Americans in Canada perfer US healthcare

[1EZduzit]

As has already been pointed out, the US has the most expensive health care system in the world, but it is far from the best...... and the problem just keeps getting worse.

It's only a matter of time until the whole thing blows up and will most likely take our whole economic system down the tubes with it, but the people still getting adequate health care could care less.

What else do you need to know?

 

[Mxylplyx]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
As has already been pointed out, the US has the most expensive health care system in the world, but it is far from the best...... and the problem just keeps getting worse.

It's only a matter of time until the whole thing blows up and will most likely take our whole economic system down the tubes with it, but the people still getting adequate health care could care less.

What else do you need to know?

I believe the U.S. does have by far the best quality health care available.....for those that can afford it. Just as Skoorb said above, Just because we're not the healthiest, doesnt mean we dont have the best care in the world. Most these people setting world records for how old they are live in places with relatively poor healthcare, but eat very healthy diets. They dont have our overcomplicated lives that necessitate a quick stop at Mcdonalds when we are in a hurry.

 

[dullard]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
If there is actual proof that the average cancer patient or hearth patient or diabetese patient gets superior medical coverage/care in Canada than the US, then you'll change my opinion on it 🙂

I don't have the link here of course, but I did read (about a decade ago) a summary of a study comparing the care in various countries. Bar none, the US had the best diagnostic ability of the countries that were considered. If something is wrong with you, you are best off going to the US to be diagnosed. But after that, people in other countries with a proper diagnosis were far more likely to survive the condition.

Cliffnotes:
The US wins at detecting problems.
Other countries win at curing/treating that problem once detected.

 

[Mxylplyx]

Originally posted by: dullard

Originally posted by: Skoorb
If there is actual proof that the average cancer patient or hearth patient or diabetese patient gets superior medical coverage/care in Canada than the US, then you'll change my opinion on it 🙂

I don't have the link here of course, but I did read (about a decade ago) a summary of a study comparing the care in various countries. Bar none, the US had the best diagnostic ability of the countries that were considered. If something is wrong with you, you are best off going to the US to be diagnosed. But after that, people in other countries with a proper diagnosis were far more likely to survive the condition.

Cliffnotes:
The US wins at detecting problems.
Other countries win at curing/treating that problem once detected.

I think your data is skewed by the people in the U.S. who cant afford the proper treatment. I believe that if you compare the subset of Americans that have comprehensive health insurance to the citizens of other countries, you would find that our care is better.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
As has already been pointed out, the US has the most expensive health care system in the world, but it is far from the best...... and the problem just keeps getting worse.

It's only a matter of time until the whole thing blows up and will most likely take our whole economic system down the tubes with it, but the people still getting adequate health care could care less.

What else do you need to know?

I believe the U.S. does have by far the best quality health care available.....for those that can afford it. Just as Skoorb said above, Just because we're not the healthiest, doesnt mean we dont have the best care in the world. Most these people setting world records for how old they are live in places with relatively poor healthcare, but eat very healthy diets. They dont have our overcomplicated lives that necessitate a quick stop at Mcdonalds when we are in a hurry.

So just as long as you have insurance everything is fine? Spoken like a young pup who doesn't know any better. One day you will realize that sh-t happens that can't be avoided no matter what your diet/exercise habits are and businesses are already doing their best to get rid of employees with serious health issues.

The way things are going health care is only going to get worse AND more expensive. Health care costs can't continue groing at twice the inflation rate forever, so all we are doing by not addressing the problem is delaying the inevitable and causing undue illness, suffering, and death.

Isn't capitalism great!! I got mine so fuk U!! Health care should cost EVERYBODY the same and if some people can't afford it then they should be subsidized. After all, what is the purpose of having a civilization if it doesn't equally protect the weak and the strong?

 

[ericlp]

Originally posted by: Shivetya

Originally posted by: Balt
This doesn't really show anything new. I don't think many would dispute that people with money in the United States can get excellent healthcare.

you don't have to have money to get good healt care in the United States.

After reading the first sentence I figured the rest was probably bogus too...


