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Question 'Ampere'/Next-gen gaming uarch speculation thread

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O

Ottonomous

Senior member
How much is the Samsung 7nm EUV process expected to provide in terms of gains?
How will the RTX components be scaled/developed?
Any major architectural enhancements expected?
Will VRAM be bumped to 16/12/12 for the top three?
Will there be further fragmentation in the lineup? (Keeping turing at cheaper prices, while offering 'beefed up RTX' options at the top?)
Will the top card be capable of >4K60, at least 90?
Would Nvidia ever consider an HBM implementation in the gaming lineup?
Will Nvidia introduce new proprietary technologies again?

Sorry if imprudent/uncalled for, just interested in the forum member's thoughts.
 
maddie said:
Just thinking this. How many gamers can realistically fit this?
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My thought to. I have a relative small case in length and with power connectors on top, 300mm is pretty much the biggest that will fit. (never version of my case can remove the hdd cage to a much bigger card would fit). Anyway at that size you bascially need a case that always hdd cage removal.

MrTeal said:
If I'm measuring it right compared to the 267mm 2080 FE, this card is ~326mm long. I had a triple slot dual 290X Devil 13 that weighed 5 lbs and came with a little stick that you used wedged between the card and the bottom of the case for extra support. That card was 305mm long. There's a lot of ATX cases that something like this wouldn't fit in.

This almost has to be fake.
Click to expand...

True still have a 290x and certainly only a handful of models were short enough to fit my case + power connectors on top. And the pricing...Would have had interest in NV card for some playing with AI but well...if ru mors are true I rather wait and see what AMD has to offer. NV will have to lower prices once AMD and consoles launch.
 
beginner99 said:
My thought to. I have a relative small case in length and with power connectors on top, 300mm is pretty much the biggest that will fit. (never version of my case can remove the hdd cage to a much bigger card would fit). Anyway at that size you bascially need a case that always hdd cage removal.
Click to expand...

Does it matter? How many Titan class cards did you purchase in the past?
 
BFG10K said:
Looks like the rumors of the furnace and the ridiculous cooler were correct. No way will this tri-slot monstrosity be the same price as a 2080Ti, I expect $1500-$2000.
Click to expand...

If it's going to cost $2,000 it has to perform like it. I'm not sure consumers are going to accept another generational price hike without substantial performance gains.

Unlike Pascal and Turing there should be legitimate competition in the high end which further limits a company's ability to charge prices like this. It worked in the past because consumers had no high-end alternatives.

The rumored prices seem a little odd as well because it leaves a lot of $200 holes to fill. No doubt this is something eventual SUPER cards are meant to address, but I think it also makes it harder for NVidia to upsell their own products in the mid-range.

The other thing I've been wondering about is what the low-end and mainstream product stack is going to look like. The 16xx cards were a good approach last time. Are those staying around, because I don't think I've heard any rumors about 26xx cards. Even with RT improvements in Ampere, I still don't see the point of including it in anything below the 3060.
 
Mopetar said:
The other thing I've been wondering about is what the low-end and mainstream product stack is going to look like. The 16xx cards were a good approach last time. Are those staying around, because I don't think I've heard any rumors about 26xx cards. Even with RT improvements in Ampere, I still don't see the point of including it in anything below the 3060.
Click to expand...

Def going to be RT throughout the entire stack. AMD will be the same way. It would still be much better in RT compared to other low end cards without any HWRT.

Only exception would be the mx450, and that's solely for Tiger Lake laptops.
 
maddie said:
Just thinking this. How many gamers can realistically fit this?
Click to expand...

Im more guessing it probably definitely tosses SLI out completely...

How many boards can you count with a 3 card spacing between the full 16x pci slots.
 
BFG10K said:
Looks like the rumors of the furnace and the ridiculous cooler were correct. No way will this tri-slot monstrosity be the same price as a 2080Ti, I expect $1500-$2000.
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I don't think so. Granted, a lot depends on AMD's eventual pricing and performance, but the sheer ridiculousness of this cooler smells like desperation. It's not like Ampere itself "runs hot" considering the efficiency of past architectures, it's just Nvidia pursuing extremely aggressive clockspeeds because they perceive a weaker competitive position. Since Kepler, Nvidia products have had plenty of room to increase performance at the expense of thermals. Like, if when the 7970 launched it had been 50% faster, you wouldn't have seen the efficient power sipping 680 we got in response. Whatever product ended up using GK104 would be hotter, louder, faster, more expensive to produce, and yet cheaper for consumers.

That said, if Nvidia launches first (which it looks like they will), then it's still reasonable to expect a high initial price. We could end up with a repeat of the GTX 280 / HD 4870 situation... which would be great. Although to be honest that cooler seems more reminiscent of Fermi or FX.
 
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nVidia has always launched first in the last 10 years, except Tahiti <> Kepler. We cant assume nothing about the timing.
 
Konan said:
For several years AMD has had new node advantage. For a quicker cadence we’ll have to see next time what that looks like because there hasn't really been any change for a while. I’d agree their sprint to new nodes and their roadmap is half decent. The thing is just the sheer R+D Nvidia and soon to be Intel have. MCM I expect Nvidia to come out on top even on an older node. Don’t see that changing anytime soon.
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Several years???

