American Idol

[BlancoNino]

I said that I didn't care much for American Idol, because I believe that anybody who is talented enough to become famous can do it without the help of a game show.

Her argument is that a lot of talented people don't get noticed. I don't know what she bases this on, but believe me...it just takes A LOT to make it big. Plus, it seems like American Idol just transforms people into pop stars...which just goes to show that most pop-stars are just marketed for money.

Discuss.

 

[Pacfanweb]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
I said that I didn't care much for American Idol, because I believe that anybody who is talented enough to become famous can do it without the help of a game show.

Her argument is that a lot of talented people don't get noticed. I don't know what she bases this on, but believe me...it just takes A LOT to make it big. Plus, it seems like American Idol just transforms people into pop stars...which just goes to show that most pop-stars are just marketed for money.

Discuss.

Well, you are defeated from the start. Every winner so far has been an unknown until he/she won Idol.
And now that they raised the age limit and I think it's up to 27 now, that pretty much proves you wrong.
You really think Taylor Hicks was ever going to get a million dollar recording contract on his own? At age 27?
How about McPhee? And she can really sing.

I could see that Chris Daughtry might have made it, but the other two had no shot, now they all have recording contracts.
So does Pickler.
How about Clay Aiken? He'd have NEVER made it.
The list goes on.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
Well, you are defeated from the start. Every winner so far has been an unknown until he/she won Idol.
And now that they raised the age limit and I think it's up to 27 now, that pretty much proves you wrong.
You really think Taylor Hicks was ever going to get a million dollar recording contract on his own? At age 27?
How about McPhee? And she can really sing.

I could see that Chris Daughtry might have made it, but the other two had no shot, now they all have recording contracts.
So does Pickler.
How about Clay Aiken? He'd have NEVER made it.
The list goes on.

That doesn't disprove my point. My point is that if you're a talented enough musician, things will work their way out. American Idol doesn't make people more talented, it simply gives them publicity. Do they even write their own songs after they win? Why didn't they write good enough songs before that?

 

[Greyd]

It doesn't matter how talented people are. You can have all the talent you want and not be noticed because the majority of it is in the marketing. The winners of american idol are very talented. Probably more so than some of the "accomplished" musicians/stars out there - but they don't have the agents or marketing to break it big - hence the advantage of American idol. While American idol is in some ways a popularity contest, the people who compete at the top levels are indeed very talented.

 

[sisq0kidd]

I'm the most talented person on earth and no has has recognized me I have just proven you wrong.

 

[Pacfanweb]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
Well, you are defeated from the start. Every winner so far has been an unknown until he/she won Idol.
And now that they raised the age limit and I think it's up to 27 now, that pretty much proves you wrong.
You really think Taylor Hicks was ever going to get a million dollar recording contract on his own? At age 27?
How about McPhee? And she can really sing.

I could see that Chris Daughtry might have made it, but the other two had no shot, now they all have recording contracts.
So does Pickler.
How about Clay Aiken? He'd have NEVER made it.
The list goes on.

That doesn't disprove my point. My point is that if you're a talented enough musician, things will work their way out. American Idol doesn't make people more talented, it simply gives them publicity. Do they even write their own songs after they win? Why didn't they write good enough songs before that?

Idol is not a songwriting contest. It's a singing competition. Most of the best/most successful singers in history did not write their own songs. Elvis. Streisand. Most country singers.

There are plenty of people in church choirs every Sunday that can outsing Taylor Hicks.
There are plenty of people in everyone here's neighborhood that can sing better than NoAssLee Simpson.
It takes more than talent. You have to have a break somewhere. That's a fact.

Take my favorite rock group...Van Halen. Gene Simmons discovered them. He was there to introduce some execs to the guy they were opening for...George Lynch, the future guitarist of Dokken.
Van Halen blew Lynch away, completely...he even admits it.
Simmons financed their demo and the rest is history.
Now, chances are they might have made it anyway, but the fact of the matter is they were playing clubs, HS dance, backyard parties, etc, before Simmons just happened to see them.