GOOD??? Free? Wow, that's an oxymoron.

 

[Uhtrinity]

Originally posted by: randym431
:roll:
All moot...
This should say in bold "for those that can afford it" (us health care).

Ask the millions of Americans that have no health care coverage. Ask them...

:thumbsup:

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Isn't capitalism great!! I got mine so fuk U!! Health care should cost EVERYBODY the same and if some people can't afford it then they should be subsidized. After all, what is the purpose of having a civilization if it doesn't equally protect the weak and the strong?

Why should it be equal? Most of the rest of society isn't.

One day you will realize that sh-t happens that can't be avoided no matter what your diet/exercise habits are and businesses are already doing their best to get rid of employees with serious health issues.

Except most people do not take care of themselves AT ALL, so if you're going to appeal to me for a little altruism, don't bother. I excercise and eat well and take care of myself, the last thing I need is some dumbass without insurance who eats doritos and mcdonalds all day complaining about lack of health care, as if they are unable to encourage better health in themselves, and that goes for everybody. At least those with private are not whining about it.

Until people take more control of their lifestyles, since lifestyle plays an important part in illness, I will not shed a tear at all for somebody who's suffering from an illness brought on by their apathetic indolence. Why would I care, if they cannot?

And yes, some people without isnurance have an unprevantable illness. For them it sucks. It would suck for me if I had to wait 9 months for a diagnosis on an unprevantable illness because we were all getting delayed care.

 

[Mxylplyx]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
As has already been pointed out, the US has the most expensive health care system in the world, but it is far from the best...... and the problem just keeps getting worse.

It's only a matter of time until the whole thing blows up and will most likely take our whole economic system down the tubes with it, but the people still getting adequate health care could care less.

What else do you need to know?

I believe the U.S. does have by far the best quality health care available.....for those that can afford it. Just as Skoorb said above, Just because we're not the healthiest, doesnt mean we dont have the best care in the world. Most these people setting world records for how old they are live in places with relatively poor healthcare, but eat very healthy diets. They dont have our overcomplicated lives that necessitate a quick stop at Mcdonalds when we are in a hurry.

So just as long as you have insurance everything is fine? Spoken like a young pup who doesn't know any better. One day you will realize that sh-t happens that can't be avoided no matter what your diet/exercise habits are and businesses are already doing their best to get rid of employees with serious health issues.

The way things are going health care is only going to get worse AND more expensive. Health care costs can't continue groing at twice the inflation rate forever, so all we are doing by not addressing the problem is delaying the inevitable and causing undue illness, suffering, and death.

Isn't capitalism great!! I got mine so fuk U!! Health care should cost EVERYBODY the same and if some people can't afford it then they should be subsidized. After all, what is the purpose of having a civilization if it doesn't equally protect the weak and the strong?

At no point in my post did I address which system is preferable. I merely stated that I believe we have the best quality care available for those that can afford it. Whether reducing the quality or availability of care for one group in order to provide at best decent health care to everyone is another debate. I guess some of my reading comprehension skills are still intact being a "young pup" and all.

 

[Mavrick]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Except most people do not take care of themselves AT ALL, so if you're going to appeal to me for a little altruism, don't bother. I excercise and eat well and take care of myself, the last thing I need is some dumbass without insurance who eats doritos and mcdonalds all day complaining about lack of health care, as if they are unable to encourage better health in themselves, and that goes for everybody. At least those with private are not whining about it.

Until people take more control of their lifestyles, since lifestyle plays an important part in illness, I will not shed a tear at all for somebody who's suffering from an illness brought on by their apathetic indolence. Why would I care, if they cannot?

Until you get assaulted by a sick homeless with a syringe full of AIDS or hepatitis who desperately wants money so he can buy pills. On that day, you'll see that all the private insurance you've got and all the healthy living you have can't help you no more...

Offering universal healthcare is a service the rich people pay for in exchange of social peace and cohesion. You help other people, and you help yourself at the same time.

