Anybody in ROTC?

[GML3G0]

Well, college is hella expensive and I'm going into my senior year of high school now. Really stressful right now. I have a pretty good idea of what I want to do. I plan to double major in electrical engineering and physics. I visited a few colleges and one that really stuck out was Carnegie Mellon. I may decide to apply there with early decision, but that binds me with them for four years, and I don't know how much financial aid they're going to give me. Tuition + dorm + books + other expenses comes out to roughly $46k a year. That's A LOT of money.

I would like to get a job in the defense industry, maybe with Lockheed Martin, Northrop Grumman, Raytheon, etc... That would be pretty cool. NASA would be pretty cool, too.

So, I've been looking at ROTC. If I understand correctly, I get max $15k a year and do Officer training on the side while working on my degrees. Then after completing my education, I would serve as an officer in the Air Force. I'm considering it, but my mom is trying to discourage me because of the current situation. Can I continue working on my master's and receive aid before serving? Has anyone done ROTC and can you maybe offer a little bit of advice?

 

[GML3G0]

bump

 

[IAteYourMother]

well, AF is relatively low risk fatality wise no?

 

[destrekor]

not guaranteed to get money in ROTC.. it's a scholarship, you gotta win it.
i am entering my freshman year at Ohio State with Army ROTC.. AirForce ROTC is the hardest to get scholarships because of all the brains entering it for money alone and want to do an easy service versus actually wanting to fight for their country. I wouldn't do AirForce for that reason, I would do it because I wanted to. i tried for a scholarship through both AF and Army, got niether. but OSU's Army ROTC department likes the effort I am putting into it, giving me a slightly better chance for the 3 year scholarship next year, as long as I bust my ass at school.
I'm doing ROTC regardless of money handed to me or not, because I want to. i did, however, score a 4 year room and board scholarship through OSU and ROTC.. got lucky there.

now, as for your questions... after graduating college you enter commission. I have not seen anything mentioned as to being able to hold that off for further schooling. Also, I do not believe officers get the luck of additional aid for schooling like enlisted folk get.

 

[DukeN]

Come to Canada. Quality education in a peaceful place, tuition here is roughly $5k cad per year, and in the bigger cities living costs are lower than bigger cities in the US.

 

[Armitage]

My experience is 15 years old - YMMV

If you go into the Air Force hoping to get a hands-on engineering job when you go active, you're likely to be disapointed. Most AF engineers end up doing acquisition program management. Even if you get get lucky and get into the labs, it'll still be the luck of the draw whether you get to do much hands-on stuff. Since AF assignments are so transient relative to the durations of typical research efforts at the labs, and you're unlikely to be a stand-out in that particular field, you often get stuck doing the paperwork, management and staffing even in the labs. And with an engineering degree overseas assignments are typically rare unless your a civil engineer or aircraft maintenance. I don't know what the scholarship situation is like right now - I had one for undergrad. If you get a scholarship you become ineligeble for the GI bill llater, but there are decent education benefits while on active duty. I did my masters right after undergrad - took something which is occasionally offered called an educational delay. You are commisioned and acrue time in grade for rank (but not pay or retirement). But you aren't paid and they aren't paying for school. And it doesn't accrue any additional service commitment.

On the plus side, you'll almost certainly get a secret level clearance and maybe a TS clearance. That helps alot in your stated goal of working for a defense contractor.

As for destrekor's comments :roll: you don't have to carry a gun to serve your country. I'm quite sure my service as an engineer - both in and out of the AF - has done much more for the security of our country then standing a post with an M16 ever would have. Next time your PLGR tells your where you are to within meters, or you use you're satellite radio to call in a precision GPS guided strike to hit the bad guys, or the bad guys can't phone home because their satellite is FUBAR, or a Joint STARS tells you where the bad guys are, remember that. That's what all those AF ROTC guys that don't "actually want to fight for their country" are doing for you.

And then there are the aircrews - take a look at the statistics for aircrew casuaties in past wars in WWII they were second only to submariners as a % of the force. Probably similar in Korea and Vietnam. Now tell me those guys weren't fighting for their country.

 

[IAteYourMother]

Originally posted by: DukeN
Come to Canada. Quality education in a peaceful place, tuition here is roughly $5k cad per year, and in the bigger cities living costs are lower than bigger cities in the US.

out of country students need not pay extra?

 

[allisolm]

Most of your questions are answered here
U.S. Air Force ROTC (they even allow for online scholarship application)
or here
How will you afford to participate in Air Force ROTC?

