Anyone else take Ritalin or Adderol?

[swbsam]

Originally posted by: destrekor

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: destrekor

My ADD is very effective in parts of my life. I really only have it to a degree, it's not insane or anything.
But, to whatever degree it is, it has made me an excellent driver.

Your Attention Deficit disorder has made you an excellent driver?

I explained that in that same post.

I don't have an extreme case of ADD, mind you. Most of my good driver aspects come from other things. It's hard to explain. While at times I am easily distracted on the road by something on the side, it's not like I cannot hold attention on something for any moment of time. That, and driving gets my body attentive.

ADD can be combated by stressors. Stressors, especially ones that get your body pumping more norepinephrine, can combat ADD, if the ADD is caused by imbalanced, or low levels, of specific neurotransmitters. That is what medications seek to do - amphetamines cause your body to pump more norepinephrine, for instance. So any natural situation that does the same, will produce similar gains in attention.

True - when my body gets into a fight or flight situation, I turn into a hawk of sorts. It's very hard to explain. I could see how it could possibly make one a better driver, but that just hasn't been the case to me. I used to do stupid, stupid shit on impulse - merging without looking, looking at green lights down the block and not the red light in front of me. Not making excuses at all.. And I've never, ever used my ADHD as an excuse, even to cops In fact, I usually say "No, officer - i'm not drunk, I'm an idiot"... I forgot what my point was..

 

[aphex]

I've switched around a few meds over the past year, although I felt that Concerta did the best job out of all the ones I tried (Concerta, Adderall, Vyvanse and Ritalin SR), on our new insurance it is ~ $150/mo while Adderall is only $24/mo so i've switched back.

Ritalin SR was the most even throughout the day, but didn't have much of an effect on me. Vyvanse gave me headaches and made me nauseous each afternoon. Adderall works great but if I take it too late in the day, I can't sleep at all that night. Concerta worked almost as well as Adderall, but didn't interfere with my sleep at all, for me it was the best option.

So anyway, its back to Adderall for me. Not that I mind really though, it did work the best at suppressing my appetite as well and I sure could use some help shedding those pounds again.

 

[swbsam]

Originally posted by: barfo

Originally posted by: swbsam I learned coping mechanisms and have gotten better while off of meds

I'd be interested to know what kind of mechanisms.

/not sarcastic

Sure! I'll PM you with these suggestions as well, but adding to the general knowledge base here:
(Disclaimer, some of these work for me sometimes and may not work for everyone. Some sound really dumb but work for me, don't judge!):
-Not in any order
1. Non-melodic, strange music played loudly while doing something important I find that really strange music, music that I can't just block out (i.e. obvious melodies, etc) cause me to paradoxically focus more on the task at hand. Break beat techno, heavy metal, acid jazz, etc. etc. I have to change it up frequently because I eventually get used to anything in time.

2. Caffeine - it only works if I swear it off 99% of the time. In other words, I never drink coffee/soda, but if I need to focus for a particular task a Red Bull helps..

3. Lists. When I walk into work every day I write (in those daily desktop calendars) a list of things to do. I've tried this electronically and it doesn't work for me. Just write a list on paper, paper that's not easily lost, and cross things out. This doesn't work all the time because, the moment I'm overwhelmed, the list goes out the window. But it helps for most routine days at the office

4. Understand the way you are and organize your week accordingly. For example, I know that Tuesday and Thursdays are hellish for me (meetings, the end of the week rush by my superior since she doesn't work Fridays) so I pace myself.. I make sure that I run reports every thursday at 9 to 10. I know form 10 to 11 I should do X, and that I can spend Friday loopy and unproductive

That's all for now, since I'm tired

 

[duragezic]

Bring it up with your doctor. I'd think he'd suggest a lower dose or trying you on something else. As someone mentioned, Adderall is a bit different substance (mix of amphetamine salts) than Ritalin (methylphenidate). Also there is Dexedrine which is dextroamphetamine. There is also Focalin but I think that is pretty similar to methylphenidate.

People react differently to them. Some make you more or less snippy, strung out, depressed, etc. Ugh, I don't need to remember some of those times. It doesn't surprise me that your wife notices you acting differently on it. Dosage can also play into that.

You might for example find a fairly low dosage of Adderall offers the same benefits as your ritalin but without a drastic personality change. Or it may be no better or worse. But I guess my point is that there are other chemically different substances out there that are prescribed for the same kind of things as Ritalin, and your doctor should be able to help you there.

