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Any tips on dealing with a car salesman?

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sixone said:
And I'm mostly happy with it. I have no complaints about anything that's not cosmetic, not willing to put any money into that stuff.

My only real worry is mileage. I've put 25k on it in a year and a half. :\
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Take it to a really good detailer. It will look brand new for a lot less cash than a new car.

Wait, by cosmetic, you mean you didn't get the accident damage fixed or something else?
 
Keep the car, tell the salesman to go find another sucker. 2008 Fusion is not something you should dump unless its a complete lemon. Those cars are very good and on my short list of cars I will be looking for when I dump my RAV4.
 
You keep rationalizing dealing with the guy, but you already got suckered in.

You had no interest in a new car, and now you do. He won. You lost. The way to deal with them when you have no interest in buying a new car is to completely ignore them.
 
Ferzerp said:
You keep rationalizing dealing with the guy, but you already got suckered in.

You had no interest in a new car, and now you do. He won. You lost. The way to deal with them when you have no interest in buying a new car is to completely ignore them.
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What did he win, exactly? He didn't get a car off the lot - and probably got paid accordingly.

The only way I'm interested in making that purchase is if the incentives are big enough - and they're not.

Yet. 🙂
 
I'm curious why you felt the dealer was the best place to go for brake work. That's another one to research in the future - brake work is some of the easiest stuff to do.
 
Any tips?

Yep. Tell him to screw off. I've had a few of these we need your used car bits. They called my phone and wanted to speak to my wife. I always give them my number since I have no qualms about telling them to piss off.
 
sixone said:
I was driving home from work last Tuesday. Hit the brakes as I approached a red light, hit a pretty good sized bump in the road as I was braking. Immediately, the pedal went soft, and stayed soft. A good half-second between hitting the pedal and any loss of speed, had to really stand on it to come to a complete stop.

Had been in for an oil change the week before, and they checked the brake pads and fluid, so that couldn't be part of the problem.

Did some reading on the web, and found that others have had varying results with ABS, at the right combination of speed, braking, and bumps in the road. Found a couple of tips to try to identify the problem.
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Did the exact same thing again, today. Braking for a stop light, hit a bump in the road, brakes gone.

Pulled into a parking lot, pumped the pedal, turned the car off. Started it up again, didn't have a single problem for the rest of the drive home.

If anyone can figure this out, I'd sure appreciate it.
 
sixone said:
Did the exact same thing again, today. Braking for a stop light, hit a bump in the road, brakes gone.

Pulled into a parking lot, pumped the pedal, turned the car off. Started it up again, didn't have a single problem for the rest of the drive home.

If anyone can figure this out, I'd sure appreciate it.
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It almost has to be wheel abs sensor related since it's affected by bumps.

When you say 'Brakes gone'.... what do you mean? Pedal to floor? Pedal pressure but no brakes?.. ? Give us as much detail as possible.
 
SpatiallyAware said:
It almost has to be wheel abs sensor related since it's affected by bumps.

When you say 'Brakes gone'.... what do you mean? Pedal to floor? Pedal pressure but no brakes?.. ? Give us as much detail as possible.
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Immediately, the pedal went soft, and stayed soft. A good half-second between hitting the pedal and any loss of speed, had to really stand on it to come to a complete stop.
 
sixone said:
Immediately, the pedal went soft, and stayed soft. A good half-second between hitting the pedal and any loss of speed, had to really stand on it to come to a complete stop.
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Ok you said before no brakes at all..... But now there are brakes after you press hard on the pedal??? It could be loss of vacuum to brake booster.....

I know it sounds OCD, but seriously give us second by second detail of EVERYTHING involved.
 
Saw the red light.
Hit the brakes, they react normally.
Hit a bump while braking, feels like I've taken my foot off the brake, but I haven't.
Pedal goes down, not all the way to the floor, but farther than normal. If I hadn't already been slowing, I would have rear-ended the car in front.
Car continues to slow, but not as quickly as normal.
Next time I use the pedal, nothing happens right away. The pedal will go halfway to the floor before the car starts to slow.
Pumping the pedal has no effect at all.
Pulled over, turned the car off. Pedal is still closer to the floor than normal. Started the car up with the brake depressed, it sinks further.
Backed up, brakes work fine the rest of the way home.
 
sixone said:
Saw the red light.
Hit the brakes, they react normally.
Hit a bump while braking, feels like I've taken my foot off the brake, but I haven't.
Pedal goes down, not all the way to the floor, but farther than normal. If I hadn't already been slowing, I would have rear-ended the car in front.
Car continues to slow, but not as quickly as normal.
Next time I use the pedal, nothing happens right away. The pedal will go halfway to the floor before the car starts to slow.
Pumping the pedal has no effect at all.
Pulled over, turned the car off. Pedal is still closer to the floor than normal. Started the car up with the brake depressed, it sinks further.
Backed up, brakes work fine the rest of the way home.
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Sounds like brake booster to me. Possibly a hose that's slightly leaking and when you 'slam' on the brakes it loses vacuum, or something else related.

Go in a parking lot and test this... Go up to 30-45 and try to duplicate this. You need to figure out if it's loss of vacuum from hitting the brakes really hard or related to a screwed up wheel sensor jarred from bumps.

When you have brake loss press on the brakes HARD... as in, as hard as you can, to see if you can brake at all. Brake booster/vacuum issues mean you can still brake but it takes a lot of pedal pressure. Wheel sensor issues could potentially cause total brake issues.
 