 

[desy]

My we both have slid in the last couple yrs 🙂
We both used to bout 20th when I looked at 3 yrs or so ago

 

[Martin]

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
As has already been pointed out, the US has the most expensive health care system in the world, but it is far from the best...... and the problem just keeps getting worse.

It's only a matter of time until the whole thing blows up and will most likely take our whole economic system down the tubes with it, but the people still getting adequate health care could care less.

What else do you need to know?

I believe the U.S. does have by far the best quality health care available.....for those that can afford it. Just as Skoorb said above, Just because we're not the healthiest, doesnt mean we dont have the best care in the world. Most these people setting world records for how old they are live in places with relatively poor healthcare, but eat very healthy diets. They dont have our overcomplicated lives that necessitate a quick stop at Mcdonalds when we are in a hurry.

So just as long as you have insurance everything is fine? Spoken like a young pup who doesn't know any better. One day you will realize that sh-t happens that can't be avoided no matter what your diet/exercise habits are and businesses are already doing their best to get rid of employees with serious health issues.

The way things are going health care is only going to get worse AND more expensive. Health care costs can't continue groing at twice the inflation rate forever, so all we are doing by not addressing the problem is delaying the inevitable and causing undue illness, suffering, and death.

Isn't capitalism great!! I got mine so fuk U!! Health care should cost EVERYBODY the same and if some people can't afford it then they should be subsidized. After all, what is the purpose of having a civilization if it doesn't equally protect the weak and the strong?

At no point in my post did I address which system is preferable. I merely stated that I believe we have the best quality care available for those that can afford it. Whether reducing the quality or availability of care for one group in order to provide at best decent health care to everyone is another debate. I guess some of my reading comprehension skills are still intact being a "young pup" and all.

So... if we ignore all the faults in the American system, then it's the best in the world? Nice. But what if we ignore all the faults in the Canadian system? Wouldn't it them be the best in the world as well?

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: Martin

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
As has already been pointed out, the US has the most expensive health care system in the world, but it is far from the best...... and the problem just keeps getting worse.

It's only a matter of time until the whole thing blows up and will most likely take our whole economic system down the tubes with it, but the people still getting adequate health care could care less.

What else do you need to know?

I believe the U.S. does have by far the best quality health care available.....for those that can afford it. Just as Skoorb said above, Just because we're not the healthiest, doesnt mean we dont have the best care in the world. Most these people setting world records for how old they are live in places with relatively poor healthcare, but eat very healthy diets. They dont have our overcomplicated lives that necessitate a quick stop at Mcdonalds when we are in a hurry.

So just as long as you have insurance everything is fine? Spoken like a young pup who doesn't know any better. One day you will realize that sh-t happens that can't be avoided no matter what your diet/exercise habits are and businesses are already doing their best to get rid of employees with serious health issues.

The way things are going health care is only going to get worse AND more expensive. Health care costs can't continue groing at twice the inflation rate forever, so all we are doing by not addressing the problem is delaying the inevitable and causing undue illness, suffering, and death.

Isn't capitalism great!! I got mine so fuk U!! Health care should cost EVERYBODY the same and if some people can't afford it then they should be subsidized. After all, what is the purpose of having a civilization if it doesn't equally protect the weak and the strong?

At no point in my post did I address which system is preferable. I merely stated that I believe we have the best quality care available for those that can afford it. Whether reducing the quality or availability of care for one group in order to provide at best decent health care to everyone is another debate. I guess some of my reading comprehension skills are still intact being a "young pup" and all.

So... if we ignore all the faults in the American system, then it's the best in the world? Nice. But what if we ignore all the faults in the Canadian system? Wouldn't it them be the best in the world as well?

I just tried it and it works! Sweet!!

😀

 

[Balt]

Originally posted by: Shivetya

Originally posted by: Balt
This doesn't really show anything new. I don't think many would dispute that people with money in the United States can get excellent healthcare.

you don't have to have money to get good healt care in the United States.

There was an excellent post on Digg the other day about a young guy with no insurance that basically got his kidney work done for free. No hassles. He met the requirements and it was done.