 

[destrekor]

Originally posted by: swbsam

Originally posted by: destrekor

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: destrekor

My ADD is very effective in parts of my life. I really only have it to a degree, it's not insane or anything.
But, to whatever degree it is, it has made me an excellent driver.

Your Attention Deficit disorder has made you an excellent driver?

I explained that in that same post.

I don't have an extreme case of ADD, mind you. Most of my good driver aspects come from other things. It's hard to explain. While at times I am easily distracted on the road by something on the side, it's not like I cannot hold attention on something for any moment of time. That, and driving gets my body attentive.

ADD can be combated by stressors. Stressors, especially ones that get your body pumping more norepinephrine, can combat ADD, if the ADD is caused by imbalanced, or low levels, of specific neurotransmitters. That is what medications seek to do - amphetamines cause your body to pump more norepinephrine, for instance. So any natural situation that does the same, will produce similar gains in attention.

True - when my body gets into a fight or flight situation, I turn into a hawk of sorts. It's very hard to explain. I could see how it could possibly make one a better driver, but that just hasn't been the case to me. I used to do stupid, stupid shit on impulse - merging without looking, looking at green lights down the block and not the red light in front of me. Not making excuses at all.. And I've never, ever used my ADHD as an excuse, even to cops In fact, I usually say "No, officer - i'm not drunk, I'm an idiot"... I forgot what my point was..

I'm able to catch myself all the time with lights. I'll see a green light flash somewhere, and I let off the brake. Then realize my light is still red.
Most often it's green arrow for the turn lane next to me, or if I'm in the turn lane, then its the other lanes.

But the best thing about that... my other learned driving tips/experiences... never go immediately on a green light. I always just let off the brake, scan the immediate area and look to any drivers approaching the intersection at the sides now with a red-light, make a quick judgment, then accelerate. Takes all but a very brief moment in my head to process all of that.
My mind is very agile with processing instant information, possibly due to my eye's natural desire to want to look everywhere at once. Whether this is ADD related or not, I don't know. I tend to state that it is indeed a part of my ADD but not sure.
Testing memory is a different story. See, I see driving as something my mind is best suited for. Able to take in loads of information at once through my eyes as they scan every possible part of the picture that can be seen, and that immediate processed information goes to my decision making. But it gets dumped basically immediately.
I've adapted by simply always scanning everywhere quite frequently. One, it keeps me from getting entirely relaxed during long drives, which is when I start potentially making mistakes or being more careless.
Example: I'll be on a highway, about to pass someone. I scan the whole area, make a quick judgment of the driver and any behavior from them to be noted, and go on my way. Moments later I've passed them and see them in my mirror. However, some time might go by, and I really have that urge/need to re-scan the area, see where that car is. Basically, my mind remembered one detail - there was a car. I'm like that when driving anywhere, my mind wants constant updates because, the way I look at it, my mind can't store all this information because I'm feeding it too much information as my eyes dart everywhere.
Key thing with that: I have a very visually-oriented memory.

That's what it's like in daily life off the road too, and sometimes I look like an idiot as I have to as "what" to someone after being told something just a moment ago. Either my mind wasn't exactly paying attention, I was actively kind of focusing elsewhere, or my mind has a delay somewhere... because often, I'll ask what, and maybe not a moment later, I begin to remember and say "oh... did you say ...... ?".

Lately I've started thinking if sometimes ADD isn't really a disorder at all, but rather an inability for some minds to not adapt to the environment. Here we are, subjected to 9-5 work and college... maybe it's not that we have an inability to pay attention, it's our mind has an inability to care about anything it doesn't deem important. So, the problem lies in convincing our minds (ever try convincing an instinct-driven creature to ignore all instincts? ha) to believe class is important to pay attention to, so that it gives the rest of the brain the necessary levels of neurotransmitters to accomplish the task.

Our minds are simply lazy - they don't want to be troubled with tasks that are repetitive and what they deem unimportant to either survival or an immediate or upcoming importance. I often daydream of something coming up that I personally feel is important, or dart my eyes around the room looking at all the females, or even just scratch crude drawings in my notebook.
Even with classes that are hard and grades extremely important, I often have a struggle actively focusing on every detail of the class.
I know I need to fix it, but I don't see how. I think my brain needs shock treatment.

 

[swbsam]

On my first day on Adderall.. I'm amazingly productive and got through leading a meeting without my usual stuttering and stammering. I'd say it "works" as well as Ritalin for me, but I have a massive headache and absolutely no appetite. I haven't had food since last night and am weak, but don't want to eat, feeling like I'll puke if I do.