Navi came out last summer, before that nVidia had the node advantage. In terms of CPU, Intel has had the advantage until last summer.

Samsung's 8nm is technically newer than TSMC's 7nm. Its just not as refined.

It will be interesting to see if nVidia also ramps up their cadence. For the last several years there was no need for them too, because they had the market cornered.
 
aigomorla said:
Im more guessing it probably definitely tosses SLI out completely...

How many boards can you count with a 3 card spacing between the full 16x pci slots.
Click to expand...
Most of them at least in the mainstream category, actually. When I moved from X99 to Ryzen I looked for an X570 board with two slot spacing between x16s so I could keep using my existing SLI-HB bridge and EK water bridge. Couldn't find one, so I just ended up selling one of my 1080Ti's.
 
Stuka87 said:
Several years???

Navi came out last summer, before that nVidia had the node advantage. In terms of CPU, Intel has had the advantage until last summer.

Samsung's 8nm is technically newer than TSMC's 7nm. Its just not as refined.

It will be interesting to see if nVidia also ramps up their cadence. For the last several years there was no need for them too, because they had the market cornered.
Click to expand...

Yes, several years. Go back a bit further still and it is the same pattern.
AMD has been 1st to new launch products on nodes between the two especially with major launches. In the years that were the same AMD launched first.
Some history shows that there isn't such a need to rush to a new node. However, half node changes these days play a big part.

21.png
 
Here we go, once again the rumor/speculation was true. 2x8pin to 12pin adapter:

www.techpowerup.com

Picture Proof of NVIDIA 12-pin Power Connector: Seasonic Ships Modular Adapters

Leading PSU manufacturer Seasonic is shipping a modular cable that confirms NVIDIA's proprietary 12-pin graphics card power connector for its upcoming GeForce "Ampere" graphics cards. Back in July we did an in-depth analysis of the connector, backed by confirmation from various industry sources...
www.techpowerup.com www.techpowerup.com

Recommended for 850W PSUs or better, all to power a single GPU.

It's now 100% certain this thing is a furnace. What we don't know is why. There's only two possible reasons: garbage manufacturing/design, or RDNA2 is far better than anyone expects.
 
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BFG10K said:
There's only two possible reasons: garbage manufacturing/design, or RDNA2 is far better than anyone expects.
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What if both, caused by Nvidia's huge mistake: underestimating AMD's capabilities of silicon physical design? 😉
 
Glo. said:
What if both, caused by Nvidia's huge mistake: underestimating AMD's capabilities of silicon physical design? 😉
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I believe RDNA2 will be only 20% faster than 2080Ti.

What I think has happened is similar to the 1080Ti situation: Ampere is much faster than it needs to be because nVidia panicked for no reason. I also think Ampere has serious manufacturing issues on 8nm Samsung because of that die size .

This is speculation on my part, so we'll see.
 
Ive just realized what is going on with this strange oversized 3090 and odd cooling setup..

There is an Ampere chip on BOTH sides of the card in some kind of DUAL GPU SLI/NVLink one card setup. 🙂

Otherwise, it suggests Nvidia is running scared of RDNA2 and has OCed the bejesus out of this.

Hoping for 1st scenario, I have cash waiting for it!
 
marcUK2 said:
Ive just realized what is going on with this strange oversized 3090 and odd cooling setup..
Click to expand...

Nope....Probably Jen-Hsun Huang's e-peen couldn't hang with all the " Big Navi " talk spreading all over the internet. They did the BIG Huge Ampere to satisfy his ego. Depending on the outcome he can still at least claim his is bigger....
 
marcUK2 said:
Ive just realized what is going on with this strange oversized 3090 and odd cooling setup..

There is an Ampere chip on BOTH sides of the card in some kind of DUAL GPU SLI/NVLink one card setup. 🙂

Otherwise, it suggests Nvidia is running scared of RDNA2 and has OCed the bejesus out of this.

Hoping for 1st scenario, I have cash waiting for it!
Click to expand...
There is no dual GPU card in Ampere customer lineup
 
Glo. said:
What if both, caused by Nvidia's huge mistake: underestimating AMD's capabilities of silicon physical design? 😉
Click to expand...

Sure, "underestimated". Makes no sense. Even a GP107 produced on Samsung's 14nm LPP is as efficient as Navi.
And yet we should believe that nVidia cant produce something better than Pascal.

Ampere will have >6 billion transistors more than Navi. It will be hard for AMD to even come close to GA102. Competition is the Chip below it.
 
sontin said:
Sure, "underestimated". Makes no sense. Even a GP107 produced on Samsung's 14nm LPP is as efficient as Navi.
And yet we should believe that nVidia cant produce something better than Pascal.

Ampere will have >6 billion transistors more than Navi. It will be hard for AMD to even come close to GA102. Competition is the Chip below it.
Click to expand...
If your post is indication of how Nvidia engineers thought - yes, it makes perfect sense, they underestimated AMD's capabilities, and talent 😉.

Arrogance is the fastest way to make mistakes 😉.
 
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