All Americans have health care, some just have it paid for by private sources, the rest are covered by the taxpayer. Its "direct" health insurance that many are missing. Yet, considering the hospitals with emergency rooms cannot refuse to help how can anyone claim health care does not exist?


on a side note, repeated it many times, our family friends who live in Canada cross the border for all serious surgeries or stuff that is life threatening but time doesn't permit them to wait for their system to act.

The Emergency Room is not the best (nor the most efficient/cheapest) to receive health care in many situations. Many trips to the ER could be avoided with proper medication and preventative care. If a guy has high blood pressure but can't afford to go to a general physician to get it diagnosed or afford the prescription medications without a co-pay, he's going to cost everyone a lot more money when he goes to the ER with a heart attack or stroke.

 

[Ferocious]

The participants were upper middle-class, mostly the kind of people likely to be well-insured in the U.S., said Lewis.

Yeah this is consistant with other studies I've read. The rich and upper middle classes do prefer the US system.

But I am astonished that 40% of this upper middle-class STILL preferred the Canadian system. Wow.:Q

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

Originally posted by: dullard

Originally posted by: Skoorb
If there is actual proof that the average cancer patient or hearth patient or diabetese patient gets superior medical coverage/care in Canada than the US, then you'll change my opinion on it 🙂

I don't have the link here of course, but I did read (about a decade ago) a summary of a study comparing the care in various countries. Bar none, the US had the best diagnostic ability of the countries that were considered. If something is wrong with you, you are best off going to the US to be diagnosed. But after that, people in other countries with a proper diagnosis were far more likely to survive the condition.

Cliffnotes:
The US wins at detecting problems.
Other countries win at curing/treating that problem once detected.

Again this is what's WRONG with US 'health' care. The best diagnostic technology is not the same thing at being the best at diagnosing disease. 99% of people with a really bad headache have . . . a really bad headache. For the 1% with an identifiable cause virtually all of them will be diagnosed by a thorough history, review of systems, and physical exam. Headache is one of the top 10 reasons for an outpatient medical visit. An EXPERT clinician WILL find SERIOUS disease if it's present . . . WITHOUT advanced imaging technology.

Now let's say it's just migraine. Migraine is a clinical diagnosis; CT or MRI just wastes $300 and $1100, respectively. Anywhere from 11 to 25 million people have migraines. Less than half of the people that take 1st line therapy (triptans) get relief 50% of time. But among people with health insurance, 42% had plans that didn't provide adequate triptan doses each month. 37% of those people (remember they have insurance) forgo filling triptan prescriptions because of cost and 63% of all patients will save triptans for just the WORST migraines due to cost and insurance issues.

During my 2nd year of medical school, I worked with a family doctor that bragged that his practice was among the top 5% in revenue in the country. Most of that revenue came from in-office procedures and markup on out-of-office lab tests. He also noted that he didn't like touching his patients.

In sum, a good doctor will use technology (advanced imaging, labs, etc) only when necessary. A poor doctor uses such technology because its all he really has.

From the above, it should be clear why we spend so much yet get so little out of our health care. Yes, personal responsibility (behavior) matters but much of the industrialized world has copied our behaviors for decades yet still have better health outcomes and spend less on health care.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
the last thing I need is some dumbass without insurance who eats doritos and mcdonalds all day complaining about lack of health care,

Yes, we all know that only people without health insurance eat at McDonalds and have unhealthy lifestyles.

Your dismissed from further intelligent conversation on this subject. The health care industry is raking screwing Americans worse then the oil industry and it always amazes me how many nut cases come out of thye woodwork to stick up for them.

If your not any smarter then that they should take your visa away and send you back to Canada.

 

[Mxylplyx]

Originally posted by: Martin

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
As has already been pointed out, the US has the most expensive health care system in the world, but it is far from the best...... and the problem just keeps getting worse.

It's only a matter of time until the whole thing blows up and will most likely take our whole economic system down the tubes with it, but the people still getting adequate health care could care less.

What else do you need to know?