Everything takes some time to normalize so I'm not knocking the drug.

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: swbsam
On my first day on Adderall.. I'm amazingly productive and got through leading a meeting without my usual stuttering and stammering. I'd say it "works" as well as Ritalin for me, but I have a massive headache and absolutely no appetite. I haven't had food since last night and am weak, but don't want to eat, feeling like I'll puke if I do.

Everything takes some time to normalize so I'm not knocking the drug.

Wow we are screwed. You are sitting there getting high off amphetamines in order to do daily tasks, and this is "normal."


Jesus....

 

[SphinxnihpS]

You do not have a need for medication. You have a need to change your life. Go ahead and drug yourself into peaceful tranquility. You are killing yourself imo.

 

[destrekor]

Originally posted by: Ocguy31

Originally posted by: swbsam
On my first day on Adderall.. I'm amazingly productive and got through leading a meeting without my usual stuttering and stammering. I'd say it "works" as well as Ritalin for me, but I have a massive headache and absolutely no appetite. I haven't had food since last night and am weak, but don't want to eat, feeling like I'll puke if I do.

Everything takes some time to normalize so I'm not knocking the drug.

Wow we are screwed. You are sitting there getting high off amphetamines in order to do daily tasks, and this is "normal."


Jesus....

eh?

Modern life isn't normal for the human body, and some individuals have a mind that isn't able to cope with the daily grind. We say these people have disorders. In reality, the unconscious mind treats the daily grind as unimportant, boring, and not necessary for survival, often no matter what the conscious mind actually thinks of the situation. Hell, sleeping only at night is actually not a normal cycle for humans - look at most animals, either captive or wild, including primates... they sleep for short periods throughout the day if the opportunity exists and they don't require to fulfill a need at the moment. It conserves energy use, and allows for far more productive periods, versus staying awake for 16+ hours and trying to be productive most of those, shaking off grogginess on a few occasions as well.

But quite simply, an effective means to combat the subconscious mind - which is not producing enough neurotransmitters to keep the mind sharp at all times - is to dose with potent stimulants, specifically the amphetamine class. These chemicals cause a cascading release of NTs such as norepinephrine, serotonin, and dopamine, and I believe norepinephrine is the most significantly produced as a result, and that specific NT greatly increases the brain's activity and sharpness in terms of attention, energy, with the other two also affecting energy and mood, and as a side-effect, suppressing appetite until dire hunger comes into play (dopamine and serotonin, as well as the other messengers effected by their release, play large roles in appetite - different from hunger. A starving body will go above that and require attention, though a small simple meal often quenches that need through additional dopamine release as reward and whatnot...).
Combined, the additional release and surge of these NTs causes increased focus.

The military used to (not sure if they still do, though quite possible) dose pilots with amphetamines, including methamphetamine, to enable focused and attentive piloting during missions that ran for extended time periods, such as 36 bomber missions and the like.

Key with these drugs is not to take them daily, or even more than maybe 2 doses a week. The body, once it becomes used to receiving the drug, adjusts the NT levels to the point that while dosage will result in increased ability to focus, the other side effects diminish over time. However, the key side effect, energy, does have an important role in attention and focus, and when that energy bonus diminishes through increased resistance to dosage, it results in a mixed message. The conscious mind returns to pre-amphetamine ways, as with the loss of the energy bonus, the mind believes itself to be like the old way, and essentially gets a little confused. So the person can easily slip into old routines/habits, including lack of attention/focus, but with little effort can actually have that increased focus (again, assuming he's still taking the drug, but the body has adjusted).

Infrequent use will keep the drug working most effectively.

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: destrekor

Originally posted by: Ocguy31

Originally posted by: swbsam
On my first day on Adderall.. I'm amazingly productive and got through leading a meeting without my usual stuttering and stammering. I'd say it "works" as well as Ritalin for me, but I have a massive headache and absolutely no appetite. I haven't had food since last night and am weak, but don't want to eat, feeling like I'll puke if I do.

Everything takes some time to normalize so I'm not knocking the drug.

Wow we are screwed. You are sitting there getting high off amphetamines in order to do daily tasks, and this is "normal."


Jesus....

eh?

