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Another question on my 67 Mustang...

J

jmolayal

Senior member
I'm getting some serious white smoke pouring out of my oil breather, so I am pretty sure the head is cracked, or the head gasket is shot.. Found a set of Heads from a 351W that some dude is selling cheap.. Anyone know if these will mount on my 289? I'm thinking that swapping the heads and the head gasket will fix my issue. Any thoughts? Thanks gang!

- Jaison
 
There's got to be a couple really huge forums dedicated to classic 'stangs ... there are a couple members here who could help but you'd have better luck elsewhere.
 
The 351W heads will physically bolt onto the head but you will run into two issues. The steam holes are different on the heads of a 289 and a 351W so you need to drill four holes into the block mating surface of the head using the 289 gasket as a template. The bigger issue is the difference in combustion chamber size. The 351s are significantly larger and you will loose a good deal of compression and the engine will be anemic. The only 351W heads that are close enough to use are the 1969-70 heads and can be milled to keep the compression loss to a minimum or no loss at all. It depends which 289 head you have and their actual nominal combustion chamber size. The later model 351W heads have an even larger combustion chamber size and are simply unusable without a piston change. If you really want 351W heads they need to have a casting number on the underneath side near the pushrod holes of either C90E or D00E.
 
Thanks guys. I've registered on a couple other forums too.

Ron,

I figured as much. My issue is really with white smoke pouring out of my oil breather when the engine warms up. Really started after replacing the water pump and radiator. I'm thinking its the head, or at least the head gasket, but can't be sure. What would you do?

Also, would 302 heads work better?

- Jaison
 
Why are you so interested in changing the heads?

Get a compression gauge, find out which cylinder(s) is blown, and pull the head for inspection. 99 times out of 100 it's nothing more than a head gasket.
 
Originally posted by: ValValline
Why are you so interested in changing the heads?
Click to expand...
Because if you're pulling the heads on a remotely performance-oriented vehicle, there's always the opportunity to upgrade. As I'm sure you know, pulling the heads is half the battle - might as well do some upgrading while you're in there fixing shit 😉
 
A '67 with a 289 is most likely NOT a performance car.

My guess is it's a 2bbl/C4/auto. A solid car, but unless the bottom end is fresh bolting on performance heads may be more trouble than it is worth.
 
Originally posted by: ValValline
A '67 with a 289 is most likely NOT a performance car.

My guess is it's a 2bbl/C4/auto. A solid car, but unless the bottom end is fresh bolting on performance heads may be more trouble than it is worth.
Click to expand...

Close. 4bbl/C4/auto. No performace upgrades. Just happened across a cheap set of heads. I agree with the idea that the issue is most likely head gaskets. In addition to those, I think I'll also need intake gasket.. What else will have to be replaced?
Thanks!

- Jaison
 
Originally posted by: jmolayal
Originally posted by: ValValline
A '67 with a 289 is most likely NOT a performance car.

My guess is it's a 2bbl/C4/auto. A solid car, but unless the bottom end is fresh bolting on performance heads may be more trouble than it is worth.
Click to expand...

Close. 4bbl/C4/auto. No performace upgrades. Just happened across a cheap set of heads. I agree with the idea that the issue is most likely head gaskets. In addition to those, I think I'll also need intake gasket.. What else will have to be replaced?
Thanks!

- Jaison
Click to expand...

Exhaust header gaskets, valve cover gaskets, carb base plate gasket, thermostat housing gasket, etc. You should be able to get a head gasket kit with everything you need.

Also consider replacing the water pump and thermostat while you have everything torn down if they have a lot of years/miles on them. You will be pulling the accessories brackets anyway, because they bolt into the front of the heads.

Also if you do the head gaskets make sure you get them on the correct sides. You don't want to inadvertently block a water transfer port.
 
Thanks for the tip on the kit! Didn't realize it would come altogether like that.

Already swapped out thermostat, water pump, and radiator. Thanks though!

- Jaison
 
If you're pulling the heads and are going to reuse them, it's a great time to get a valve job. Nice freshly cut seats and ground valves, new oil seals and springs if needed.

They're off, do it now.

Edit: How about putting a cam in it? A lot of bang for the buck.
 
I'd been wondering what other work I should have done.. Should I have a ring job done as well? Any idea how much a machine shop would charge for a valve job? Rings? Do you just take the heads to them and they take care of it?

Hadn't thought of adding a CAM.. Forgive me, but what will that do? How much would it run? I'm learning a ton, slowly but surely. Thanks all!

- Jaison
 
Originally posted by: ValValline
A '67 with a 289 is most likely NOT a performance car.

My guess is it's a 2bbl/C4/auto. A solid car, but unless the bottom end is fresh bolting on performance heads may be more trouble than it is worth.
Click to expand...

nah. Most diff problems are due to natural attrition after 35-40 years of age.
Even the 8" stock diff is pretty tough. Mine is still going strong after 4 years with a 360hp motor.
I would worry about brakes, and a safe and sound steering/suspension first.
 
