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Americans truely are some ignorant people. [Observation]

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Americans are da shi*! step off m**** f**** or our pimp Bill Clinton is gonna git you sucka. And you don't want to make Bill mad~

Honestly, I think americans are rude simply cuz we are spoiled. Spoiled children do not realize how blessed they are. And when put in a foreign environment, they come off as cocky and rude. I am sure if an American stayed in a foreign country for a long time, he would acclimate himself quite nicely. Like I said, americans are da shi*!!

muahaha, latez.
 
apoppin

Did you read the thread title? He made the assertion that Americans are ignorant, and one of the reasons he thought they were so was that they didn't speak multiple languages. I was simply responding to his accusation.

And as far as Spanish as a second language in the US, why is that? Is it perhaps because of all the Spanish speakers that move here and are too arrogant, lazy, or rude to bother learning English? What's good for the goose is good for the gander. People are the same all over the world. If I had to take a guess as to why there might be more rude Americans abroad, it's because there is a higher percentage of Americans that have the financial means to travel.


And just so you don't think I'm a dumb redneck defending Americans, ich spreche ein bischen Deutsch, un peu Francais, to sukoshi Nihongo. Unfortunately I've never had the privelege of traveling overseas to use my l33t language skillz. 😉
 
<<ig·no·rant (gnr-nt)
adj.

1. Lacking education or knowledge.
2. Showing or arising from a lack of education or knowledge: an ignorant mistake.
3. Unaware or uninformed.>>

Ignorant is the correct word, BoberFett, when especially referring to American's &quot;lack of education or knowledge&quot; in regard to a second language. Note he did not say stupid.

I think it is awesome that you speak several languages and I hope some day you get to put them into practice in travel. It makes for a wonderful life experience.

Learning a second language (or more) is simply an advantage. In my case, I make more money from Spanish-speaking people that would otherwise not buy my service as they are not fluent in English (yet). And there are so many people coming here from Mexico, that market is not to be ignored. All of their children will speak both languages fluently.

BTW, you are right - I don't read &quot;ignorant&quot; the same way that you do (at least I don't take offence) so I glossed over the title and couldn't find any further reference to the word in the first post.
 
BoberFett

In all respect, you can't profess to know what it's like watching Americans behave overseas until you go there and see it for yourself. Saying it's just because a higher percentage of Americans travel sounds rational when sitting in your computer chair, but when you go there you'll see what we're talking about. I'm not trying to stereotype. I met some very nice Americans who were both educated and inquisitve (not to mention respectful), but they were in the minority.

And your stance on foreigners learning English is kind of skirting this issue. As others have said, learning a second language is more of a cultural awareness issue, not necessarily something one does only out of necessity. I can't tell you how many Americans just walked up to locals in some of these countries and started spouting off English--EXPECTING the person to know English fluently. I don't know about you, but I haven't had many foreigners in this country just start talking to me in their native language with the expectation that I'll be able to understand.

It's not so much the way that Americans don't know foreign languages, it's that we expect everyone else to know English. That's the bigger problem.

l2c
 
I think it goes both ways. I'm a Canadian living in Canada but working with a group that is base out of the southern US. The people I work with are great and very worldly. Since I'm in Quebec several of them have even made an attempt to speak to me in French. Pretty fun as I'm actually an Anglophone. Certainly would not consider them the &quot;Ugly American&quot;.

On the other had I did a trip to France 4 years ago with a bunch of Americans. Some of them made a real effort to speak French while we were there. Other did even try. Guess which group got a more positive response.

I'm think of going to Italy next year and plan to take some language courses before I go. I think you get more out of your trip that way.
 
---Without reading through all the posts---

Most people in other countries speak English as well as their native lanquage because English is becoming a world standard. For instance all Air Traffic controllers must speak English and most scientific conferences are in English (or so I have heard).

The foriegners do this to accomodate English speaking visitors, who need to feel comfortable enough to keep coming back (and spending money).

You have to learn to adjust. When I traveled to Miami for business, knowing a little Spanish was a must.

I think it is not really that Americans are ignorant, it is that we are the greatest country in the world and that other nations have to accomodate us.

Should other lanquages be taught in schools? Maybe. Maybe we should try harder to make sure our kids actually learn the courses already taught?
 
apoppin

I do take offense at being labeled ignorant. I don't take offense at being called stupid. Maybe I'm bass-ackwards, but if a person is stupid it's genetic and not their fault, there's nothing to be ashamed of. Being called ignorant is a slap in the face, because one is ignorant only by choice, since it can be overcome.

luv2chill

<< In all respect, you can't profess to know what it's like watching Americans behave overseas until you go there and see it for yourself >>

That is true. But I can't help but get the feeling that JollyRoger has blown this somewhat out of proportion in order to prove a point, or perhaps try make himself appear superior to other Americans. That he is somehow enlightened beyond other people.