Modern life isn't normal for the human body, and some individuals have a mind that isn't able to cope with the daily grind. We say these people have disorders. In reality, the unconscious mind treats the daily grind as unimportant, boring, and not necessary for survival, often no matter what the conscious mind actually thinks of the situation. Hell, sleeping only at night is actually not a normal cycle for humans - look at most animals, either captive or wild, including primates... they sleep for short periods throughout the day if the opportunity exists and they don't require to fulfill a need at the moment. It conserves energy use, and allows for far more productive periods, versus staying awake for 16+ hours and trying to be productive most of those, shaking off grogginess on a few occasions as well.

:roll:

However you rationalize the taking of powerful stimulants on a daily basis, that is your deal. You dont need to be a doctor to realize that it screws you up.

Keep on poppin' though. I could care less what an adult does to their body. Im against giving it to children.

 

[SphinxnihpS]

All part of the normalization of constant happiness and tranquility. Sadness, (A BASIC HUMAN EMOTION) has become obsolete. Anger, (A BASIC HUMAN EMOTION) has become abnormal.

 

[destrekor]

Originally posted by: SphinxnihpS
You do not have a need for medication. You have a need to change your life. Go ahead and drug yourself into peaceful tranquility. You are killing yourself imo.

Welcome to modern life. We cannot change what we have.

The only lifestyle severe ADD/ADHD individuals will truly succeed without any effort to cope with the problems, are basically not ideal for living a modern life unless you get very lucky or have serious skill. Artists of all types, from drawing/painting, photography, to even authors, are some of the more well-suited professions. But the best is basically living a more village/tribal life, where actual survival is quite an issue, and not just a loss of comfort in the developed world.

We are all killing ourselves. Get used to it.

But there is idealism, and there is realism. Most adults today have no real ability to change their lifestyles unless they want to suffer in some way, or even ultimately risk going broke or worse. There is too much room for failure, especially when you have debt and things like family to support.
Not everyone can just drop what they are doing and go on to new things. People talk of taking time to go travel the world, see and do new things. For most individuals, this is not a possibility until retirement.

 

[destrekor]

Originally posted by: Ocguy31

Originally posted by: destrekor

Originally posted by: Ocguy31

Originally posted by: swbsam
On my first day on Adderall.. I'm amazingly productive and got through leading a meeting without my usual stuttering and stammering. I'd say it "works" as well as Ritalin for me, but I have a massive headache and absolutely no appetite. I haven't had food since last night and am weak, but don't want to eat, feeling like I'll puke if I do.

Everything takes some time to normalize so I'm not knocking the drug.

Wow we are screwed. You are sitting there getting high off amphetamines in order to do daily tasks, and this is "normal."


Jesus....

eh?

Modern life isn't normal for the human body, and some individuals have a mind that isn't able to cope with the daily grind. We say these people have disorders. In reality, the unconscious mind treats the daily grind as unimportant, boring, and not necessary for survival, often no matter what the conscious mind actually thinks of the situation. Hell, sleeping only at night is actually not a normal cycle for humans - look at most animals, either captive or wild, including primates... they sleep for short periods throughout the day if the opportunity exists and they don't require to fulfill a need at the moment. It conserves energy use, and allows for far more productive periods, versus staying awake for 16+ hours and trying to be productive most of those, shaking off grogginess on a few occasions as well.

:roll:

However you rationalize the taking of powerful stimulants on a daily basis, that is your deal. You dont need to be a doctor to realize that it screws you up.

Keep on poppin' though. I could care less what an adult does to their body. Im against giving it to children.

I am not prescribed amphetamines of any sort, as it is forbidden.

Nor should they ever be taken on a daily basis.

But... everything screws you up. The oxygen we need to live screws us up. There is not a single thing on this planet that is perfect, and there is nothing we consume that does not come with an attached negative in some shape or form. And everyone reacts differently to everything. Something harmful to one can be beneficial to another.

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: destrekor

I am not prescribed amphetamines of any sort, as it is forbidden.

Nor should they ever be taken on a daily basis.

But... everything screws you up. The oxygen we need to live screws us up. There is not a single thing on this planet that is perfect, and there is nothing we consume that does not come with an attached negative in some shape or form. And everyone reacts differently to everything. Something harmful to one can be beneficial to another.

The "we all die someday anyway" argument? Isnt that what teenagers say to their parents when they get caught smoking the first time?

Nah, you're right. Lets all slam some heroin tonight! Between the toes, nobody knows!

 

[swbsam]

Originally posted by: Ocguy31

Originally posted by: swbsam
On my first day on Adderall.. I'm amazingly productive and got through leading a meeting without my usual stuttering and stammering. I'd say it "works" as well as Ritalin for me, but I have a massive headache and absolutely no appetite. I haven't had food since last night and am weak, but don't want to eat, feeling like I'll puke if I do.