I believe the U.S. does have by far the best quality health care available.....for those that can afford it. Just as Skoorb said above, Just because we're not the healthiest, doesnt mean we dont have the best care in the world. Most these people setting world records for how old they are live in places with relatively poor healthcare, but eat very healthy diets. They dont have our overcomplicated lives that necessitate a quick stop at Mcdonalds when we are in a hurry.

So just as long as you have insurance everything is fine? Spoken like a young pup who doesn't know any better. One day you will realize that sh-t happens that can't be avoided no matter what your diet/exercise habits are and businesses are already doing their best to get rid of employees with serious health issues.

The way things are going health care is only going to get worse AND more expensive. Health care costs can't continue groing at twice the inflation rate forever, so all we are doing by not addressing the problem is delaying the inevitable and causing undue illness, suffering, and death.

Isn't capitalism great!! I got mine so fuk U!! Health care should cost EVERYBODY the same and if some people can't afford it then they should be subsidized. After all, what is the purpose of having a civilization if it doesn't equally protect the weak and the strong?

At no point in my post did I address which system is preferable. I merely stated that I believe we have the best quality care available for those that can afford it. Whether reducing the quality or availability of care for one group in order to provide at best decent health care to everyone is another debate. I guess some of my reading comprehension skills are still intact being a "young pup" and all.

So... if we ignore all the faults in the American system, then it's the best in the world? Nice. But what if we ignore all the faults in the Canadian system? Wouldn't it them be the best in the world as well?

You are taking a much broader view of what "quality" entails. Our quality, for those that have access, is top notch. We need a way to extend that quality to all citizens, without reducing it for those that do have access, though this is probably impossible. If we nationalize health care, we are going to be trading quality for access. The merits of that are debatable.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: Martin

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
As has already been pointed out, the US has the most expensive health care system in the world, but it is far from the best...... and the problem just keeps getting worse.

It's only a matter of time until the whole thing blows up and will most likely take our whole economic system down the tubes with it, but the people still getting adequate health care could care less.

What else do you need to know?

I believe the U.S. does have by far the best quality health care available.....for those that can afford it. Just as Skoorb said above, Just because we're not the healthiest, doesnt mean we dont have the best care in the world. Most these people setting world records for how old they are live in places with relatively poor healthcare, but eat very healthy diets. They dont have our overcomplicated lives that necessitate a quick stop at Mcdonalds when we are in a hurry.

So just as long as you have insurance everything is fine? Spoken like a young pup who doesn't know any better. One day you will realize that sh-t happens that can't be avoided no matter what your diet/exercise habits are and businesses are already doing their best to get rid of employees with serious health issues.

The way things are going health care is only going to get worse AND more expensive. Health care costs can't continue groing at twice the inflation rate forever, so all we are doing by not addressing the problem is delaying the inevitable and causing undue illness, suffering, and death.

Isn't capitalism great!! I got mine so fuk U!! Health care should cost EVERYBODY the same and if some people can't afford it then they should be subsidized. After all, what is the purpose of having a civilization if it doesn't equally protect the weak and the strong?

At no point in my post did I address which system is preferable. I merely stated that I believe we have the best quality care available for those that can afford it. Whether reducing the quality or availability of care for one group in order to provide at best decent health care to everyone is another debate. I guess some of my reading comprehension skills are still intact being a "young pup" and all.

So... if we ignore all the faults in the American system, then it's the best in the world? Nice. But what if we ignore all the faults in the Canadian system? Wouldn't it them be the best in the world as well?

You are taking a much broader view of what "quality" entails. Our quality, for those that have access, is top notch. We need a way to extend that quality to all citizens, without reducing it for those that do have access, though this is probably impossible. If we nationalize health care, we are going to be trading quality for access. The merits of that are debatable.

Prove it.

The richer you are the better your health care. They get the best doctors, best care, latest procedures, etc. It's always been that way and always will. I think your running scared and making assumptions in regards coming up with a universal health care plan to provide basic health care to everyone.

I fear that nothing will be done until some poor sick bastard who doesn't get the care he needs blows up a major medical center or some other such tragedy that finally wakes people up.