It always takes a lucky break of some sort.

 

[Rob9874]

Sorry, but she's right on this one. I've been playing guitar for the past 18 years. Although I had no ambition of trying to make it big, I've seen my share of the music industry. There are thousands upon thousands of VERY talented individuals who never get that "break". You can have all the talent in the world, but if you don't get that one-in-a-million shot, you have no chance of being noticed. I've seen the most talented musicians have no commercial success, and I've seen very untalented people (can't even call them musicians) have alot of success because some big shot agreed to promote them.

I agree with the above poster, that Taylor Hicks could have sent a demo tape to dozens of recording companies, and would have probably been turned down from every single one. You have to have talent to get your foot in the door with American Idol. But the show definitely makes you a star. (Until the season's over, and people forget you. Name one song by Ruben Studdard or Fantasia.)

 

[fire400]

if you are educated in the system, you don't need American Idol, you will get where you need to based off of how much work and effort you put into it.

you remember DJ Sammy released the song, Heaven? people thought that he sung it, when really it was Yanou, the female vocalist, did she get recognition, barely... DJ Sammy was making the money, not Yanou entirely. to this day, people don't even know who Yanou is, get the point?
Tess, her songs hit top charts. people don't know her full-real name. they just want to know what songs were released by "Tess."

it really depends on what you are looking at, popularity or one time hits? legends, it'd be something like Britney Spears or Backstreet Boys. Their image was very good, their image now, I would rather not contest; you can fill in the rest.

as far as American Idol goes, they're singles. teams that consist of multiple singers or members will often times perform at places where they can be recognized or just do it for fun until some contractor who likes them will help them get into the business. how big and far they get will come if people like them and the advertising and how well they demonstrate aggressiveness in the market by showing themselves more in public rather than hiding their faces.

DJ trance artist, ATB, his music I think is great, but there are people who don't even listen to his songs all the way through, sometimes just used as minor fill-ins to complete mixing for concerts and clubs. you could be popular by name even if your music sucks, Christina Augulera, her music I think sucks even though she's super popular.

american idol is a stupid show anyway, people just watch it because they can't realize that talent exists outside of the television, lol

 

[RbSX]

Originally posted by: fire400
if you are educated in the system, you don't need American Idol, you will get where you need to based off of how much work and effort you put into it.

you remember DJ Sammy released the song, Heaven? people thought that he sung it, when really it was Yanou, the female vocalist, did she get recognition, barely... DJ Sammy was making the money, not Yanou entirely. to this day, people don't even know who Yanou is, get the point?
Tess, her songs hit top charts. people don't know her full-real name. they just want to know what songs were released by "Tess."

it really depends on what you are looking at, popularity or one time hits? legends, it'd be something like Britney Spears or Backstreet Boys. Their image was very good, their image now, I would rather not contest; you can fill in the rest.

as far as American Idol goes, they're singles. teams that consist of multiple singers or members will often times perform at places where they can be recognized or just do it for fun until some contractor who likes them will help them get into the business. how big and far they get will come if people like them and the advertising and how well they demonstrate aggressiveness in the market by showing themselves more in public rather than hiding their faces.

DJ trance artist, ATB, his music I think is great, but there are people who don't even listen to his songs all the way through, sometimes just used as minor fill-ins to complete mixing for concerts and clubs. you could be popular by name even if your music sucks, Christina Augulera, her music I think sucks even though she's super popular.

american idol is a stupid show anyway, people just watch it because they can't realize that talent exists outside of the television, lol

ATB is great.. I love the club mix of ecstasy.. and Yanou's candle light remix of headen was my song with my exgirlfriend.

As far as whateveryone says, it's not what you can do, it's who you know and your exposure.

There are many singers as talented as the ppl on american idol.. but no one to see them.

