AMD Raven Ridge 'Zen APU' Thread

[DrMrLordX]

Being faster than Iris Pro for less isn't a huge accomplishment. Iris Pro is over priced and almost no one uses it.

Yeah, I was gonna say, how many of those "cheap" single-channel DDR4 Intel laptops use a simple dGPU?

2x8 GB of DDR4-3200 SODIMM costs 250 USD (Newegg). LOL. Might as well get a laptop with dedicated GPU instead of buffing an integrated GPU; NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050 starts around 800 USD.

That's retail. Besides, a lot of these laptops are shipping with 1x8GB DIMMs. 2x4GB DDR4-3200 SODIMMs will not cost $250. And certainly not at OE prices.

Raven Ridge is not supposed to compete with "gamer" mobile dGPUs. It first and foremost is meant to be an upgrade of everything that is Carrizo. Including the graphics, so it is at least respectable. Even if they insist on using some absurd memory standard like DDR4-2400 for an iGPU-equipped machine without dGPU, they could at least use 2x4GB configurations, instead of single-channel. And the power savings aren't THAT great; one of the points of the iGPU is to reduce the overall power budget vs. a dGPU. An Raven Ridge dGPU + dual channel configuration is going to save you power versus a 4c/4t or 4c/8t Summit Ridge + mobile dGPU. You will lose some performance ,but the point stands.

 

[FIVR]

The 8400 has 6 cores as is faster for gaming.

No it isn't. In newer games that use more threads (like BF1) the 8400 loses consistently. It is also locked and gamers like to overclock.


8400 can't even guarantee its top turbo bins. It is a poorly reviewed product that is overshadowed by everything above it. If are going to game on Coffee Lake why wouldn't you buy an 8600k or 8700 or 8700k (for the sake of argument we will pretend those those skus are actually available).

 

[raghu78]

That theory will be tested by Intel Coffee Lake i5 having lower priced 6 core desktops than AMD does.

Will AMD lower the price of Ryzen 1600 below Intel i5 8400, for market share, or will they keep the fat margins?

I am betting they will keep the margins.

AMD will bring Pinnacle Ridge with higher clocks to better compete against CFL. Moreover AMD provides all Ryzen CPUs with unlocked multiplier. I am sure a 2600 will fare quite well against a 8400.

 

[Yotsugi]

The 8400 has 6 cores as is faster for gaming.

Gaming is not everything there is to CPU.
Besides that, the lack of B360 boards makes 8400 somewhat of a silly choice.

 

[jpiniero]

Gaming is not everything there is to CPU.

Pretty much everyone here only really stresses their CPU in gaming.... otherwise you could just get by with an old PC or just use a laptop or your phone/Core M to save power. So yeah it is everything there is to CPU. The other benchmarks are fun to talk about but not really relevant.

 

[PeterScott]

8400 can't even guarantee its top turbo bins. .

Now you are just repeating debunked FUD.

 

[raghu78]

Pretty much everyone here only really stresses their CPU in gaming.... otherwise you could just get by with an old PC or just use a laptop or your phone/Core M to save power. So yeah it is everything there is to CPU. The other benchmarks are fun to talk about but not really relevant.

Thats rubbish. Gaming does not really stress a cpu. Have you seen the cpu load graph when running a game. Its surely not at 100% usage all the time. Heck most single player games do not even scale beyond 8 threads because the consoles are limited to 8 threads. Few multiplayer games like BF1 MP can use more than 8 threads.There are people who do serious work on their pc. Video editing, rendering, compilation, gaming with streaming stress the cpu more than gaming.

 

[ao_ika_red]

https://twitter.com/VideoCardz/status/920008001536307200

"AMD Eng Sample: ZM2300C4T2OFB_33/23_Y AMD Radeon(TM) Vega 3 Mobile Graphics"


https://twitter.com/VideoCardz/status/920009340005707776

"and dual-core"

Dual core APU with 3CUs?

Glad to know that finally 2C/4T Zen laptop comes true. This is supposed to be 5-15W ULP APU codenamed Banded Kestrel.

 

[PeterScott]

Glad to know that finally 2C/4T Zen laptop comes true. This is supposed to be 5-15W ULP APU codenamed Banded Kestrel.

Native 2 core Banded Kestrel was an early concept, that appears to have never made it off the drawing board.

I bet these 2 core parts are Raven Ridge with 2 disabled cores.

 

[raghu78]

Native 2 core Banded Kestrel was an early concept, that appears to have never made it off the drawing board.

I bet these 2 core parts are Raven Ridge with 2 disabled cores.

And I bet AMD has a native 2C/4T , 3CU die for 4-10w. I doubt AMD is going to disable 8CU from a 11CU RR die as yields are going to quite good for a 200 sq mm die on 14LPP. We have leaked roadmap slides to back what I stated. What do you have to back your statements .

 

[wahdangun]

Pretty much everyone here only really stresses their CPU in gaming.... otherwise you could just get by with an old PC or just use a laptop or your phone/Core M to save power. So yeah it is everything there is to CPU. The other benchmarks are fun to talk about but not really relevant.

Wtf, then why bother to buy computer at all? Just buy God dam console and just be done with it. It's frustrating that computer have become glorified console, don't be mistaken I love pc gaming but there is a lot more to do, just like computer enthusiast used to do.