 

[Mxylplyx]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: Martin

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
As has already been pointed out, the US has the most expensive health care system in the world, but it is far from the best...... and the problem just keeps getting worse.

It's only a matter of time until the whole thing blows up and will most likely take our whole economic system down the tubes with it, but the people still getting adequate health care could care less.

What else do you need to know?

I believe the U.S. does have by far the best quality health care available.....for those that can afford it. Just as Skoorb said above, Just because we're not the healthiest, doesnt mean we dont have the best care in the world. Most these people setting world records for how old they are live in places with relatively poor healthcare, but eat very healthy diets. They dont have our overcomplicated lives that necessitate a quick stop at Mcdonalds when we are in a hurry.

So just as long as you have insurance everything is fine? Spoken like a young pup who doesn't know any better. One day you will realize that sh-t happens that can't be avoided no matter what your diet/exercise habits are and businesses are already doing their best to get rid of employees with serious health issues.

The way things are going health care is only going to get worse AND more expensive. Health care costs can't continue groing at twice the inflation rate forever, so all we are doing by not addressing the problem is delaying the inevitable and causing undue illness, suffering, and death.

Isn't capitalism great!! I got mine so fuk U!! Health care should cost EVERYBODY the same and if some people can't afford it then they should be subsidized. After all, what is the purpose of having a civilization if it doesn't equally protect the weak and the strong?

At no point in my post did I address which system is preferable. I merely stated that I believe we have the best quality care available for those that can afford it. Whether reducing the quality or availability of care for one group in order to provide at best decent health care to everyone is another debate. I guess some of my reading comprehension skills are still intact being a "young pup" and all.

So... if we ignore all the faults in the American system, then it's the best in the world? Nice. But what if we ignore all the faults in the Canadian system? Wouldn't it them be the best in the world as well?

You are taking a much broader view of what "quality" entails. Our quality, for those that have access, is top notch. We need a way to extend that quality to all citizens, without reducing it for those that do have access, though this is probably impossible. If we nationalize health care, we are going to be trading quality for access. The merits of that are debatable.

Prove it.

The richer you are the better your health care. They get the best doctors, best care, latest procedures, etc. It's always been that way and always will. I think your running scared and making assumptions in regards coming up with a universal health care plan to provide basic health care to everyone.

I fear that nothing will be done until some poor sick bastard who doesn't get the care he needs blows up a major medical center or some other such tragedy that finally wakes people up.

Are you trying to tell me that if the United States Federal Government, the same one managing this war, our border security, social security, etc, were to take over and run the entire health care industry, that the quality would go up?? I dont really have a problem with the concept of universal healthcare, in fact I support it, I have a problem with the idea of OUR federal government running the thing. Everything our government touches turns to crap.

This is my main beef with liberal thinkers on social issues. You have these utopian ideals of how things should work, which sound great in a sound byte, but you turn a blind eye to the miserable execution of your programs when it's up to government bureaucrats to take your utopian ideals and implement them in the real world. You just ignore the bloat, corruption, thievery, etc that plagues these programs from the start. The way some Conservatives are about HPV vaccines and abstinence programs is no different.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: Martin

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
As has already been pointed out, the US has the most expensive health care system in the world, but it is far from the best...... and the problem just keeps getting worse.

It's only a matter of time until the whole thing blows up and will most likely take our whole economic system down the tubes with it, but the people still getting adequate health care could care less.

What else do you need to know?

I believe the U.S. does have by far the best quality health care available.....for those that can afford it. Just as Skoorb said above, Just because we're not the healthiest, doesnt mean we dont have the best care in the world. Most these people setting world records for how old they are live in places with relatively poor healthcare, but eat very healthy diets. They dont have our overcomplicated lives that necessitate a quick stop at Mcdonalds when we are in a hurry.

So just as long as you have insurance everything is fine? Spoken like a young pup who doesn't know any better. One day you will realize that sh-t happens that can't be avoided no matter what your diet/exercise habits are and businesses are already doing their best to get rid of employees with serious health issues.