 

[BlancoNino]

Hmmm, I think you guys are missing my point. I firmly believe that being good is all it takes to make it big. If you're good enough to where people like you, you WILL get noticed. The only reason people like these American Idol winners is because they are known as the AI winners. They will produce an album with a big record label and people will buy it and listen to it on the radio because they've already heard of that person. I believe people should get good by being good, getting noticed, and being spread by word of mouth.

I'm simply saying that since they got all that publicity on American Idol along with being handed a record deal accompanied by major musicians, they are selling albums and are popular. Is that how REAL musicians do it? Not me...I start from the ground up.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
I said that I didn't care much for American Idol, because I believe that anybody who is talented enough to become famous can do it without the help of a game show.

Her argument is that a lot of talented people don't get noticed. I don't know what she bases this on, but believe me...it just takes A LOT to make it big. Plus, it seems like American Idol just transforms people into pop stars...which just goes to show that most pop-stars are just marketed for money.

Discuss.

Your writings above are barely coherent.

Anyway, there are tons of more talented people than we get a chance to hear due to many things. Looks are a HUGE part of making it big, then their is getting signed by the right labels. Certain 'labels' just can't get their music into normal distribution channels and definitely not on the air. Getting on the radio is a big part in being discovered by the masses.

Å

 

[j00fek]

if you argue about the worst show on tv you get what you ask for.

 

[iamme]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
Hmmm, I think you guys are missing my point. I firmly believe that being good is all it takes to make it big. If you're good enough to where people like you, you WILL get noticed. The only reason people like these American Idol winners is because they are known as the AI winners. They will produce an album with a big record label and people will buy it and listen to it on the radio because they've already heard of that person. I believe people should get good by being good, getting noticed, and being spread by word of mouth.

I'm simply saying that since they got all that publicity on American Idol along with being handed a record deal accompanied by major musicians, they are selling albums and are popular. Is that how REAL musicians do it? Not me...I start from the ground up.

your point then makes the assumption that all the famous musicians now are the best of the best. you seem to think they reached the top simply because they were the most talented.

that's quite naive thinking.

 

[purbeast0]

i agree with the girl, and disagree with you.

 

[torpid]

Sorry to burst your pie in the sky naive view of the world, but talent does not always equal success. Apparently you have never heard of the old cliche of an artist only becoming famous after his or her death and struggling all of his or her life to make ends meat. Then 20 years later being considered an unparalleled genius.

In fact, there are even artists who have some success but not as much as they should given their talent due to capitalistic forces. Perfect example being Orson Wells. One of the most talented movie makers in history, screwed over by studios who also hacked apart one of his great films to the point that it is nearly impossible to see a good version of it.

 

[Queasy]

Argument I had with this girl at work

That was your first mistake. Even if you are right you will still be wrong.

 

[Gooberlx2]

You can have al the talent in the world, but if you don't know or meet the right people with right amount of money in their pockets, nothing is ever going to happen. And that also assume that you produce the sound that people are looking for.

My brother is a phenomenaly talented guitarist, but has never really been "found" beyond a Jager and Red Bull sponsorship.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: Gooberlx2
You can have al the talent in the world, but if you don't know or meet the right people with right amount of money in their pockets, nothing is ever going to happen. And that also assume that you produce the sound that people are looking for.

My brother is a phenomenaly talented guitarist, but has never really been "found" beyond a Jager and Red Bull sponsorship.

Does he play things that people want to hear?

 

[dullard]

Once again I have to disagree with BlancoNino. Talent will get you nowhere in entertainment. Publicity is what you need to succeed.

Many of the people who are famous have little to no talent (Paris Hilton anyone?). Yet, they'll get TV shows, they'll get movies, they'll get top 20 songs, etc. A recording studio can make ANYONE sound gifted. Talent is not needed. Publicity is all you need to succeed.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: dullard
Once again I have to disagree with BlancoNino. Talent will get you nowhere in entertainment. Publicity is what you need to succeed.

