AMD Radeon 6970/6950 Retail Pictured, released Dec 13-17, $500/$375 pricing

[Illyan]

The performance difference between a 4870 and 5870 is between 70-100%... :hmm:

The 3870->4870 was over 100% though. I guess this launch does seem closer to the 48->58 if most current benches are in any way true.

 

[RussianSensation]

The 3870->4870 was over 100% though. I guess this launch does seem closer to the 48->58 if most current benches are in any way true.

Well GTX580 is about 33-38% faster than the HD5870, depending on the source. So if HD6970 is as fast as the GTX580, that falls way short of 48xx --> 5870. This makes sense of course because 28nm is a true next generation node. If HD6970 comes close to GTX580 in performance, but undercuts it in price, it will sell like hotcakes. HD4890 lost to the GTX285 in performance but because it cost $150 less, it was a pretty popular videocard.

 

[busydude]

They might be trying to have their cake and eat it to. They can say look we are almost as fast as a 470 (while running at 250w) and then say look we are low power (at 190w). Although they can't be both at once.

I am sorry.. not buying your answer.

I can see the benefit as to limiting the performance of a card if a game is getting over 120 FPs. For a lot of games there just isn't any benefit after that, so why waste power? Cut back the performance of the card to save power usage. But this TDP-limit needs to be dynamic, as obviously some games need more performance and thus need higher framerates. I speculated on this about a month ago, and it seems AMD might be implementing a solution albeit the solution seems to be adjusting clockspeeds rather than disabling parts of the chip. But we'll see:

It makes sense regarding that particular scenario. It would be cool if that switch was software based.. rather than a physical one. I don't want to open my case every time just to flip a switch.

 

[Wreckage]

I still don't understand how you think HD6970 will "barely" be as fast as a 470 when HD5870 is about 10% faster already - and that card is 14 months old. HD6970 will smoke the 470.

I meant 570, I fixed it. So many dang model numbers out there.

It seems from everything I have read they are targeting the 480. Also the 470 and 5870 around even, with more than a few games going to the 470 (mostly DX11 titles of course).

http://www.techreport.com/articles.x/20088/5

 

[Illyan]

Well GTX580 is about 33-38% faster than the HD5870, depending on the source. So if HD6970 is as fast as the GTX580, that falls way short of 48xx --> 5870. This makes sense of course because 28nm is a true next generation node.

I had the impression that the 580 was more 40-50% faster than the 5870, and about 5-10% slower than the 5970, which would place the 6970 about 15-20% slower than a 5970. The 4870X2 was noticeably faster than the 5870 on release as well.

 

[Nemesis 1]

How much performance does it cost to limit to 190watts compared to the full 250watts?

I can understand people that dont need the extra performance, or have a lower rated PSU, might stay at 190watts mark, but wouldnt most want the extra performance?

*pushes the magical switch to the 250w marker, watches performance climb*

Is the effeciency of the chips performance/watt differnt at differnt volt/watt values? Im guessing the 190w value might be for people that care more about the electrical bills than the 250watt value users?

I think your missing abit. NV cards can overclock also. But AMD wants to run its cards in reviews at = power usage. As apples to Apples and thats about as FAIR as it gets .

These Cards well O/C alot better when the partners get there hands on these , I not going to go any further than that . But look for some interesting O/Cs with slider at 250watts. That constant. Once O/C go above that 25O watts we will lose that constant.

I didn't get no manuals so this has been a hell of an experiance but getting the hang of it . As much as I like this card . Wait tilll you see it used with SB . moma me ay.

 

[RussianSensation]

I had the impression that the 580 was more 40-50% faster than the 5870

The 40-50% would generally happen at 2560x1600 8AA when 5870 would run out of Vram or when heavy tessellation is applied. But overall, I would say ~35% seems reasonable.

 

[Arkadrel]

I just read the link posted abit down leading to XtremeSystems forums....

here some more nice insiders information about the 6970 single and CF;

According to Neliz @ gathering of tweakers forum:

''6970 is 50% sneller in Furmark dan een 580, om even te laten zien dat er niet (of minder) aan throttling doet.

tevens zie ik een benchmark met 87fps @5760x1080 in batman:aa

6970 CF zou ook tussen 10% en 50% sneller moeten zijn dan 480 sli op die resolutie.
6970 is tussen de 10 en 30% sneller dan de 570 in de meeste benchmarks''

Translated (dutch is my mother tongue so sorry for some misspelling):

The 6970 is 50% faster in Furmark than the GTX 580, to show that there is non or much less throttling involved.

Furthermore he saw a benchmark with 87FPS @ 5760x1080 with Batman:AA.

The 6970 in CF will also be between 10% and 50% faster than the GTX 480 in SLI with that resolution (5760x1080).

The 6970 is between 10 and 30% faster than the GTX 570 in most of the benchmarks.

There seem to be alot of posts like that there... its kinda odd here at Anandtech, people seem to think the 6970 will be slower than a 570 more or less. Forums on xtremesystems have a differnt view on the matter.

6970 x2 vs 480 x2 and seeing 50% differnce in performance @ 5760x1080... that would shut the case, for surround vs eyefinity with multi screen setups.

^-^ the 6950.

 

[Illyan]

The 40-50% would generally happen at 2560x1600 8AA when 5870 would run out of Vram or when heavy tessellation is applied. But overall, I would say ~35% seems reasonable.

Yeah, I see I underestimated how close the 5870 and 580 were. However, that means the 6970 might be barely faster than a 5870 and that sucks.

 

[Unkle_Tar]

^

 

[Arkadrel]

@ Unkle Tar
Kinda hopeing these are true... that would put the 6970 really close to the 580.