Originally posted by: jmolayal
Thanks guys. I've registered on a couple other forums too.

Ron,

I figured as much. My issue is really with white smoke pouring out of my oil breather when the engine warms up. Really started after replacing the water pump and radiator. I'm thinking its the head, or at least the head gasket, but can't be sure. What would you do?

Also, would 302 heads work better?

- Jaison
Click to expand...

The 67 289 is a "mix" of 289 and 302 depending on when it was built. The answer to your question is yes, 302 heads will work just like 298 heads. My first car was a 67 mustang and i rebuilt that thing from the ground up. Mine had a 289 block with 302 heads from the factory.

Edit: my 67 was a "late" build though.
 
Originally posted by: Demon-Xanth
It almost sounds like a 351W head on a 289 would be good with a blower.
Click to expand...

But a 351 head on a 351 with a blower would be even better 🙂

Especially with the 4V heads and their massive ports.
 
what does the oil look like? is it light tan and thick like a milkshake? If you are getting steam/water into the block best not drive it. You could luck out and just need to replace a head gaskt and check the block and heads for warpage.
 
Originally posted by: Killrose
what does the oil look like? is it light tan and thick like a milkshake? If you are getting steam/water into the block best not drive it. You could luck out and just need to replace a head gaskt and check the block and heads for warpage.
Click to expand...

Well, the oil is tan, but not thick like a milkshake. If anything, it seems more runny than it should be... I'm thinking of pulling the top half off, getting the heads out and taking em to a shop to have them worked on. Anything in particular I should ask them to do? Then I'll put it all back together with a set of fel-pro gaskets. What do you guys think?

- Jaison
 
Originally posted by: jmolayal
Originally posted by: Killrose
what does the oil look like? is it light tan and thick like a milkshake? If you are getting steam/water into the block best not drive it. You could luck out and just need to replace a head gaskt and check the block and heads for warpage.
Click to expand...

Well, the oil is tan, but not thick like a milkshake. If anything, it seems more runny than it should be... I'm thinking of pulling the top half off, getting the heads out and taking em to a shop to have them worked on. Anything in particular I should ask them to do? Then I'll put it all back together with a set of fel-pro gaskets. What do you guys think?

- Jaison
Click to expand...

Have the shop...

Pressure check the heads (it is unlikely they are cracked but it's possible)
Resurface the heads
Do a valve job (clean up the valve heads and seats)
Measure the valve stem guides and seats for excessive wear (any decent shop will do this with the valve job)
Inspect/test the springs to make sure they are still within spec

Pretty basic work for any competent shop.


 
Some shops will have re-built heads in stock. They are cleaned, decked, bronze valve guide inserts installed, and a valve job done. But however you need to make sure they are exactly the same as yours so acessory mounting holes are there on the heads in the proper place. But you are probably best off using yours and have them go thru them.

The only problem with puting re-built heads on a high milage motor is you now have placed new strains on the rest of the motor with heads that dont leak compression anymore.
 
Hey gang. Got the heads off and took a bunch of pics. Here are a couple of the passenger head gasket and the driver side block with the gasket off. Anyone see anything? I was expecting the gasket to be completely blown, but I don't see any real lines or anything..

The heads had A LOT of water in them though.. Poured out of the heads as soon as we started lifting them off. Was crazy how much water was in there... Any thoughts?

I see a lot of carbon on the valves too. Definitely gonna take them to a shop and get them worked on.

Thanks for all the advice!

- Jaison

http://img502.imageshack.us/im...181/driverhead1ij5.jpg

http://img341.imageshack.us/im...assengergasket1um3.jpg

http://img407.imageshack.us/im...assengergasket2rg9.jpg
 
Hard to say looking at the pictures. I don't see anything obvious. Sometimes you can see a "clean" spot between a water passage and a cylinder or the valley between the heads where the intake sits. More often than not you can't see anything too obvious. If you had run a compression check prior to assembly you might have had a better idea of where to look more closely.

Water transfers across the block through the heads, so it is normal for a lot to come out when pulling the heads if the system wasn't completely drained of coolant.
 
Ummm, I take it you didn't drain the cooling system before removing the heads.

I hope you've sopped up all that coolant laying in the cylinders, the valley and the lifters.

Antifreeze is death on bearings. After you've got this thing running, you're going to immediately want to change the oil. Don't run it very long, don't drive it at all.

Change the oil and filter first.

It's normal to have a little leakage, but big pools of antifreeze, well, that's a little scary. Don't get all jiggy about it, just change the oil and filter as I said. You should be OK.
 
I actually did drain the radiator and overflow using a vac attached to my air, but it obviously couldn't pull everything. Probably could have done a better job of it.

Sucked up everything in site immediately after the pics.

My plan was to get the heads done, put em on, put in new plugs, change the oil and filter and THEN fire her up. Not a good plan?
 
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