Syndrome) but thats another matter.

Ok...well if thats a fact, then I'll go as far as saying that Asus and Epox has the best solution out right now for AMD.

 

[OverclockTHIS]

Originally posted by: antiABIT

APART FROM ASUS AS THEY ARE THE ONLY ONES WHO HAVE IMPLEMENTED THE PCI LOCK FOR THE MOST TROUBLE FREE/ NO DATA CORRUPTION OVERCLOCKING.

I think we already got that point

Asus is the only way to go for an AMD system...the rest of the companies are crap and can go straight to hell for all I care.

I'm sure they will all do that just for you

maybe YOU like data corruption and PCI cards interfering with the full enjoyment of trouble free overclocking...I certainly don't.

I think I would sacrifice overclocking if it was causing date corruption. Overclockers are such a small percentage of the people who buy hardware, it is always nice to get extra performance for free, but I would take a 3% peformance loss to keep stability.

Lastly, you sound a little freaked out and wired about this subject. It is just a freaking motherboard, it is not the end of the world.

The only reason why one would want to buy an nForce2 would be for the free overclocking without stressing the rest of the components on the system. You don't know what the hell you are talking about. Its not the end of the world, but learning about the fact that most of the manufacturers have done a poor job of implementing the nForce2 chipset properly is a total shame. Is it too hard to sink in? Lots of newbies around this forum. If a chipset doesn't rely on clock dividers like the Kt333/Kt400, why not fully uitilize this feature and incorporate this into the motherboard - like Asus and Epox?

An ignorant newbie - the most irritating turds on the planet.

 

[UsandThem]

An ignorant newbie - the most irritating turds on the planet

This coming from somebody who has been registered since November 2002.

The only reason why one would want to buy an nForce2 would be for the free overclocking without stressing the rest of the components on the system. You don't know what the hell you are talking about

I do know "what the hell I am talking about". The rest of my comments for you I will not post as I do not want to get into some flame war with some little snot nosed "know it all" and get a vacation, because what I really want to tell you will get me that

:|

 

[Odeen]

Originally posted by: mechBgon
Remember that a BIOS update was required for KT333 boards to support 333MHz-bus AthlonXP's. When the time comes for 400MHz-bus Bartons, the board makers may release BIOS'es as needed. And it hasn't been very long since Intel implemented their own AGP/PCI lock, if you hadn't noticed. i845E and i845G are the first I remember hearing about it.

Maybe I'll add that a chipset that can wring as much as another 10%-15% of performance out of the same CPU, compared to its finest KT333 and KT400 competition, is hardly cause for "utter disappointment" in my book

Actually, the Abit BD7, an i845D board has PCI lock, if I recall. Besides, PCI lock has not been an issue until recently, when FSB's skyrocketed and a /4 divider ceased being enough, like it was in the heady days of the 500E, never mind the 300A / 366A. With high speed DDR memory, and 133mhz stock FSB's, there just isn't room to overclock like there is with a lower FSB processor unless other devices are kept in check.

Honestly, I'd prefer the honest-to-goodness dividers, a /5 for 166mhz, /6 for 200mhz FSB. Otherwise, I fear that the latencies produce a performance hit.

Besides, to quote the Underwear Gnomes, "10-15% performance - big business!" Just look at the difference in prices between a P4 2.8 and a 3.06 - $333 for less than 10% speed boost. Difference between a 1.93ghz Athlon and a 2.17ghz one - $149 for about 15%.

 

[yodayoda]

Secondly, I'm dissapointed at the overclocking features of 99% of the nForce2 motherboard manufacturers

dude, Asus does like 25% of the AMD market of motherboards. chaintech, leadtek... these guys suck at mobos and know it. i wouldn't touch one of those with a 10 foot pole. if you are serious, then you know that the only names worth knowing are Asus, Abit, Epox, and maybe Shuttle. never liked Iwill, MSI. ECS makes nice discount boards, but the big three for OCing are Asus, Abit, and Epox.

so be disappointed that Asus hasn't put a stripped board out without dual ethernet and RAID for less, the Abit is slow (as usual) and Epox hasn't hit market. the other guys, let the fools buy Chaintech =)

 

[Technonut]

Hey, Ace...did I say anything bad about the nForce2 chipset? NO! Read again, fool.

OverclockTHIS <========= Must be another mass banning at the HardOCP Forums.

EDIT: This is very good flame-free (for the most part ) forum. With the proper attitude you can learn and contribute much......