The way things are going health care is only going to get worse AND more expensive. Health care costs can't continue groing at twice the inflation rate forever, so all we are doing by not addressing the problem is delaying the inevitable and causing undue illness, suffering, and death.

Isn't capitalism great!! I got mine so fuk U!! Health care should cost EVERYBODY the same and if some people can't afford it then they should be subsidized. After all, what is the purpose of having a civilization if it doesn't equally protect the weak and the strong?

At no point in my post did I address which system is preferable. I merely stated that I believe we have the best quality care available for those that can afford it. Whether reducing the quality or availability of care for one group in order to provide at best decent health care to everyone is another debate. I guess some of my reading comprehension skills are still intact being a "young pup" and all.

So... if we ignore all the faults in the American system, then it's the best in the world? Nice. But what if we ignore all the faults in the Canadian system? Wouldn't it them be the best in the world as well?

You are taking a much broader view of what "quality" entails. Our quality, for those that have access, is top notch. We need a way to extend that quality to all citizens, without reducing it for those that do have access, though this is probably impossible. If we nationalize health care, we are going to be trading quality for access. The merits of that are debatable.

Prove it.

The richer you are the better your health care. They get the best doctors, best care, latest procedures, etc. It's always been that way and always will. I think your running scared and making assumptions in regards coming up with a universal health care plan to provide basic health care to everyone.

I fear that nothing will be done until some poor sick bastard who doesn't get the care he needs blows up a major medical center or some other such tragedy that finally wakes people up.

Are you trying to tell me that if the United States Federal Government, the same one managing this war, our border security, social security, etc, were to take over and run the entire health care industry, that the quality would go up?? I dont really have a problem with the concept of universal healthcare, in fact I support it, I have a problem with the idea of OUR federal government running the thing. Everything our government touches turns to crap.

This is my main beef with liberal thinkers on social issues. You have these utopian ideals of how things should work, which sound great in a sound byte, but you turn a blind eye to the miserable execution of your programs when it's up to government bureaucrats to take your utopian ideals and implement them in the real world. You just ignore the bloat, corruption, thievery, etc that plagues these programs from the start. The way some Conservatives are about HPV vaccines and abstinence programs is no different.

That would be the same goverment that freed the slaves, developed nuclear power, won WWII, sent men to the moon and returned them safely, etc., etc. The goverment can do many things well WITH THE RIGHT LEADERSHIP.

Like I said your just running scarred.

 

[Mxylplyx]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: Martin

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Mxylplyx

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
As has already been pointed out, the US has the most expensive health care system in the world, but it is far from the best...... and the problem just keeps getting worse.

It's only a matter of time until the whole thing blows up and will most likely take our whole economic system down the tubes with it, but the people still getting adequate health care could care less.

What else do you need to know?

I believe the U.S. does have by far the best quality health care available.....for those that can afford it. Just as Skoorb said above, Just because we're not the healthiest, doesnt mean we dont have the best care in the world. Most these people setting world records for how old they are live in places with relatively poor healthcare, but eat very healthy diets. They dont have our overcomplicated lives that necessitate a quick stop at Mcdonalds when we are in a hurry.

So just as long as you have insurance everything is fine? Spoken like a young pup who doesn't know any better. One day you will realize that sh-t happens that can't be avoided no matter what your diet/exercise habits are and businesses are already doing their best to get rid of employees with serious health issues.

The way things are going health care is only going to get worse AND more expensive. Health care costs can't continue groing at twice the inflation rate forever, so all we are doing by not addressing the problem is delaying the inevitable and causing undue illness, suffering, and death.

Isn't capitalism great!! I got mine so fuk U!! Health care should cost EVERYBODY the same and if some people can't afford it then they should be subsidized. After all, what is the purpose of having a civilization if it doesn't equally protect the weak and the strong?

At no point in my post did I address which system is preferable. I merely stated that I believe we have the best quality care available for those that can afford it. Whether reducing the quality or availability of care for one group in order to provide at best decent health care to everyone is another debate. I guess some of my reading comprehension skills are still intact being a "young pup" and all.