<< learning a second language is more of a cultural awareness issue, not necessarily something one does only out of necessity >>

Do you really think that every child in foreign country who learns English is doing it because of cultural awareness? I highly doubt it. It's just a fact that English has become somewhat of a de facto standard for business, like it or not.
 
BoberFett


<< That is true. But I can't help but get the feeling that JollyRoger has blown this somewhat out of proportion in order to prove a point, or perhaps try make himself appear superior to other Americans. That he is somehow enlightened beyond other people. >>


This is not true, nearly everyone outside of the US thinks the same. I know, I live in the part of the world that is not US.
 
You know why English has become a world standard? NovaTerra hit the nail on the head. It's because Americans (the British started it) insisted on it. That may be the case &quot;like it or not&quot; but it doesn't make it right.

&quot;We don't learn foreign languages because we don't have to.&quot; &quot;We're the greatest country in the world.&quot; &quot;Other countries will adapt to us and learn our language because they're inferior and want to accomodate us.&quot;

It's statements like these that take patriotism too far. We are ALL equal--despite what anybody thinks. Take away all of the &quot;stuff&quot; Americans have and we're just the same as starving kid in Africa. Too many Americans don't believe that.

l2c
 


<< Do you really think that every child in foreign country who learns English is doing it because of cultural awareness? I highly doubt it. It's just a fact that English has become somewhat of a de facto standard for business, like it or not. >>

You are right of course, but I think it's still a good thing that they're learning a second language.


<< By the way, the most ignorant people in my opinion is people from China. >>

Heheh, isn't Taiwan part of China? 😉 Anyways, I can't agree with you on that one. Every country has its obnoxious tourists, and so far I've met just as many obnoxious Taiwanese tourists as I have mainland Chinese ones. However, having been to both China and Taiwan several times, most of the people I've met in both countries have been quite nice to me.


<< But I can't help but get the feeling that JollyRoger has blown this somewhat out of proportion in order to prove a point, or perhaps try make himself appear superior to other Americans. That he is somehow enlightened beyond other people. >>

I have to agree to an extent with JoLLyRoGer's attitude. Hopefully that doesn't make me a holier-than-thou knob. 😉 (I'm giving myself and JoLLyRoGer the benefit of the doubt... 😛) Anyways, I just cringe when I'm overseas with other Canadians who loudly complain when things aren't the same as in Canada. The same thing happens even within Canada... I was on a trip once to Mount Tremblant in Quebec. When we crossed the &quot;border&quot; the Torontonians kept on making idiotic French-jokes. The francophone hotel guys that met us just politely took it. No wonder they dislike the English so much.


<< My friends father was in Paris with few coworkers and they went to a resturant. When they were there they could hardly get any service, even though it was a 5 star resturant. Then when they finaly managed to get a waiter to come to the table they found out why. The waiters thought they were americans so the waiters pretty much ignored them, that was because the english accent my friends father and his coworkers had. When they explained to the waiters that they were from Iceland then they got the best service ever. >>

And that is just bloody obnoxious. If I had heard that explanation I would have just walked out right there, and then written a review about that &quot;5 star&quot; restaurant. That is pure crap and should not be tolerated.
 
Americans don't know multiple languages because most of us don't need to learn/speak them. I personally went all the way to the school district superintendent to get out learning a foreign language way back in high school because it would be waste of time! I would rather spend my time learning something that I will get to use in my lifetime.

I was an army brat (my mom retired as a Lieutenant Colonel in the US Army) and have moved a half dozen times while visiting and living in 14 different countries. I can most assuredly tell you that the only other countries I could stand are England, Canada, and Switzerland.

I am VERY proud to be a citizen and supporter of the United States of America.

One thing I should point out is I don?t necessarily have hatred or distaste for the other 11 countries I have been too, but my experiences have given me a bias one way or another.

Btw: I personally think it ?IS? our job to represent our country with the class or dignity it deserves when communication or dealing with foreign visitors or hosts. From past experience, I am a very courteous and patient person when in a foreign country. 😀
 
I was forced to learn french for 9 years. After visiting a total of 11 countries in my short life (6 of which use English as native language, two of which used french) and still being unable to speak french I've come to the conclusion that for most of us, learning more than English (if it is your native language) is a waste of time. Why would I spend 3 years mastering German, for instance? So that if I ever go there I can ask somebody where the nearest restaurant is?

I'm not an international business man and I'm not working in a foreign consolate. For me there are much better things to learn with a higher investment return than learning some language I may or may not ever use on a vacation. That is why I have nothing more than a very feint desire to learn more than English. Sure it would be nice, but am I going to bother? No.
 
You should see how poorly many Americans treat their own. If they treat somebody from their own country like sh!t, how do you think they treat somebody from another country?