SpatiallyAware said:
Sounds like brake booster to me. Possibly a hose that's slightly leaking and when you 'slam' on the brakes it loses vacuum, or something else related.

Go in a parking lot and test this... Go up to 30-45 and try to duplicate this. You need to figure out if it's loss of vacuum from hitting the brakes really hard or related to a screwed up wheel sensor jarred from bumps.

When you have brake loss press on the brakes HARD... as in, as hard as you can, to see if you can brake at all. Brake booster/vacuum issues mean you can still brake but it takes a lot of pedal pressure. Wheel sensor issues could potentially cause total brake issues.
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I didn't "slam" on the brakes, or even hit them very hard. I had plenty of room before the intersection, and the car in front was three or four car lengths ahead.

I didn't do anything differently than I've been doing it for the last three weeks. Or than I did on the rest of the drive home.
 
sixone said:
Saw the red light.
Hit the brakes, they react normally.
Hit a bump while braking, feels like I've taken my foot off the brake, but I haven't.
Pedal goes down, not all the way to the floor, but farther than normal. If I hadn't already been slowing, I would have rear-ended the car in front.
Car continues to slow, but not as quickly as normal.
Next time I use the pedal, nothing happens right away. The pedal will go halfway to the floor before the car starts to slow.
Pumping the pedal has no effect at all.
Pulled over, turned the car off. Pedal is still closer to the floor than normal. Started the car up with the brake depressed, it sinks further.
Backed up, brakes work fine the rest of the way home.
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This sounds like a typical Master Cylinder failure.

First thing is first. Check your brake fluid (that's #1).

Have you ever had your brakes bled? This should be done every year. If you have air in the system it can cause such an issue. Also one of the reason to get it done every year or so is because water moisture build up in the system that can lead to these sort of issues.

I would test drive it to see if it's fine. If it's ok, you are good.

If it happens again, chances are it's your Master Cylinder

Brake_System.GIF


PS. Don't EVER bring your car to a dealership for service unless it's under warranty.

As far as dealing with car salesman. You shouldn't have to deal with them AT ALL. You didn't bring your car there so that you can buy a new one. If you were not ready to buy a car when you brought yours in for service, you simply do NOT let them talk you into buying a car while you are there.

Only YOU know when you are ready or when you want to make a huge financial decision like that.
 
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Vdubchaos said:
This sounds like a typical Master Cylinder failure.

First thing is first. Check your brake fluid (that's #1).

Have you ever had your brakes bled? This should be done every year. If you have air in the system it can cause such an issue. Also one of the reason to get it done every year or so is because water moisture build up in the system that can lead to these sort of issues.

I would test drive it to see if it's fine. If it's ok, you are good.

If it happens again, chances are it's your Master Cylinder
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I had it in last time this happened. Brake fluid was fine, still is. They supposedly checked everything, and couldn't find anything to fix. I'm sure they would have been more than happy to get me to replace the MC, or whatever else they could get me to pay for.
 
sixone said:
I had it in last time this happened. Brake fluid was fine, still is. They supposedly checked everything, and couldn't find anything to fix. I'm sure they would have been more than happy to get me to replace the MC, or whatever else they could get me to pay for.
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Yep

I would recommend that you have your brakes bled. Find a reputable shop in your area.

If you are willing to do little wrenching it's nothing you can't do yourself. Requires taking off each wheel (starting off with the one that's the farthest from master cylinder (and working your way to the closest), putting a clear tube on a Brake Caliper nipple and loosing it (usually 10-12mm nut). Use a small container to catch the brake fluid. Once it starts coming out, have a 2nd person press the brake pedal and watch for bubbles (in the clear tube). Once depressed all the way, you tighten the nut and have the person pump the brake pedal up. Check the brake fluid level/top off and continue 3-5 times until bubbles are gone.

Has to be done at each wheel.

PS. Make sure you use a jack stand (not just a jack) and have a shop Torque your wheels (usually do it for free)....at Costco.

If you don't want to tackle it...Sears is ok for minor services (if there is one around you) but ask around for a good mechanic. Check out the shop (how clean it is etc) that usually tells you how caring the owners are.

Good mechanics are EXTREMELY hard to find.
 
Different road, same problem: braking for traffic, hit a bump, brakes gone. Pulled off, turned off engine, started it back up, brakes were fine.

I'm getting rid of this car. :\

Any tips on dealing with a car salesman? 😛
 
sixone said:
Different road, same problem: braking for traffic, hit a bump, brakes gone. Pulled off, turned off engine, started it back up, brakes were fine.

I'm getting rid of this car. :\

Any tips on dealing with a car salesman? 😛
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Go towards the end of the month when they are trying to make the end of month quota.

Be prepared to walk away if they won't budge on pricing.

DON'T pay for sealants or treatments that you don't need. They always detail a car before they give it to you anyway.

and on a more serious note:
brakes.png
 
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disappoint said:
Go towards the end of the month when they are trying to make the end of month quota.

Be prepared to walk away if they won't budge on pricing.

DON'T pay for sealants or treatments that you don't need. They always detail a car before they give it to you anyway.

and on a more serious note:
http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/brakes.png
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Yikes. One dealer here is offering 125% of Blue Book on your trade-in. I might try to jump on that - after I research what Blue Book is.
 
sixone said:
Yikes. One dealer here is offering 125% of Blue Book on your trade-in. I might try to jump on that - after I research what Blue Book is.
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Sigh... You do realize that translates into higher purchase price of the car you're buying? There is no free lunch. Especially when dealing with those scumbags.
 
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