Everything takes some time to normalize so I'm not knocking the drug.

Wow we are screwed. You are sitting there getting high off amphetamines in order to do daily tasks, and this is "normal."


Jesus....

I never claimed to be normal. I never claimed to be the epitome of perfection, like you Sir. I don't take these stimulants for fun - I don't take them to live up to your expectations. I take them to get through some rough days and to, honestly, work at my true potential. Scientific tests show that the brains of people with ADHD are in fact different - regions of our brain are "sleepy" while others are hyper active. Now, not every obnoxious 4 year old has ADD. In fact, no one could imagine that I have ADHD from afar - my struggle is internal and a quiet one.

I've lost jobs, women, and great opportunities because I wanted to believe that I was "normal," and didn't need to seek help. I hate being so melodramatic but, honestly, people who don't believe in something in particular just because they don't experience it themselves lack the empathy for me to consider them intelligent, or worthy of an opinion.. Honestly. Doctors I respect say that ADHD is a real problem that needs to be treated, so I'll take their opinion over some forum jockey.

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: swbsam

Originally posted by: Ocguy31

Originally posted by: swbsam
On my first day on Adderall.. I'm amazingly productive and got through leading a meeting without my usual stuttering and stammering. I'd say it "works" as well as Ritalin for me, but I have a massive headache and absolutely no appetite. I haven't had food since last night and am weak, but don't want to eat, feeling like I'll puke if I do.

Everything takes some time to normalize so I'm not knocking the drug.

Wow we are screwed. You are sitting there getting high off amphetamines in order to do daily tasks, and this is "normal."


Jesus....

I never claimed to be normal. I never claimed to be the epitome of perfection, like you Sir. I don't take these stimulants for fun - I don't take them to live up to your expectations. I take them to get through some rough days and to, honestly, work at my true potential. Scientific tests show that the brains of people with ADHD are in fact different - regions of our brain are "sleepy" while others are hyper active. Now, not every obnoxious 4 year old has ADD. In fact, no one could imagine that I have ADHD from afar - my struggle is internal and a quiet one.

I've lost jobs, women, and great opportunities because I wanted to believe that I was "normal," and didn't need to seek help. I hate being so melodramatic but, honestly, people who don't believe in something in particular just because they don't experience it themselves lack the empathy for me to consider them intelligent, or worthy of an opinion.. Honestly. Doctors I respect say that ADHD is a real problem that needs to be treated, so I'll take their opinion over some forum jockey.

You've touched on the real problem. Like I said, you are an adult, pop away. But every kid who gets a B- instead of an A is getting force fed extremly powerful drugs (I know, ive taken them recreationally). I have had friends that now cant live without it, who had no issues other than mommy wanting to steal some to use as diet pulls, or they watched too much TV instead of doing homework. You know, things that most children go through.

People lived just fine without it before. It is mainly a manufactured "disorder."

 

[destrekor]

Originally posted by: SphinxnihpS
All part of the normalization of constant happiness and tranquility. Sadness, (A BASIC HUMAN EMOTION) has become obsolete. Anger, (A BASIC HUMAN EMOTION) has become abnormal.

meh.

emotions are simply a very human, and very arbitrary, classification of instinctual and physical reactions within our body as a result of external stimuli.

However, anger is not abnormal. Nor has sadness become obsolete. But they are feelings the body would rather not experience. Both are stressor responses. Happy, as opposed to simply being there (maybe this is the tranquility you speak of), is a chemical (neurotransmitter) reward in your mind. Love is a version of happiness, when a few other NTs go run around in your mind. Love specifically helps fulfill the companion/tribal needs of the mind, as well as is a reward for potentially fulfilling basis instinctual needs.

But anger and sadness. Very useful, and will always be. Anger can be used to establish leadership/dominance, accomplish hasty objectives, even survive or help others you deem important survive.
Sadness, while it isn't entirely useful, has its purposes, and can lead to the feeling of companionship, something we instinctively long for, with friends or potential mates/lovers.
However, not only in modern society, but for the entire history of man, those two, most importantly, have never been a good thing to be experienced for lengthy periods of time.
Both, as negative stressor responses, have an impact on how the brain and mind function, and thus how the entire body functions. Sadness leads to a lack of energy/strength, and anger leads to increased energy/strength. However, as I stated with the mind thing, both lead to non-baseline activity, which equates to non-normal behavior. You can become illogical, perform actions or say things never intended to do normally, and in general they make you a different person in those times. But without specifics in terms of modern society, both lead to unnecessary risks that can terrible results. Our body has uses for them, but they most certainly should never be uncontrolled or long-lasting. Increased negative stress that leads to agitation/anger, over lengthy periods of time can result in health risks. Sadness, not entirely up to speed with its impacts on the body, but I'm sure the change in behavior could lead to less obvious but over time dangerous consequences, aka quite risky. Such as changes in appetite, no longer meeting the body's needs, etc. Not to mention the non-health related risks, such as accidents from a lack of attention/focus.