 

[flawedexistence]

Oddly enough, despite Mr. Overclock's potty mouth ramblings his original point is quite valid. IMHO the N-Force chipset is the only viable alternative for an AMD processor. Over the last few years the only real alternative has been VIA. (See: Infinite loop, pci latency, spontaneous reboot, game crash, 4 in 1, incompatible; why, the list is endless!) Even a good company like ASUS can lay an egg, lest we forget their wonderful SIS648 board. Point is, AMD won't ever be more than a niche manufacturer unless someone provides them with a stable chipset. Unlike Overclock, I think the N-Force2 may well be that chipset, even though it may lack the bleeding edge features favored by a smallText percentage of users!

 

[kadajawi]

well, I do agree that the mobo manufacturers don't really make use of what the NForce 2 is able to do. I mean, hey, it has dual lan (and 2 good ones!), it has a pretty good sound"chip" etc. So? Most manufacturers don't make use of the dual lan (ok, I agree its something most people don't need, but hell, the top boards of each manufacturer were tested... they should make good use of whatever is possible, the low end ones can stripe down features), but then again: Who has a serial ata drive? Including serial ata into the boards probably cost more than realising the second on board NIC, and it can be quite useful for many users (one nic for the dsl/cable modem and one for the home network). And then the sound chip... most manufacturers use a Realtek ALC650 (yes, even Asus IIRC). Why? So that users still have to buy a expensive sound card like the Audigy 2? Eventhough the NForce 2 has everything needed to compete with these sound cards?
Again: These are the top of the line mobos, right? So just stuff it full with everything a power user needs, 2 nics, good sound, firewire, usb 2.0, good overclocking features (voltage, timing, pci lock etc.). There is a market for this, and I'm sure not only I am willing to pay the extra cash for the higher production costs (not more of course... they shouldn't think just because they have included sound which can compete with a Audigy for example they can add the price of a Audigy to the board). Serial ATA is not needed atm yet (IMHO), who wants it can still buy a Serial ATA card later on. Of course its nothing bad to have and the top of the line boards can have it

So, in that sense I'm pretty disappointed. There is more possible with this chipset. And for those who don't need all these features I'm sure they come up with a very basic version of the board.

 

[dejacky]

A warning about onboard NICS. In the severa motherboards I've tried that include NICs not made by 3com, all have suffered from significant data packet loss/error compared to my PCI 3com 10/100 NIC. I didn't believe it until I had it all tested on my univerisities network and the techs reported me the errors. I remember it having something to do with a feature 3com uses in their NICs that other NIC manufacturers don't use..some type of "checking" feature maybe. So, I hope these realtek nics in nforce2 can profide error free data transmission.

-dejacky

 

[mxocr]

amd and via ,all the way baby.

 

[tuan121]

nforce is great. who cares bout overclocking as long as its fast and stable! and has great sounds. gotta love it.

 

[SFang]

OverclockTHIS

How long has it been since the AGP/PCI lock capabilities on the Intel side of things? Why are these companies screwing with AMD?

Well, THESE companies have been screwing Intel too. Have you heard of anything called "Cold Boot" problem? Do a search on google or yahoo, you can see it spread out from i845D to latest i845PE. No one survived THESE companies, Intel or AMD.

KGB

Well overclock this, I think I made myself clear when Epox has AGP and PCI lock feature too. So Epox is the real winner in my book.

1 being Why is ASUS implementing Serial Ata onboard when I can buy a perfectly good PCI card for it down the road WHEN i NEED it.

Oh, really, do you always buy stuff when you NEED it? Tell me when is the last time you ever used a firewire port or USB2.0(not 1.1)? If not, should both of them be got rid of from Epox? The fact is, I am glad I got an Asus. Serial ATA is important to me just like Lan port, 6.1 audio, USB2.0 and Firewire. You save your money for an expensive PCI card in the future. If you want your way, go with A7N8X standard version then. Performance wise, A7N8X is much better than Epox on Evan's charts.

Get this clear, Asus A7N8X Deluxe is "high end", Epox is "value buy".

 

[Mem]

Epox might have all the fancy voltage settings, but it won't do you jack shyt if your hard-drive craps out on you and you lose all the data because of a high PCI bus.

Asus is the only way to go for an AMD system...the rest of the companies are crap and can go straight to hell for all I care.

IMHO I would buy Epox over Asus anytime,you not only save money but performance and stability with Epox boards is excellent,as for losing your data well anybody that overclocks should have their important data backed up,if you don`t then it`s your fault and your problem not the board/HD in question.

 

[gonzo2k]

Charming thread from Anands next "Elite" member.

Got to go run over some kittens now.

 

[Lonyo]

What's all this PCI lock stuff? Maybe I'm going mad, but didn't the Anand review said that at least a couple of the boards had PCI locks that couldn't be turned off, so the PCI was always locked?
If you look at the features you CAN get with NForce2, and what you can get with some other boards, then the things they do give you are quite good.