So... if we ignore all the faults in the American system, then it's the best in the world? Nice. But what if we ignore all the faults in the Canadian system? Wouldn't it them be the best in the world as well?

You are taking a much broader view of what "quality" entails. Our quality, for those that have access, is top notch. We need a way to extend that quality to all citizens, without reducing it for those that do have access, though this is probably impossible. If we nationalize health care, we are going to be trading quality for access. The merits of that are debatable.

Prove it.

The richer you are the better your health care. They get the best doctors, best care, latest procedures, etc. It's always been that way and always will. I think your running scared and making assumptions in regards coming up with a universal health care plan to provide basic health care to everyone.

I fear that nothing will be done until some poor sick bastard who doesn't get the care he needs blows up a major medical center or some other such tragedy that finally wakes people up.

Are you trying to tell me that if the United States Federal Government, the same one managing this war, our border security, social security, etc, were to take over and run the entire health care industry, that the quality would go up?? I dont really have a problem with the concept of universal healthcare, in fact I support it, I have a problem with the idea of OUR federal government running the thing. Everything our government touches turns to crap.

This is my main beef with liberal thinkers on social issues. You have these utopian ideals of how things should work, which sound great in a sound byte, but you turn a blind eye to the miserable execution of your programs when it's up to government bureaucrats to take your utopian ideals and implement them in the real world. You just ignore the bloat, corruption, thievery, etc that plagues these programs from the start. The way some Conservatives are about HPV vaccines and abstinence programs is no different.

That would be the same goverment that freed the slaves, developed nuclear power, won WWII, sent men to the moon and returned them safely, etc., etc. The goverment can do many things well WITH THE RIGHT LEADERSHIP.

Like I said your just running scarred.

The most recent example you gave is around 40yrs old. That should tell you something. And lets not forget, your favorite man George W. Bush is now leading the government you have so much faith in. That should also tell you something. Leadership is a dead quality in America today.

 

[1EZduzit]

My man??? Don't blame me, I sure as hell didn't vote for GWB. I'm WAY smarter then that.

Why is the goverment so out of control anyway? I think it's because most people in this country have it so damn good that they don't care what the politicians do. If goverment wast and corruption was seen as something that was reducing the quality of their health care, then what do you think would happen to corrupt politiicans?

 

[Mxylplyx]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
My man??? Don't blame me, I sure as hell didn't vote for GWB. I'm WAY smarter then that.

Why is the goverment so out of control anyway? I think it's because most people in this country have it so damn good that they don't care what the politicians do. If goverment wast and corruption was seen as something that was reducing the quality of their health care, then what do you think would happen to corrupt politiicans?

Why the government is so bad our out of control is irrelevant to this discussion. It is the way it is, and I have accepted that, while you obviously havent. You may consider yourself smart, just as I consider myself smart, but lets face it, politicians are voted into office by a bunch of idiots that base their votes on 30sec sound bytes on the evening news, and political ads shown during American Idol. Politicians dont have the time or resources to market themselves to intelligent people, so they go after the easy votes. Government waste eats away at every part of our government, and the people dont care. What makes you think healthcare will be any different? Maybe you are just more of a patriot than I am, since you still cling to the ideal that the people will eventuall rise up and take their government back, and put true leaders in office. Me...I've given up, and admit defeat. The electorate that you have so little faith in for voting in GWB twice, is the electorate that will be running your healthcare. So you continue on and have faith in a government elected by idiots, and I'll cling to the last bastions of society not run by our inept government.

 

[realEZE]

Originally posted by: Martin
Did this no raise alarm bells while you read the article? So they polled the upper middle class and found 40% of them preferred the Candian system. Now tell me honestly, what would happen if their sample size represented all of American society, including all uninsured people?

I'm slightly embarassed that a Canadian University professor would call this a good test for the our health-care system, since the demographic polled certainly does not represent an accurate cross-section of the users American health-care system.

All this proves is that rich people can buy better healthcare in the US, while in Canada, we all get the same service.

US is great... if you're rich...