 
I'm not discounting some rational points that BobberFett makes. True I'm sure in some instances multiple languages are learned out of necessity. However, I feel that it won't be much longer before it is a necessity in our country as well. Especially considering all of the recent globalization taking place due to technological advances in our society. It is inherently becoming a smaller world. Sooner or later everyone will have to adapt to that.

As far as claiming that American's are ignorant. I don't fail to put include myself in that statement. I only speak one language; therefore I am &quot;ignorant&quot; i.e. having lack of knowledge of any foreign language. By the same scope; American's, not all, but a substantial number, are in fact ignorant of other foreign cultures, and of the fact that those countries judge us by what they see. What I've seen I can't say I'm proud of. The error is not in the fact that one doesn't know. The error lies with the expectation that every country and culture should &quot;accommodate&quot; Americans. Why?? Why do most Americans think that another country should &quot;accommodate&quot; Americans? Just because we are Americans?? Who do we accommodate??

I'm not saying that I would ever want to live somewhere else. I LOVE America. In my opinion it IS the best place to live and I would never choose to live anywhere else. I don't consider myself any better than you or anyone else. I'm simply stating my own observations based on what I've experienced. It's my opinion. I don't mean to come across as &quot;Holier than Thou&quot;. The post wasn't even really about language as much as it is about attitudes. The language part was more of a &quot;lead-in&quot;. And I don't expect EVERY one to agree with me. But the point is, there is a certain level of respect that should be given when you are in another country. I see a lot of &quot;ugly Americans&quot; around here and for the love of my country and it's reputation, I wish more people didn't act that way.

JR..
 
How bout this one - I took 6 years of foreign language (Spanish) throughout highschool and college - but you know what? I forgot it because OF LACK OF NEED. Last time I checked Iowa was 99% white/caucasion and 1% &quot;other&quot;.

I'm sure that there are many others out there just like me.
 
I guess, BoberFett, we look at &quot;ignorant&quot; and &quot;stupid&quot; very differently.

I know there is always something (a lot!) I am ignorant of. However, I don't feel &quot;stupid&quot; unless I can't learn about it. For me &quot;stupid&quot; is more of an insult (as I am wont to insult myself - see my sig below).

<<stu·pid (stpd, sty-)
adj. stu·pid·er, stu·pid·est.

1. Slow to learn or understand; obtuse.
2. Lacking or marked by a lack of intelligence.>>

And really, you can't talk about fellow Americans as tourists until you seem them in action. I was simply blown-away by what I observed in Ireland and Brazil (and Mexico).

However, living in Hawaii, Japanese Tourists must be seen to be belived. I have never seen anyone stand out so badly as there.
 
OK. That's fine. I grew up in &quot;Bug Tussle&quot; Illinois. I took Spanish in high school. I barely remember how to ask, &quot;What time is it&quot;. But let me ask you this. How long would it take you to recover what you've already learned, opposed to someone who has never had a Spanish class in their life?? And like I've already stated. I really ment to gear this post more toward the attitudes of tourists when visiting another nation.
 
If you really take seriously the notion that we have hidden feelings of inferiority you can learn alot. Any subject that touches on identity, race, language, nation, religion, politics, and millions of etceras, comes bound up with emotion. I am this thing and secretly I feel bad, so criticize the thing and you waken the feelings. This is the source of defensiveness. This is why the American traveler, limbs all akimbo, retorts, &quot;How much is that in real money.&quot; The unfamiliarity and challenge of a foreign place wake his inferiority complex and he puts down to defend. Since, however, Americans are intensly embarassing to other Americans, ie since their bad behavior rubs off on us, we are hypersensitive to and particularly attuned to the behavior of just that group.

Through the careful and judicious practice of conscious awareness of where my inferiority was coloring my vision, I was able to see the peolpe of the world clearly and attain the vaunted stature achieved by my own father, namely, as he put it, &quot;to be 200% American, to hate everybody equally&quot;. 😀
 
. When we crossed the &quot;border&quot; the Torontonians kept on making idiotic French-jokes. The francophone hotel guys that met us just politely took it. No wonder they dislike the English so much.

Please don't let that incident judge the whole of Toronto. Toronto is not just another Englishcity, it's more of a multicultural city. It is very common to hear conversation by a group of people talking in (lets say) Hindi in a bus or any public places.

There are ignorant idiots in Toronto, but there are millions of ignorant idiots all over the world.

BTW, For the sake of the argument. I can turn around and say the same thing about the Quebecois. On my last visit, many were nice enough to help me and talk to me, but some were down right rude. I don't know how to speak French, but I do know more then 1 language (English is my second language). 🙂
 
Actually last time I was in Europe I travelled arround the Netherlands for a week with pile driver from Seatle on compo (that's Oz talk for a compensation payout) &amp; he was the best of company. Even though I think traveling through Europe with Kim Basinger might have been better. But beggers can't be chosers.