 

[swbsam]

Originally posted by: Ocguy31

Originally posted by: swbsam

Originally posted by: Ocguy31

Originally posted by: swbsam
On my first day on Adderall.. I'm amazingly productive and got through leading a meeting without my usual stuttering and stammering. I'd say it "works" as well as Ritalin for me, but I have a massive headache and absolutely no appetite. I haven't had food since last night and am weak, but don't want to eat, feeling like I'll puke if I do.

Everything takes some time to normalize so I'm not knocking the drug.

Wow we are screwed. You are sitting there getting high off amphetamines in order to do daily tasks, and this is "normal."


Jesus....

I never claimed to be normal. I never claimed to be the epitome of perfection, like you Sir. I don't take these stimulants for fun - I don't take them to live up to your expectations. I take them to get through some rough days and to, honestly, work at my true potential. Scientific tests show that the brains of people with ADHD are in fact different - regions of our brain are "sleepy" while others are hyper active. Now, not every obnoxious 4 year old has ADD. In fact, no one could imagine that I have ADHD from afar - my struggle is internal and a quiet one.

I've lost jobs, women, and great opportunities because I wanted to believe that I was "normal," and didn't need to seek help. I hate being so melodramatic but, honestly, people who don't believe in something in particular just because they don't experience it themselves lack the empathy for me to consider them intelligent, or worthy of an opinion.. Honestly. Doctors I respect say that ADHD is a real problem that needs to be treated, so I'll take their opinion over some forum jockey.

You've touched on the real problem. Like I said, you are an adult, pop away. But every kid who gets a B- instead of an A is getting force fed extremly powerful drugs (I know, ive taken them recreationally). I have had friends that now cant live without it, who had no issues other than mommy wanting to steal some to use as diet pulls, or they watched too much TV instead of doing homework. You know, things that most children go through.

People lived just fine without it before. It is mainly a manufactured "disorder."

There's a major problem in our country with people diagnosing themselves based on pharmaceutical ads and then forcing 3rd rate doctors to prescribe anything and everthing for them. Of course the system's broken, and far too many people are prescribed drugs for ailments that they don't even have. I'll even go as far as saying that ailments were created after the drugs were created, not vice versa. But this is not limited, at all, to ADHD.

We live in a quick fix country, and I hate seeing kids doped up. My parents agreed with that and I struggled through much of my childhood with something that IS real, but gets laughed at because of the over medication of our nation. I'll agree with you - I have ADHD and have met many people who take ritalin and adderall, but have only met a handful who really need it. "Needing to get through finals" does not mean you have ADHD.

I've been to various experts in various fields (a neurologist, a family practitioner, and now a psychiatrist) and they all agree that my experiences and symptoms (having a freaky I.Q. while trying and failing at school. Violent outbursts that lead to being expelled, numerous car accidents) lead to the obvious conclusion that I have something wrong with me. Sometimes I followed their advice, sometimes I didn't (like the past few months off of Ritalin).

People lived just fine without it before. It is mainly a manufactured "disorder."

That's not exactly true. How can we measure the amount of otherwise intelligent people who ended up becoming failures in life because of an undiagnosed problem? I was very much on the track to self destruction, but am doing OK now. Personal choices and discipline played a far more important role than any drug. In fact, the turning point was realizing that the world is bigger than me. I finally realized that I had to give up my selfish existence and work my ass off to succeed, to build something bigger than myself... And I'm doing just that. You're right, the drug had nothing to do with my maturation. But, now that I'm humbly marching toward my adult life, this drug can help me keep focused, out of trouble, and toward the goals I know I can accomplish...

 

[scott916]

Originally posted by: swbsam
snip

I understand you on every aspect of what you describe to be your symptoms. I have struggled with the same difficulties my whole life, and I too have been the guy who doesn't want to resort to amphetamines to try to control something I feel I should have the power to rein in on my own.