I believe you get paid $250 a month for the first 2 years if you are on scholarship, $350 and $400 a month for the last 2 years whether or not you're on scholarship.
You don't do ROTC "on the side", you take classes in military science.
Unless there are some special programs, if you want to stay in school and get a master's, it is possible to get an educational deferment, but I think you have to pay for your schooling during that time (as Armitage said).

Hope this helps.

 

[destrekor]

Originally posted by: Armitage
My experience is 15 years old - YMMV

If you go into the Air Force hoping to get a hands-on engineering job when you go active, you're likely to be disapointed. Most AF engineers end up doing acquisition program management. Even if you get get lucky and get into the labs, it'll still be the luck of the draw whether you get to do much hands-on stuff. Since AF assignments are so transient relative to the durations of typical research efforts at the labs, and you're unlikely to be a stand-out in that particular field, you often get stuck doing the paperwork, management and staffing even in the labs. And with an engineering degree overseas assignments are typically rare unless your a civil engineer or aircraft maintenance. I don't know what the scholarship situation is like right now - I had one for undergrad. If you get a scholarship you become ineligeble for the GI bill llater, but there are decent education benefits while on active duty. I did my masters right after undergrad - took something which is occasionally offered called an educational delay. You are commisioned and acrue time in grade for rank (but not pay or retirement). But you aren't paid and they aren't paying for school. And it doesn't accrue any additional service commitment.

On the plus side, you'll almost certainly get a secret level clearance and maybe a TS clearance. That helps alot in your stated goal of working for a defense contractor.

As for destrekor's comments :roll: you don't have to carry a gun to serve your country. I'm quite sure my service as an engineer - both in and out of the AF - has done much more for the security of our country then standing a post with an M16 ever would have. Next time your PLGR tells your where you are to within meters, or you use you're satellite radio to call in a precision GPS guided strike to hit the bad guys, or the bad guys can't phone home because their satellite is FUBAR, or a Joint STARS tells you where the bad guys are, remember that. That's what all those AF ROTC guys that don't "actually want to fight for their country" are doing for you.

And then there are the aircrews - take a look at the statistics for aircrew casuaties in past wars in WWII they were second only to submariners as a % of the force. Probably similar in Korea and Vietnam. Now tell me those guys weren't fighting for their country.

my comments weren't anti-AirForce.. you apparently misread
what I said was, it seems there are a high number of people who only go into AirForce ROTC because they want money and don't really want to be in a service and figure AirForce is the safest choice.
i myself applied for AirForce ROTC scholarship, but didn't get it. But then I thought it through and just didn't want to be in the AirForce since I can't fly (colorblind), and decided that the Army is really what I wanna do.
I could care less what service someone goes into, I only ask that when someone days, they have a heart and passion for their job.

 

[allisolm]

my comments weren't anti-AirForce.. you apparently misread

Gee, I apparently misread also. "...all the brains entering it for money alone and want to do an easy service versus actually wanting to fight for their country" and "seems there are a high number of people who only go into AirForce ROTC because they want money and don't really want to be in a service" both seem clear to me. Nothing personal, but, as an entering freshman, I don't think you have a clue about the internal motivation of "high numbers" of AFROTC students. What on earth would make you think that Army service is going to be any more difficult or that you're going to get to fight because you're Army?

BTW you're also wrong about the aid for officer schooling Link.

Wife of an Army ROTC graduate and 21-year veteran who got his MBA paid for by the government while serving on active duty.

 

[orakle]

Originally posted by: IAteYourMother

Originally posted by: DukeN
Come to Canada. Quality education in a peaceful place, tuition here is roughly $5k cad per year, and in the bigger cities living costs are lower than bigger cities in the US.

out of country students need not pay extra?

Not much more than that if anything. I'm a Canadian citizen and my tuition next year is going to be $1,500 cdn at a respected university.

 

[RGUN]

Originally posted by: orakle

Originally posted by: IAteYourMother

Originally posted by: DukeN
Come to Canada. Quality education in a peaceful place, tuition here is roughly $5k cad per year, and in the bigger cities living costs are lower than bigger cities in the US.

out of country students need not pay extra?

Not much more than that if anything. I'm a Canadian citizen and my tuition next year is going to be $1,500 cdn at a respected university.

