AMD's Roy Taylor: PhysX/Cuda doomed?

Page 9 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.
Toggle sidebar Toggle sidebar
Status
Not open for further replies.
SirPauly

SirPauly

Diamond Member
Apr 28, 2009
5,187
1
0
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-physx-hack-amd-radeon,2764-4.html

Our own measurements fully confirm Kanter's results. However, the predicted performance increase from merely changing the compiler options is smaller than the headlines from SemiAccurate might indicate. Testing with the Bullet Benchmark only showed a difference of 10% to 20% between the x87- and SSE2-compiled files. This might seem like a big increase on paper, but in practice it’s rather marginal, especially if PhysX only runs on one CPU core. If the game wasn’t playable before, this little performance boost isn’t going to change much.

Nvidia wants to give a certain impression by enabling the SSE2 setting by default in its SDK 3.0. But ultimately it’s still up to developers to decide how and to what extent SSE2 will be used. The story above shows that there’s still potential for performance improvements, but also that some news headlines are a bit sensationalistic. Still, even after putting things in perspective, it’s obvious that Nvidia is making a business decision here, rather than doing what would be best for performance overall.
Click to expand...
 
SirPauly

SirPauly

Diamond Member
Apr 28, 2009
5,187
1
0
Here is more:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-physx-hack-amd-radeon,2764-5.html


Contrary to some headlines, the Nvidia PhysX SDK actually offers multi-core support for CPUs. When used correctly, it even comes dangerously close to the performance of a single-card, GPU-based solution. Despite this, however, there's still a catch. PhysX automatically handles thread distribution, moving the load away from the CPU and onto the GPU when a compatible graphics card is active. Game developers need to shift some of the load back to the CPU.

Why does this so rarely happen?

The effort and expenditure required to implement coding changes obviously works as a deterrent. We still think that developers should be honest and openly admit this, though. Studying certain games (with a certain logo in the credits) begs the question of whether this additional expense was spared for commercial or marketing reasons. On one hand, Nvidia has a duty to developers, helping them integrate compelling effects that gamers will be able to enjoy that might not have made it into the game otherwise. On the other hand, Nvidia wants to prevent (and with good reason) prejudices from getting out of hand. According to Nvidia, SDK 3.0 already offers these capabilities, so we look forward to seeing developers implement them.
Click to expand...


Caught red handed? Hardly!
 
AnandThenMan

AnandThenMan

Diamond Member
Nov 11, 2004
3,991
627
126
IMO PhysX would have died long ago if not for the constant need for Nvidia to prop it up and force feed it into games. There is a much better business model NV could follow which has been discussed at length, but they choose not to.
 
AnandThenMan

AnandThenMan

Diamond Member
Nov 11, 2004
3,991
627
126
The other aspect to PhysX for me is it just doesn't look that good, or games that use it shove the visuals in your face just to prove they are there. The best visual effects are supposed to be the ones you don't notice, because they blend seamlessly with the rest of the environments. PhysX does the opposite, it screams I'm here I'm here look at me.
 
M

Mr Expert

Banned
Aug 8, 2013
175
0
0
AnandThenMan said:
The other aspect to PhysX for me is it just doesn't look that good, or games that use it shove the visuals in your face just to prove they are there. The best visual effects are supposed to be the ones you don't notice, because they blend seamlessly with the rest of the environments. PhysX does the opposite, it screams I'm here I'm here look at me.
Click to expand...
Agreed the effects are there just because the are there and not that it actually adds anything of any real vaule to the game. Look at BF3 now that is some proper good Physics. In Metro 2033 when I turned on Physx all it did was add more smoke and make the framerate tumble inconsistantly. In Mafia 2 all the Physx did was make a trench coat looks like it was submerged in water LOL and the framerate took a tumble.
 
Keysplayr

Keysplayr

Elite Member
Jan 16, 2003
21,219
55
91
I guess there is a PhysX bashing thread every few months eh? That guy was right.
They'll be one in another few months, and a few months after that, and so on, and so on.
Cause you're so right. PhysX is dead.
 
SirPauly

SirPauly

Diamond Member
Apr 28, 2009
5,187
1
0
Mr Expert said:
The proof is all there. How you try and mitagate the truth to fit your own opinion is another story. Somehow I think you will be the one still crying about Physx even when there are no games that use it except legacy old school games.
Click to expand...

Personally desire GPU PhysX to die or evolve and mature so gamers may enjoy advanced physics to redefine game-play and gaming!