 

[PeterScott]

I also doubt they are going to disable 8CUs.

There just won't be a 3CU part, because there is no market for it.

Banded Kestrel was only on VERY old roadmaps labeled as a concept.

It hasn't been on any newer roadmaps, which are all RR.

 

[raghu78]

I also doubt they are going to disable 8CUs.

There just won't be a 3CU part, because there is no market for it.

Banded Kestrel was only on VERY old roadmaps labeled as a concept.

It hasn't been on any newer roadmaps, which are all RR.

Lets wait and see. AMD used to have two notebook APUs before Zen - one based on Bulldozer and another based on Jaguar. AMD confirmed that Zen core will scale from tablets to notebooks to desktops and servers. I am confident AMD will have a sub 100 sq mm die for hitting aggressive price points in the sub USD 300 notebook market. AMD will have no problem pitting the 2C/4T 3 CU Zen APU against Atom notebooks and Core M tablets. Intel Atom notebooks will be slaughtered.

 

[OTG]

I also doubt they are going to disable 8CUs.

There just won't be a 3CU part, because there is no market for it.

Why wouldn't there be a market for it?
A good CPU with enough iGPU to run Windows and maybe esports games. Isn't that the big hole in AMD's lineup?

 

[PeterScott]

Lets wait and see. AMD used to have two notebook APUs before Zen - one based on Bulldozer and another based on Jaguar. AMD confirmed that Zen core will scale from tablets to notebooks to desktops and servers. I am confident AMD will have a sub 100 sq mm die for hitting aggressive price points in the sub USD 300 notebook market. AMD will have no problem pitting the 2C/4T 3 CU Zen APU against Atom notebooks and Core M tablets. Intel Atom notebooks will be slaughtered.

Intel is in the process of upgrading it it's lower power u parts from dual to quad cores. So as time goes on, I think the point of dual core CPU becomes less relevant, it's probably simpler for AMD to just drop a single quad core CCX in their and disable two cores when needed, than to design and tape out a dual core. Especially given AMDs propensity to use one die to cover many markets.

 

[ao_ika_red]

There just won't be a 3CU part, because there is no market for it.

Surely I'm part of its market. I don't want to splash a lot of money for fancy laptop and afaik open office, firefox, and vlc don't need more than 2 cores to work properly. Any workload heavier than that will be handled by the desktop rig.

 

[CatMerc]

It's a part for extremely low power. Roadmap said they intend some variants to sit at 4W.

 

[Abwx]

Being faster than Iris Pro for less isn't a huge accomplishment. Iris Pro is over priced and almost no one uses it.

The Iris pro is implemented in a 45W SKU, dunno if RR is not impressive given this characteristic, FTR even Bristol Ridge GPU was better in perf/watt despite the huge gap process wise...

 

[CatMerc]

Raven Ridge murdered Iris Pro without needing expensive eDRAM, and depending on the power envelope involved (I doubt it's more than 35W), at a lower power too.

That's what an AMD APU without a massive process disadvantage like with Bristol looks like. NVIDIA and AMD are on a completely different level GPU tech wise.

 

[ahimsa42]

any chance RR will support LPDDR4? i would think this would reduce the power consumption in a dual channel system.

 

[Yotsugi]

Raven Ridge murdered Iris Pro without needing expensive eDRAM, and depending on the power envelope involved (I doubt it's more than 35W), at a lower power too.

That's what an AMD APU without a massive process disadvantage like with Bristol looks like. NVIDIA and AMD are on a completely different level GPU tech wise.

U indexing, clocks and the laptop itself suggest it's a 15W SKU. Truly impressive.

any chance RR will support LPDDR4? i would think this would reduce the power consumption in a dual channel system.

AMD never talked about LPDDR4 in Zeppelin (because it's a server die). RR might support it. Though it's yet to be oficially launched.

 

[Glo.]

On that Ryzen 7 2700U is still only 8 CU GPU.

And whole design supposedly has 11/12 CU's.

 

[CatMerc]

Source on that @Glo. ?
If that score is cut down Raven, then a full one with proper mem config should be pretty damn great.

 

[Glo.]

Score differences between 2500U and 2700U. 11 CUs is 704 GCN cores. 8 CUs - 512 Cores. We are looking at around 40% increase in core count, higher clock speeds potentially, and only 400 pts in 3dMark GPU score difference(10%). Its too low score difference between them to indicate its bigger, full part.

And yes, the naming scheme U suggest that it is really at best 35W TDP part. So it might be pretty nice chip, after all.

 

[raghu78]

Intel is in the process of upgrading it it's lower power u parts from dual to quad cores. So as time goes on, I think the point of dual core CPU becomes less relevant, it's probably simpler for AMD to just drop a single quad core CCX in their and disable two cores when needed, than to design and tape out a dual core. Especially given AMDs propensity to use one die to cover many markets.

Intel's Core M for tablets is dual core and Zen dual core will scale from 4w tablets to 12w ultrathins. There is a huge market for good enough performance with emphasis on portability and battery life. If all you do is run MS Office, Adobe, IE,Chrome and watch video on your PC (which is what the majority of users do) you don't need 4 cores with HT. A dual core with HT is more than enough.