Not much more?!?!? Out of country students at my university (in Toronto) have to pay almost 5 times as much, my $6300 for tuition (mech. engineering) versus an out of country tuition of $28000

 

[thepd7]

Originally posted by: Armitage
My experience is 15 years old - YMMV

If you go into the Air Force hoping to get a hands-on engineering job when you go active, you're likely to be disapointed. Most AF engineers end up doing acquisition program management. Even if you get get lucky and get into the labs, it'll still be the luck of the draw whether you get to do much hands-on stuff. Since AF assignments are so transient relative to the durations of typical research efforts at the labs, and you're unlikely to be a stand-out in that particular field, you often get stuck doing the paperwork, management and staffing even in the labs. And with an engineering degree overseas assignments are typically rare unless your a civil engineer or aircraft maintenance. I don't know what the scholarship situation is like right now - I had one for undergrad. If you get a scholarship you become ineligeble for the GI bill llater, but there are decent education benefits while on active duty. I did my masters right after undergrad - took something which is occasionally offered called an educational delay. You are commisioned and acrue time in grade for rank (but not pay or retirement). But you aren't paid and they aren't paying for school. And it doesn't accrue any additional service commitment.

On the plus side, you'll almost certainly get a secret level clearance and maybe a TS clearance. That helps alot in your stated goal of working for a defense contractor.

As for destrekor's comments :roll: you don't have to carry a gun to serve your country. I'm quite sure my service as an engineer - both in and out of the AF - has done much more for the security of our country then standing a post with an M16 ever would have. Next time your PLGR tells your where you are to within meters, or you use you're satellite radio to call in a precision GPS guided strike to hit the bad guys, or the bad guys can't phone home because their satellite is FUBAR, or a Joint STARS tells you where the bad guys are, remember that. That's what all those AF ROTC guys that don't "actually want to fight for their country" are doing for you.

And then there are the aircrews - take a look at the statistics for aircrew casuaties in past wars in WWII they were second only to submariners as a % of the force. Probably similar in Korea and Vietnam. Now tell me those guys weren't fighting for their country.

LOL you pwned him. Although it is well known that the AF is the cushy (if there is cushy in the armed forces) branch. LOL hear stories from my brother (Army) that AF officers would come to Army camps and get put up in hotels because the barracks weren't up to AF standards. That being said, it is just plain ignorant to think that soldier means only someone who fights. The engineers (especially in communications like you pointed out) are just as important as infantry.

 

[GML3G0]

Thanks for all the responses. I'm going to have to weigh everything and sleep on it. Thanks again.

 

[destrekor]

Originally posted by: allisolm
my comments weren't anti-AirForce.. you apparently misread

Gee, I apparently misread also. "...all the brains entering it for money alone and want to do an easy service versus actually wanting to fight for their country" and "seems there are a high number of people who only go into AirForce ROTC because they want money and don't really want to be in a service" both seem clear to me. Nothing personal, but, as an entering freshman, I don't think you have a clue about the internal motivation of "high numbers" of AFROTC students. What on earth would make you think that Army service is going to be any more difficult or that you're going to get to fight because you're Army?

BTW you're also wrong about the aid for officer schooling Link.

Wife of an Army ROTC graduate and 21-year veteran who got his MBA paid for by the government while serving on active duty.

your still not understanding me. if someone wants to do AirForce or AirForce ROTC, I support them and I personally considered it myself. What I don't like is the people who only want to do ROTC, any ROTC if you dont want to get picky, for money and money alone. Same with all enlisted men who only want to do military for money reasons.
i must be bad at wording, but what I said earlier STILL seems to me like you are misreading.
here it is again:
if someone wants to do AirForce ROTC because they want to serve their country, and thats the only reason (and money is simply a bonus), then good for them.
if someone wants to do AirForce ROTC because they only want money and don't care about the service, and pick AF because the lesser chance of death, then boo on them.
picking service for money reasons only pisses me off. but actually doing ROTC because they want to become an officer and serve their country, awesome!
i never said that AirForce is a wimpy service. They just dont get on with fighting on ground much (BESIDES security forces and special forces). Its almost like a regular job thats also a military service. But they provide a LOT of aid to the rest of the military, which is why I support them.
I don't have anything against any service. Everyone has an idea of what they should for their country, and as long as thats the motivation (patriotism and not money), then whatever they choose is a great choice.

oh and about the further education aid: I apologize, I was wrong about that. I hadn't thought ROTC officers got any support like that for some reason, because I was reading all the support enlisted men got and seemed like officers get barely anything compared to them.

Originally posted by: thepd7
LOL you pwned him. Although it is well known that the AF is the cushy (if there is cushy in the armed forces) branch. LOL hear stories from my brother (Army) that AF officers would come to Army camps and get put up in hotels because the barracks weren't up to AF standards. That being said, it is just plain ignorant to think that soldier means only someone who fights. The engineers (especially in communications like you pointed out) are just as important as infantry.

nobody pwned me, unless you don't know how to read either. he simply cant understand what I am trying to state.
one of my original ideas was to get into the army doing computers or networking, which is what my friend is doing.. the communications backend equipment (he's kind of like a network administrator in that sense, but thats not his official job title, he got something else but does almost the exact same work).