I guess that's why I've always smoked pot over the years. When I'm high, I can actually FOCUS for once. I can actually think about one thing at a time and consider actually finishing a task. I can think more deeply and introspectively about things, and it gives me a very different perspective than my normally convoluted brain.

I've always gotten bad grades in school, even though I was consistently ranked in the top percentiles in any test of intelligence. I simply couldn't bring myself to concentrate on anything for long enough to complete it. It's led to dropping out of school, losing a job because I was negligent, and being on thin ice at my current place of employment because of the results of my 'symptoms'.

What did you do to get the Adderall? Did you just tell your doc about your symptoms? I'm willing to give it a try if it really does make you focus. I'm trying to start my own business and I could definitely use the ability to concentrate on the goals ahead of me for once.

 

[SphinxnihpS]

Originally posted by: destrekor

Originally posted by: SphinxnihpS
All part of the normalization of constant happiness and tranquility. Sadness, (A BASIC HUMAN EMOTION) has become obsolete. Anger, (A BASIC HUMAN EMOTION) has become abnormal.

meh.

emotions are simply a very human, and very arbitrary, classification of instinctual and physical reactions within our body as a result of external stimuli.

However, anger is not abnormal. Nor has sadness become obsolete. But they are feelings the body would rather not experience. Both are stressor responses. Happy, as opposed to simply being there (maybe this is the tranquility you speak of), is a chemical (neurotransmitter) reward in your mind. Love is a version of happiness, when a few other NTs go run around in your mind. Love specifically helps fulfill the companion/tribal needs of the mind, as well as is a reward for potentially fulfilling basis instinctual needs.

But anger and sadness. Very useful, and will always be. Anger can be used to establish leadership/dominance, accomplish hasty objectives, even survive or help others you deem important survive.
Sadness, while it isn't entirely useful, has its purposes, and can lead to the feeling of companionship, something we instinctively long for, with friends or potential mates/lovers.
However, not only in modern society, but for the entire history of man, those two, most importantly, have never been a good thing to be experienced for lengthy periods of time.
Both, as negative stressor responses, have an impact on how the brain and mind function, and thus how the entire body functions. Sadness leads to a lack of energy/strength, and anger leads to increased energy/strength. However, as I stated with the mind thing, both lead to non-baseline activity, which equates to non-normal behavior. You can become illogical, perform actions or say things never intended to do normally, and in general they make you a different person in those times. But without specifics in terms of modern society, both lead to unnecessary risks that can terrible results. Our body has uses for them, but they most certainly should never be uncontrolled or long-lasting. Increased negative stress that leads to agitation/anger, over lengthy periods of time can result in health risks. Sadness, not entirely up to speed with its impacts on the body, but I'm sure the change in behavior could lead to less obvious but over time dangerous consequences, aka quite risky. Such as changes in appetite, no longer meeting the body's needs, etc. Not to mention the non-health related risks, such as accidents from a lack of attention/focus.

You can rationalize your behavior any way you want, but when you are angry or sad your body is telling you you are doing the wrong thing. Medicating these feelings away does NOTHING to cure the underlying problem which is you doing stuff you should not be doing.

Two wrongs always make a right though...

 

[swbsam]

Originally posted by: SphinxnihpS

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: destrekor

My ADD is very effective in parts of my life. I really only have it to a degree, it's not insane or anything.
But, to whatever degree it is, it has made me an excellent driver.

Your Attention Deficit disorder has made you an excellent driver?

Yes we have attention deficits, but they are not blanket or global. Our attention deficits manifest during boring repetitive meaningless drudgery. Things that are thrilling grab our attention 100%.

I'll make a deal with you - give me a job in a creative field that I enjoy without compromise. Pay me enough to live a comfortable life that I'd never aspire to grow beyond. Take away my "boring, repetitive, meaningless" job and give me something that truly inspires me - do all of that and I'll stop taking Ritalin and give you experiment a try.

Right now, I have to work where I work and I have to wake up when I do to get to a job that I actually do like, but fear losing because I sometimes spend 3 hours staring into space just because my mom probably fell down too many stairs while pregnant with me.

Until then, you're just a hippy who's only point of reference is his/her own little life. Empathy- get some, mother fucker

 

[swbsam]

Originally posted by: scott916

Originally posted by: swbsam
snip

I understand you on every aspect of what you describe to be your symptoms. I have struggled with the same difficulties my whole life, and I too have been the guy who doesn't want to resort to amphetamines to try to control something I feel I should have the power to reign in on my own.