Of course the ugly American exists (what is it with middle aged American men &amp; wearing chequered golf pants when they travel) but its a grose generalisation. Maybe the American education system needs improvement as far as teaching international history &amp; international geography are concerned. But maybe a lot of it is to do with socio-economics. In Europe &amp; Australia, tertiary education is virtually free, whereas in the US it costs thousands. Or maybe the US education system is just a bit too American-centric.

As far as languages are concerned, the main reason why Europeans are generally speaking so good at languages is because in most European countries its compulsary to learn at least a 2nd language (&amp; preferably a 3rd language too) from the age of 6.

&quot;Americans travel more than most others so their tourism money is considerable.&quot;

Ah TPR, Americans are the least travelled of all westerners. Actually 60% of Americans will never apply for a passport, which in effect means that the majority of Americans never travel oversea (I think I got that out of 'Readers Diagest' while waiting to get a hair cut).

From what I can work out the main reason for this is because the vast majority of Americans get only a one or 2 weeks annual leave a year. Plus most are too ambitious to take 6 months or whatever unpaid leave to go backpacking across Europe or Asia. Whereas in more trade Union friendly climes the Average Australian or European gets at leasts 6 weeks annual leave (plus once the've added a few flex days &amp; RDOs &amp; that, it can work out to be 8 weeks or more paid leave) that they can take in one hit if they desire. Plus there's also paid long service leave of 3 months every 5 years. Consequently us Europeans &amp; Australians never hesitate to go on a overseas holiday for a couple of months or more. Also if one is willing to save there leave for about 3 years &amp; add a couple of months unpaid leave to it, one can go backpacking across Europe for 6 months or more. Actually its become a real right of passage for Europeans to take a year off during college &amp; spend a year backpacking across Asia &amp; Australia, Just as Australians always put off one year at uni, so they can spend that year backpacking across Europe.

I was stunned when I was in Europe &amp; met some American girls who flew to Amsterdam for just one weekend, what a waste of an airline ticket. I asked them why didnt they just take a months unpaid leave &amp; they said that they'd be worried about it being bad career wise or something (they were worried they'l have no job to go back to or it wouldnt look good or something). Gez, its good living in a fully unionised country. Consequently, even though there's 280 million Americans &amp; only 30 million Canadians, one comes across a lot more Canadians backpacking arround Europe than Americans. Actually I met more Canadians from just British Columbia (or Quebec for that matter) than I did Americans in the youth hostels of Europe.

Another thing I noticed in Amsterdam was that the American tourists would all make the same mistake &amp; go &amp; take photos of the girls in the redlight district, which is a big nono. They all seem to come from places where redlight districts just don't exist.EDIT: Actually that's a grose generalisation on my part, only 4 that I know of made that mistake

One thing I can tell you is that us Aussies have a different reputation in Europe, we have a reputation of always being drunk &amp; off our heads. Whereas the English have a reputation of being real cheap.
 
Dabanshee sounds pretty well travelled. I wonder if he could tell me which country has a reputation for easy women?

Oops, did I say that out loud? 😉
 
I hitched through Ireland and stayed in England for several months with an Aussie, DABANCH. After he'd had 23 pints of beer, It was all I could do to restrain him from trying to climb down the drain pipe to reach the street far far below. Lots of fun.
 
Americans travel more than most others so their tourism money is considerable.

Actually, the Japanese travel more than anyone else.

I was watching a documentary and apparently the Aussie girls are supposed to be the easiest. You have in the area of an 85% chance of sleeping with one on the first date. Ahhh, tv... an endless source of useless information.



 
Let me bring up a point that's being overlooked here.

I hope that everyone realizes that being multi-lingual causes changes in your neural pathways, however, you can know C++ and be multi-lingual.

So, actually, I know several languages. English, some Spanish, a smattering of C, VBA, and Perl.

😀

Sure, Europeans can claim to &quot;travel&quot; more than most Americans, however, England is only about the size of Arkansas. I could cross most of Europe in less time than it took to cross the United States. Everything is relative.

To Czar alone. Bud, I think you have a serious case of jealousy. Wish you had been born an American? Probably. Am I arrogant? Probably. Not purposefully. A funny thing happened to me when I was in England at school. Europeans thought I was lying when talking about culture and life in the US, I mentioned we had about 55 channels to watch. Now, this has been about 10 years ago, but I came to the startling conclusion that Americans have it so good, that no one can understand the lives we lead unless they have actually LIVED here. Strange, but in my travels, I've found it to be true thus far.
 
Repeat with me 😉

TAIWAN is Not part of China

TAIWAN is Not part of China

TAIWAN is Not part of China

Good!
 
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