Amtrak derailment in Tacoma - multiple fatalities

[Ichinisan]

Judging from the law's name I believe it was intended to provide Amtrak with economic relief.

Yes. The government has an interest in Amtrak's financial stresses when the government is heavily subsidizing them.

 

[Puffnstuff]

Yes. The government's has an interest in Amtrak's financial stresses when the government is heavily subsidizing them.

It single-handedly undermines the principles of common law and completely undermines due process.

 

[Carson Dyle]

Passenger jets carry people through the sky on autopilot. Why aren't passenger trains set up similarly? You have GPS, you have detailed maps of tracks. Why does it even require a human to control the speed for a given section of track? We now even have cars that come pretty close to driving themselves. Why is this industry 50 years behind?

 

[MomentsofSanity]

Passenger jets carry people through the sky on autopilot. Why aren't passenger trains set up similarly? You have GPS, you have detailed maps of tracks. Why does it even require a human to control the speed for a given section of track? We now even have cars that come pretty close to driving themselves. Why is this industry 50 years behind?

You need people because there's no way to account for unknown obstacles that might be on the track. Debris, vehicles whatever. Planes are different in that regard.

 

[skyking]

this is not to replace people, just to limit speeds. It would only become a problem if you were making some "B" movie sci fi flick, and had to out run some lava or godzilla or something of that nature.

 

[Carson Dyle]

You need people because there's no way to account for unknown obstacles that might be on the track. Debris, vehicles whatever. Planes are different in that regard.

Yes. And planes have pilots. But why does a human need to control the speed of the train, other than in an emergency or while switching cars? I saw someone claim that there wasn't a good sign stating the speed (limit) for that section of track. Seriously? Oops.

 

[Puffnstuff]

More facts are being made public over this terrible and avoidable accident. Turns out that the train did not have PTC installed, the speed limit signs were posted for crewmen to see and the engineer knew he was over speed and is recorded commenting on it six seconds before the derailment. He even comments that the trains brakes engaged automatically but PTC was not installed so WTF? I believe that once the dust settles that negligence will rule the day.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/amtrak-train-s-crew-noted-high-speed-just-crash-ntsb-n832156

 

[FIVR]

I still don't understand why wee need trains around. Everything moves fine by trucks, boats and planes. Trains are obviously too dangerous and complicated for americans to operate safely. Maybe if we hired some germans to drive them, this wouldn't happen.

 

[Puffnstuff]

Maybe if we hired some germans to drive them, this wouldn't happen.

The last time the Jews and political dissidents didn't much care for the service.

 

[FIVR]

The last time the Jews and political dissidents didn't much care for the service.

I can't recall any instances of ze germans crashing their trains. Somehow this seems to occur every few years here in the US. They also drive their cars better than us.


Really there isn't much americans do better than ze germans.

 

[Puffnstuff]

I can't recall any instances of ze germans crashing their trains.

Please allow me to help you out with that one.

 

[FIVR]

Clearly, trains are simply too dangerous to be operated by humans. I honestly don't see why we don't have drone trains. You would think that would be the first vehicle they could make into a drone, right? It only moves in two directions.


But then you'd have to fire all those unionized conductors.

 

[Puffnstuff]

But then you'd have to fire all those unionized conductors.

Apparently they're too busy talking to each other to watch the line while the vehicle is in motion.

 

[Puffnstuff]

Now the NTSB released that the 30mph speed limit sign was posted two miles before the curve. The article states that the engineer and the conductor have not been interviewed yet due to their injuries but the engineer was up and about after the wreck if you listen to the emergency radio call he made after the accident. I wonder how many other acts of negligence will come forth during this investigation?


https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/01/05/ntsb-amtrak-derailment-dupont-washington/1006716001/

 

[hal2kilo]

Passenger jets carry people through the sky on autopilot. Why aren't passenger trains set up similarly? You have GPS, you have detailed maps of tracks. Why does it even require a human to control the speed for a given section of track? We now even have cars that come pretty close to driving themselves. Why is this industry 50 years behind?

It's freaking unbelievable. The company I work for has a display location system on GE locomotives for the last 20 f'n years that works with GPS. The engineer that worked on it showed me he could locate any train using his cell phone. It's all about deciding it's cheaper to let people die that spend a few extra shekels for your freight or ticket. The bible was right about money.

 

[BoomerD]

So far, 3 lawsuits filed over this.

1 from a passenger on the train
1 from a passenger in the silver pickup that was hit by the train on I5
1 from the conductor who was in the locomotive "for training" at the time of the crash.

I expect there will be more to come.

 

[Puffnstuff]

So far, 3 lawsuits filed over this.

1 from a passenger on the train
1 from a passenger in the silver pickup that was hit by the train on I5
1 from the conductor who was in the locomotive "for training" at the time of the crash.

I expect there will be more to come.

Take the cumulative injuries and property damage and then a federal judge will have to decide how the $200 million dollar pie gets divided amongst them. That liability cap is going to haunt the most affected parties forever.

 

[sdifox]

So far, 3 lawsuits filed over this.

1 from a passenger on the train
1 from a passenger in the silver pickup that was hit by the train on I5
1 from the conductor who was in the locomotive "for training" at the time of the crash.

I expect there will be more to come.

Err isn't the conductor in training part of the party responsible for this disaster?

 

[Puffnstuff]

Err isn't the conductor in training part of the party responsible for this disaster?

Since he's in training its hard to say what part he played in this incident. I believe that this wreck should serve as a wake up call for the immediate implementation of PTC across the board with no more waivers being issued delaying its installation.

 

[Puffnstuff]

Its just been revealed that human error on the part of the engineer is to blame.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/engineer-deadly-amtrak-crash-mistook-signal-ahead-curve-n841101

 

[Carson Dyle]

"Revealed"?

But... holy crap:

The 55-year-old engineer "recalled that as the train passed milepost 15.5 it was traveling about 79 mph," and said he knew that the curve with the 30 mph restriction was at milepost 19.8, the NTSB said. The engineer said he remembered seeing mileposts 16 and 17, but not milepost 18, less than two miles from the curve, the NTSB reported.

"The engineer said that he did see the wayside signal at milepost 19.8 (at the accident curve) but mistook it for another signal, which was north of the curve," the agency said in an update.

Running trains in 2017 using all the available navigational tech from 1917. Unbelievable...

 

[PottedMeat]

if theres one transportation system that should be almost completely automated, its trains

theres no pathfinding necessary
you know exactly who is supposed to be on the track and where they are
path speeds are predetermined

He then looked up and sensed that the train was becoming 'airborne,'" the NTSB said in the summary.

no shit eh?

 

[Puffnstuff]

if theres one transportation system that should be almost completely automated, its trains

theres no pathfinding necessary
you know exactly who is supposed to be on the track and where they are
path speeds are predetermined



no shit eh?

I think that this constitutes distracted railroading.

 

[Puffnstuff]

Even more truth is coming to light as crew members and trainers felt rushed by managers to conduct condensed training sessions that didn't reflect real world conditions....at night when they couldn't see the terrain.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/01/28/us/amtrak-501-derail-training-safety-investigation/index.html

 

[Darwin333]

I'm still amazed that they don't have some sort of tablet with GPS in the engine that gives the engineer all of the pertinent information for the section they are on and approaching. You can get an app on just about any shitty phone that will warn you if you are speeding on most roads FFS but an asshole operating a huge ass train that is carrying potentially hundreds of people has to rely on road signs?

It does sound like Amtrak screwed the pooch bigtime with training the crews though.