I guess that's why I've always smoked pot over the years. When I'm high, I can actually FOCUS for once. I can actually think about one thing at a time and consider actually finishing a task. I can think more deeply and introspectively about things, and it gives me a very different perspective than my normally convoluted brain.

I've always gotten bad grades in school, even though I was consistently ranked in the top percentiles in any test of intelligence. I simply couldn't bring myself to concentrate on anything for long enough to complete it. It's led to dropping out of school, losing a job because I was negligent, and being on thin ice at my current place of employment because of the results of my 'symptoms'.

What did you do to get the Adderall? Did you just tell your doc about your symptoms? I'm willing to give it a try if it really does make you focus. I'm trying to start my own business and I could definitely use the ability to concentrate on the goals ahead of me for once.

Funny you mention pot - I *love* pot, it liberates my mind and helps me think clearly and without the self doubting my mind is usually full of. I stopped smoking because my wife doesn't like altered states at all, and I respect that to a degree.. And, honestly, most of the perceived brilliance while under the influence is just that - perceived. But everyone's different.

As for getting Adderrall - it was a long process. First I had to find the right doctor. Lots of doctors just want to throw drugs at you, and I didn't want that at all. I've been on some funky things with some funky side effect (straterra being the worst!), but my latest psychiatrist (who I've seen since 2003 now), had a measured approach that I liked. He started me on ritalin, 5mg twice a day. That's really nothing, as much stimulant as a cup of coffee. He gradually worked me up to 10mg twice a day, which is still far less than some people are prescribed. He's anti-drugging people up for the most part - rejecting my plee for sleeping pills when I told him that ritalin was causing me insomnia.. His answer "take your medicine earlier and exercise more" was actually a very good answer, and proved that he actually cared about my well being, and was not just trying to drug me up.

He just swapped me to Adderall because of the positive research showing that it has less side effects than ritalin, including the documented cases of personality change that I told him about. We're giving it a try for a month and he'll decide where I should be at that point.

As for what you should tell your doc - the truth. And nothing but the truth

 

[SphinxnihpS]

Originally posted by: swbsam

Originally posted by: SphinxnihpS

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: destrekor

My ADD is very effective in parts of my life. I really only have it to a degree, it's not insane or anything.
But, to whatever degree it is, it has made me an excellent driver.

Your Attention Deficit disorder has made you an excellent driver?

Yes we have attention deficits, but they are not blanket or global. Our attention deficits manifest during boring repetitive meaningless drudgery. Things that are thrilling grab our attention 100%.

I'll make a deal with you - give me a job in a creative field that I enjoy without compromise. Pay me enough to live a comfortable life that I'd never aspire to grow beyond. Take away my "boring, repetitive, meaningless" job and give me something that truly inspires me - do all of that and I'll stop taking Ritalin and give you experiment a try.

Right now, I have to work where I work and I have to wake up when I do to get to a job that I actually do like, but fear losing because I sometimes spend 3 hours staring into space just because my mom probably fell down too many stairs while pregnant with me.

Until then, you're just a hippy who's only point of reference is his/her own little life. Empathy- get some, mother fucker

Oh I feel sad for you. You choose to blame everything wrong with YOUR life on something else, and then, in a world of infinite possibility, have the audacity to say you are somehow confined.

If I gave you all that, you wouldn't be happy with it. That is your nature. You already do not like what you are given, so you pop pills to make it all better.

It's fine if you want to be angry with me for telling you the truth. Shoot the messenger. Maybe it will wake you the fuck up!

 

[destrekor]

Originally posted by: SphinxnihpS
You can rationalize your behavior any way you want, but when you are angry or sad your body is telling you you are doing the wrong thing. Medicating these feelings away does NOTHING to cure the underlying problem which is you doing stuff you should not be doing.

Two wrongs always make a right though...

eh?

You DO know that many many many things completely outside of your control can have a profound impact on your mental state at any given moment, right?

I'm getting a strong hint you do not.

 

[SphinxnihpS]

Originally posted by: destrekor

Originally posted by: SphinxnihpS
You can rationalize your behavior any way you want, but when you are angry or sad your body is telling you you are doing the wrong thing. Medicating these feelings away does NOTHING to cure the underlying problem which is you doing stuff you should not be doing.

Two wrongs always make a right though...

eh?

You DO know that many many many things completely outside of your control can have a profound impact on your mental state at any given moment, right?

I'm getting a strong hint you do not.

That's your problem, mate.