This is a nice one too

 

[Wreckage]

Yeah, I see I underestimated how close the 5870 and 580 were. However, that means the 6970 might be barely faster than a 5870 and that sucks.

Well they are still stuck with 40nm, sounds like they just fixed the 5870's DX11 issues. So you might not see much in DX9/10 titles, but hopefully DX11 will improve significantly. This is not a brand new architecture, so you can't expect miracles.

 

[Firestorm007]

Well they are still stuck with 40nm, sounds like they just fixed the 5870's DX11 issues. So you might not see much in DX9/10 titles, but hopefully DX11 will improve significantly. This is not a brand new architecture, so you can't expect miracles.

What highlighters are you sniffing man? " Not a new architecture" Both the 6970/6950 are indeed a new architecture. I think you may have confused your statement with the 480/580 and 470/570. I hope this helps. So, just stop already. :|

 

[Silverforce11]

6970 ~25% over a gtx570 is faster than gtx580.

If thats done on gpus with 1536sp bios, i wonder what happens with the 1920sp bios?? There are legit screens of gpuz on cayman with 1920.

 

[Janooo]

I am sorry.. not buying your answer.

It makes sense regarding that particular scenario. It would be cool if that switch was software based.. rather than a physical one. I don't want to open my case every time just to flip a switch.

It is sw based. It's a slider in CCC.

 

[Arkadrel]

by flyck @xtremesystems
well, the latest results where the 6970 beat gtx570 by 25% was apparently with the 190W CAP... still have to wait 36hours or so to know for sure

if the 6970 is beating the 570 by ~25% at a 190watt cap limit... man oh man... imagine what happends when you remove the 190watt cap, and overclock these cards? This would def. kill the 580 sales, if the 6970 is selling cheaper and beating it at a lower power usage.

Then theres people on forums saying the oc like champs. Im looking forwards to the reviews abit more now

 

[busydude]

It is sw based. It's a slider in CCC.

I was talking about the physical switch on the side of 6970 pictured in one of the leaks. I am sorry I cannot find that picture..

If its software based, then what is that physical switch about?

 

[distinctively]

I was talking about the physical switch on the side of 6970 pictured in one of the leaks. I am sorry I cannot find that picture..

If its software based, then what is that physical switch about?

I made the same sort of mistake earlier today. The hardware switch is for the bios and and then there is a software slider to adjust the TDP

 

[Silverforce11]

if the 6970 is beating the 570 by ~25% at a 190watt cap limit... man oh man... imagine what happends when you remove the 190watt cap, and overclock these cards? This would def. kill the 580 sales, if the 6970 is selling cheaper and beating it at a lower power usage.

Then theres people on forums saying the oc like champs. Im looking forwards to the reviews abit more now

I'm excited bout that switch, dual bios. That may mean AMD can update one of the bios with driver updates. The other bios is prolly factory settings for backup safety. Very neat feature.

There are gpu die shot, its hardly bigger than cypress. Much less than 400mm. If it ~= gtx580, its a huge win and upset IMO. Small die equals or beat monolithic one, first time ATI has managed it eventhough they weren't aiming for the single GPU crown.

 

[Skurge]

It makes sense regarding that particular scenario. It would be cool if that switch was software based.. rather than a physical one. I don't want to open my case every time just to flip a switch.

What would be awesome is if you can set like an FPS cap in CCC, then whenever the card exceeds that, it would clock down.

 

[Arkadrel]

What would be awesome is if you can set like an FPS cap in CCC, then whenever the card exceeds that, it would clock down.

Save on electricity bill in games where you dont need 200-300 fps? So everytime it goes over 100 fps or so, it ll go abit easier? so you get a smooth 100 fps experiance at lower power watt usage?

 

[distinctively]

I'm excited bout that switch, dual bios. That may mean AMD can update one of the bios with driver updates. The other bios is prolly factory settings for backup safety. Very neat feature.

There are gpu die shot, its hardly bigger than cypress. Much less than 400mm. If it ~= gtx580, its a huge win and upset IMO. Small die equals or beat monolithic one, first time ATI has managed it eventhough they weren't aiming for the single GPU crown.

Definitely an interesting scenario where AMD really didn't plan on being competitive this high up the ladder with the 6970, at least not a year ago.

I wonder if the products being this competitive will get those prices down to where I'm willing to pay for a higher end card. That would be nice.

 

[busydude]

I made the same sort of mistake earlier today. The hardware switch is for the bios and and then there is a software slider to adjust the TDP

Dang it. I am going to take a break for some time..

 

[Silverforce11]

Definitely an interesting scenario where AMD really didn't plan on being competitive this high up the ladder with the 6970, at least not a year ago.

I wonder if the products being this competitive will get those prices down to where I'm willing to pay for a higher end card. That would be nice.

LOL NO.

Its intended pricing is $449 since august AIB briefings. This was when they had driver issues and were getting poor performance.

I don't think we have a chance of getting it for less than this given its performance rivaling the gtx580.

The real bang for buck will obviously be the 6950. I have no idea what its pricing will be, but can guess around $299.

 

[SlowSpyder]

They might be trying to have their cake and eat it to. They can say look we are almost as fast as a 570 (while running at 250w) and then say look we are low power (at 190w). Although they can't be both at once.

Do you really think AMD is shooting for the GTX570 with a 250watt TDP? Keep in mind that AMD's parts have generally given more performance per watt then Fermi, and they are trying to improve that while Nvidia just released the Fermi that was announced over a year ago. Of course I also remember you being pretty confident that the GTX480 would be faster than the 5970...