Move to a totalitarian government and that is what they do. You could be the next Stalin. :roll: That logic could apply to infants, old people, and handicapped people.
People who need help should get help. If they choose to strive to be better and do better. :thumbsup:
If they refuse the help and allow themselves to keep doing their self-destructive and societal-burdening lifestyle, then I say ship them off to an island (or prison) to fend for themselves. If they use these "diagnosis" as an excuse for misbehavior, if the misbehavior is severe enough, they need to get shipped off. People need to learn everything has consequences.
**EDIT**
But right to life is a key and fundamental belief of an enlightened society.
I completely agree with the bolded part, BUT...
Can't anyone who murders multiple people say they are insane and not pay the price for their crimes? Is anyone who murders multiple people actually "sane"? There has to be a line draw somewhere, and Yates crossed the line. She intentionally did what she did, knowing what would happen to the kids by drowning them.
Wrong again, he stated to the court that her behavior got worse and that she was off her meds. He saw her pulling her hair out, and not eating and hearing and seeing things, yet he did nothing to try and have her involuntarily commited to save her and his children. He neglected her and did not listen to her previous psychiatrists about the dangers of her illness. Schizophrenia is something that should be carefully monitored and requires that family members supervise thier loved ones for the sake of the loved one, the family and for society.
You have alot of people who suffer from serious mental illnesses that are neglected by family and society because of their ignorance of the illness. To me this is a crime of many.. she was psychotic at the time she killed her children. I believe that her husband neglected her and did not take the appropriate steps to insure safety for her and their kids.
That has got to be one of the biggest crocks of BS I have read on these forums. You can go on and keep believing that. :disgust:
dainthomas
Lifer
- Dec 7, 2004
- 14,957
- 3,948
- 136
Without a doubt. Satan could have appeared in his coffee cup and told him to do it, and he'd still get the chair.
I can see different juries getting different verdicts in this case because I go back and forth with how I view it myself.
My first reaction is that she is "legally" sane since she did things to show that she knew what she was doing was wrong. She didn't tell her husband and waited until he was out of the house to do it. She called him and the police after she did it. She had filled the bathtub up once before to do it, but didn't carry through that time.
But it's not like she did this and then said she was mentally ill or was just suffering from a bout of post-partum depression or something. There's no denying that this woman was severely mentally ill for most of her life. It was well documented by several doctors over the years prior to this with hospital stays, suicide attempts, confessions of wanting to kill her first child, etc. So I certainly don't think she's trying to pretend to be mentally ill to get out of killing her children as some have in other cases.
Bottom line, I still think she should go to prison instead of a psychiatric institution because she was sane in the legal sense. I believe she knew what she was doing was criminal and took steps to prevent anyone from stopping her. It is a complicated case that raises a lot of issues and leaves a lot of questions unanswered though.
My first reaction is that she is "legally" sane since she did things to show that she knew what she was doing was wrong. She didn't tell her husband and waited until he was out of the house to do it. She called him and the police after she did it. She had filled the bathtub up once before to do it, but didn't carry through that time.
But it's not like she did this and then said she was mentally ill or was just suffering from a bout of post-partum depression or something. There's no denying that this woman was severely mentally ill for most of her life. It was well documented by several doctors over the years prior to this with hospital stays, suicide attempts, confessions of wanting to kill her first child, etc. So I certainly don't think she's trying to pretend to be mentally ill to get out of killing her children as some have in other cases.
Bottom line, I still think she should go to prison instead of a psychiatric institution because she was sane in the legal sense. I believe she knew what she was doing was criminal and took steps to prevent anyone from stopping her. It is a complicated case that raises a lot of issues and leaves a lot of questions unanswered though.
Basically, I feel the same way. :thumbsup: But I think she should get minimum security prison with rehabilitation and counseling. But the law is the law, and must be taken as such.
If the defendant has 3+ years of documented serious mental illness and her idiot redneck husband believed that the cure for his wife's numerous recurring episodes of severe depression, hallucinations, suicidal and homicidal thoughts was to have more children...than I sure as hell hope it sets a precedent.
The husband - who ignored all warnings of her physicians that she was NOT stable enough to have more children or even be alone with them for prolonged periods - should have been on trial...or at least had the last of his teeth kicked down his despicable throat.
Post-Partin Depression, my eye. She don't need nun of them shrink doctors and their made-up sicknesses. All she needs is to have a couple more babies and she'll be all fixed up.
Number1
Diamond Member
- Feb 24, 2006
- 7,881
- 549
- 126
ValkyrieofHouston wrote:
?I think her husband is guiltier than sin for leaving his mentally ill wife to care for their children and is as much a killer of those kids. And he is sane, so he has no excuse?
If you follow this line of thinking, then the doctors who evaluated the woman should be thrown in jail for not having her institutionalized. The husband did not know she was going to kill all the children, the doctors did not know, nobody knew. She is insane and her behavior was unpredictable.
Your argument is flawed.
?I think her husband is guiltier than sin for leaving his mentally ill wife to care for their children and is as much a killer of those kids. And he is sane, so he has no excuse?
If you follow this line of thinking, then the doctors who evaluated the woman should be thrown in jail for not having her institutionalized. The husband did not know she was going to kill all the children, the doctors did not know, nobody knew. She is insane and her behavior was unpredictable.
Your argument is flawed.
Agreed. Why can't people take responsibility for their own actions anymore?
The same argument could go like, "This girl who is a bad driver ran over a pedestrian, but it is not her fault because she is prone to bad driving behavior (although she knew talking on her phone while diving was bad)."
Then follow it by saying, "It is the parents fault for giving the girl a cell phone and allowing her to drive, knowing that she is a bad driver."
Sure the parents are minimally culpable, but that is after the fact, and the main part of responsibility is on the girl herself (no matter what people say to the contrary).
Please tell me this post is some sort of ill-humored joke..
I believe it is positively absurd that those deemed "insane" are held to a different moral standard than the rest of society. The entire notion of a "relative morality" is a failure of justice itself.
You say that this country needs to make a better effort towards helping those who are mentally ill, and I wholeheartedly agree. But once the cost of this diagnosis becomes the death of five innocent children, that is where we must draw the line. This woman is unquestionably guilty, and does not deserve to ever be set free.
Edit: As a final note, I find your abashed blaming of the husband appalling, to say the least. I will leave it at that.
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