Personally desire AMD and the Industry to offer so much competition that it forces nVidia to adapt.

While, I wait for these days, can enjoy some content now and don't desire nVidia to offer less for their customers -- desire AMD and the Industry to do more! Roll up their sleeves -- go to work -- innovate -- and beat nVidia and proprietary! Talking or saying Cuda is doomed -- prove it!
 
M

Mr Expert

Banned
Aug 8, 2013
175
0
0
Keysplayr said:
I guess there is a PhysX bashing thread every few months eh? That guy was right.
They'll be one in another few months, and a few months after that, and so on, and so on.
Cause you're so right. PhysX is dead.
Click to expand...
There will still be Physx die hards long after it's offical death marking each month, year, and decade. Oh what could have and sohould have been ....
 
M

Mr Expert

Banned
Aug 8, 2013
175
0
0
SirPauly said:
Personally desire GPU PhysX to die or evolve and mature so gamers may enjoy advanced physics to redefine game-play and gaming!

Personally desire AMD and the Industry to offer so much competition that it forces nVidia to adapt.

While, I wait for these days, can enjoy some content now and don't desire nVida to offer less for their customers -- desire AMD and the Industry to do more! Roll up their sleeves -- go to work -- innovate -- and beat nVidia and proprietary! Talking or saying Cuda is doomed -- prove it!
Click to expand...
Oh dam me Cuda is not even a gaming feature set LOL. Physx is still dead though unless nvidia admits their own faults and makes it open source.
 
AnandThenMan

AnandThenMan

Diamond Member
Nov 11, 2004
3,991
627
126
People bash technology they feel is inferior, should not be a surprise to anyone. Is there any hardware bashed more on these forums than AMD processors? I doubt it, but a lot of it is justified AMD fell behind and now the CPU market has stagnated.

Nvidia doesn't have to open source PhysX, all they have to do is make it freely available to anyone including the dev tools, if you use it in a commercial product (or public display) you pay licensing. Doing so would foster adoption much more effectively than limiting the hardware it runs on.
 
F

f1sherman

Platinum Member
Apr 5, 2011
2,243
1
0
Keysplayr said:
I guess there is a PhysX bashing thread every few months eh? That guy was right.
They'll be one in another few months, and a few months after that, and so on, and so on.
Cause you're so right. PhysX is dead.
Click to expand...

I don't know man...

30+ games in development. 8 of them with GPU PhysX.

Batman: Arkham Origins
The Bureau: XCOM Declassified
EverQuest Next
Witcher 3

PhysX looks to be in better shape than ever. Not that that's setting the bar all that high, but still


How many games using OpenSHaZAM again ^_^
 
SirPauly

SirPauly

Diamond Member
Apr 28, 2009
5,187
1
0
Mr Expert said:
Oh dam me Cuda is not even a gaming feature set LOL.
Click to expand...

I'm tired! The GPU component of the PhysX middleware utilizes the Cuda API! All this is becoming circular and repetitive now!

The battle isn't really with PhysX but with Cuda!
 
Jaydip

Jaydip

Diamond Member
Mar 29, 2010
3,691
21
81
f1sherman said:
I don't know man...

30+ games in development. 8 of them with GPU PhysX.

Batman: Arkham Origins
The Bureau: XCOM Declassified
EverQuest Next
Witcher 3

PhysX looks to be in better shape than ever. Not that that's setting the bar all that high, but still


How many games using OpenSHaZAM again ^_^
Click to expand...

Lol :D
 
3

3DVagabond

Lifer
Aug 10, 2009
11,951
204
106
FiendishMind said:
I registered to point out that you can learn about some the history behind PhysX at http://physxinfo.com/wiki/Main_Page and ask why Nvidia seems to get all the blame for not updating the SDK's x86 SIMD and Multithreading capabilities when Ageia had control of the software for four years before being bought by Nvidia and made no effort to update those capabilities either?
Click to expand...


Because Agia was trying to sell PhysX hardware, just like nVidia. It's not rocket science.
 
M

Mr Expert

Banned
Aug 8, 2013
175
0
0
SirPauly said:
I'm tired! The GPU component of the PhysX middleware utilizes the Cuda API! All this is becoming circular and repetitive now!

The battle isn't really with PhysX but with Cuda!
Click to expand...
Cuda is just a fancy word coined by nvidia for Stream Proccesor. There is nothing fancy about Cuda it's just marketing speak.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

TRENDING THREADS

COMPANY
RESOURCES
FOLLOW
Top Bottom