Many of the people who are famous have little to no talent (Paris Hilton anyone?). Yet, they'll get TV shows, they'll get movies, they'll get top 20 songs, etc. A recording studio can make ANYONE sound gifted. Talent is not needed. Publicity is all you need to succeed.

Thank you for proving my point. These folks are NOT talented enough to make it on their own, thus the publicity from American Idol. That's why I hate the show.

 

[dullard]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
Thank you for proving my point. These folks are NOT talented enough to make it on their own, thus the publicity from American Idol. That's why I hate the show.

How does that make your point at all? Your point implies that all talented people make it. I said untalented people do make it. So how does that prove your point?

You are correct that American Idol is for money and it is for turning people into pop stars. That part is fine. But you are wrong when you think that talent will get you anywhere. You need publicity. Sure talent + publicity is the best formula. But publicity alone is sufficient. Talent alone gets you no where in virtually all cases.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: dullard

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
Thank you for proving my point. These folks are NOT talented enough to make it on their own, thus the publicity from American Idol. That's why I hate the show.

How does that make your point at all? Your point implies that all talented people make it. I said untalented people do make it. So how does that prove your point?

You are correct that American Idol is for money and it is for turning people into pop stars. That part is fine. But you are wrong when you think that talent will get you anywhere. You need publicity. Sure talent + publicity is the best formula. But publicity alone is sufficient. Talent alone gets you no where in virtually all cases.

Talent createst publicity. I live in a small town and EVERYONE I know that's been in the music scene has had some sort of publicity. The better bands have more publicity. If they were even better, they would get even more. Even in this small town, people who work for record companies from big cities come down and scout. They offer tours, etc.

If these American Idol contestants weren't getting any publicity, it's because they weren't talented enough to begin with. American Idol helps to further our crappy musical state, and is living proof that most pop-stars have to be marketed through hype and publicity because they aren't good enough to make it big based on their skills and talents.

 

[torpid]

On what do you base the logic that if they are talented they get discovered? Do you have any evidence to support this? Note that naming artists you like that were discovered is not evidence, because you must also demonstrate that there are no bands that are talented that weren't discovered.

I also find it interesting that you seem to equate talent with popularity. There are some ridiculously talented bands that are not as popular as paris hilton or britney spears. Colin Meloy has more talent in his pinky finger than 1000 britney spears combined, but he's nowhere near as popular.

In short, your theory makes little sense. You should revise it to at least make some sense. Perhaps you mean, if a band is good enough, it will achieve some level of success, although not necessarily as much as it deserves, nor would their success necessarily be a direct reflection of talent.

 

[dullard]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
Talent createst publicity. I live in a small town and EVERYONE I know that's been in the music scene has had some sort of publicity. The better bands have more publicity. If they were even better, they would get even more. Even in this small town, people who work for record companies from big cities come down and scout. They offer tours, etc.

And out of how many small towns is this true? Probably close to 0%. You can't make generalizations based on the exception to the rule. Of those who have all this talent in your town, how many have made it big? Big enough that I'd recognize their name.

It seems like you are arguing that your town name is all that matters and not talent.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: dullard
And out of how many small towns is this true? Probably close to 0%. You can't make generalizations based on the exception to the rule. Of those who have all this talent in your town, how many have made it big? Big enough that I'd recognize their name.

It seems like you are arguing that your town name is all that matters and not talent.

What?

The only reason you don't hear about artists coming from small towns that often, is because more people live in big cities. It's as simple as that.

I'm talking about publicity, anyway. There are bands in my town that have gone on tour. If they were GOOD ENOUGH on tour, they would make it bigger, but they don't. They stay at the barely struggling to get by level.

I can't believe anyone would want to support American Idol. It's SHEER PROOF that most pop-stars are invented by marketing and hype AND NOT TALENT. Would you want that?