AMD K9?

[AmberClad]

So, I'm reading the Wikipedia article about the history of AMD chips. I see mentions about various K-codenamed chips, including K8 and K10, but I can't seem to find anything about a K9. AMD folks -- feel free to smack me if this is a stupid or obvious question, but what happened to K9?

 

[mrfatboy]

Originally posted by: AmberClad
So, I'm reading the Wikipedia article about the history of AMD chips. I see mentions about various K-codenamed chips, including K8 and K10, but I can't seem to find anything about a K9. AMD folks -- feel free to smack me if this is a stupid or obvious question, but what happened to K9?

lol, The AMD markerting dept didn't like K9. Arff! Arff! Get it? K9 = Dog.

I can hear the intel marketing saying "Have you heard about the new AMD K9 chip? It's a dog of a chip"

 

[SlowSpyder]

I read somewhere that AMD started designing a follow up to the K8 called the K9. But, AMD had put more emphasis on it's multicore performance thinking that the industry would have moved that way faster then it has, and not enough emphasis on single threaded performance. The K9 had poor single threaded performance because it focused more on multithreaded performance. So, AMD went back to the drawing board to redesign/update the follow up to the K8 since the K9 would not compete well, so now we have the K10/Barcelona as a result.

 

[Cogman]

from what i've heard, it was totally based on the fact that they didn't want the new arch to sound like canine.

 

[AmberClad]

I think I find SlowSpyder's explanation is a bit more plausible than the "doggy" idea . I don't see anything too terrible about being associated with canines. I'm sure the marketing guys could have spun some sort of advertising around German Shepards or pitbulls chewing on Intel chips.

Besides, "Conroe" wasn't exactly the most awe-inspiring codename either. As a sushi fan, I keep getting a mental image of neon orange roe (salmon caviar, I think) whenever I see that name.

 

[Aluvus]

Originally posted by: AmberClad
I think I find SlowSpyder's explanation is a bit more plausible than the "doggy" idea . I don't see anything too terrible about being associated with canines. I'm sure the marketing guys could have spun some sort of advertising around German Shepards or pitbulls chewing on Intel chips.

Besides, "Conroe" wasn't exactly the most awe-inspiring codename either. As a sushi fan, I keep getting a mental image of neon orange roe (salmon caviar, I think) whenever I see that name.

Imagine the jokes if you made a product called "K9" and it didn't perform well. Now imagine that it's a product that took millions of dollars to develop and will take years to replace. Imagine years of painful "performs like a dog" jokes. AMD's marketing department may not be the greatest on Earth, but still they would have the sense to veto something like that.

I strongly suspect the story about K9 existing and then being scrapped is an attempt to retcon a pretty common-sense decision. Microarchitecture names tend to be chosen to minimize association with anything undesirable, because once it's in the media you're stuck with it for a while. Witness P6, K7, K8, and even Core. NetBurst went with a different approach, but notice that it's also a name with no real secondary meaning.

Conroe is the codename for a specific product, not the name for a microarchitecture. The major difference being that the name "Conroe" is already beginning to fade from public consciousness, while we still have a while before there will be a replacement for the Core microarchitecture. Additionally, Intel's materials do not use codenames for released products.

As for the specific connotations of Conroe, maybe they would be different if you were from Texas.

 

[bryanW1995]

yeah, every time I see the word "conroe" I think of bad traffic and people with no teeth...

 

[Phynaz]

The original K9 project was cancelled, just as the original K10 project was.

 

[betasub]

Originally posted by: Aluvus
Imagine the jokes if you made a product called "K9" and it didn't perform well. Now imagine that it's a product that took millions of dollars to develop and will take years to replace. Imagine years of painful "performs like a dog" jokes. AMD's marketing department may not be the greatest on Earth, but still they would have the sense to veto something like that.

Dogs seem to have a bad press. Do they really perform that badly? Even when they're "dog-tired" they keep on going.

 

[IdaGno]

K9 form factor

 

[mrfatboy]

Originally posted by: IdaGno
K9 form factor

lol, Is it a Quad or a Dual?

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: AmberClad
I think I find SlowSpyder's explanation is a bit more plausible than the "doggy" idea . I don't see anything too terrible about being associated with canines. I'm sure the marketing guys could have spun some sort of advertising around German Shepards or pitbulls chewing on Intel chips.

I agree, any company who's marketing team takes a slam-dunk internal project codename like "sledgehammer" (original K7) and respins it as "Athlon" for the marketing name...I seriously doubt the marketing talent at AMD was ever put to use worrying about the consumer reaction to an internal project codename like K9 = canine.

 

[ctk1981]

Although probably not likely about the K9=dog theory, it wouldnt be the first time a series/number has been skipped for odd reasons like that. Artic Silver 4 non existant....someone correct me if Im wrong, but it had something to do with the asian market and the number 4 representing evil or something odd like that. AS 1, 2,3, 5?

 

[mrfatboy]

Originally posted by: Idontcare

Originally posted by: AmberClad
I think I find SlowSpyder's explanation is a bit more plausible than the "doggy" idea . I don't see anything too terrible about being associated with canines. I'm sure the marketing guys could have spun some sort of advertising around German Shepards or pitbulls chewing on Intel chips.

I agree, any company who's marketing team takes a slam-dunk internal project codename like "sledgehammer" (original K7) and respins it as "Athlon" for the marketing name...I seriously doubt the marketing talent at AMD was ever put to use worrying about the consumer reaction to an internal project codename like K9 = canine.

Have you every worked in a marketing dept? Talk about a high stress job. They are always trying to cover their A$$. If you don't think anybody thought about the "K9" issue (marketing, engineering, management) you are sadly mistaken. I can hear the fights now between marketing and engineering. I can also hear the engineers b1tching to marketing that they screw up their precious chip (sales) and "what the hell where you thinking?" discussions.

Have you every been on a 13th floor in a high rise building?

 

[AmberClad]

Well, it wouldn't be the first time someone did something like that I suppose. Slackware Linux did a odd version number increment once, something like going from version 4 to version 7.

But only skipping one revision number does lend itself to the idea that K9 might have been a scrapped design. But I guess half of you guys prefer the canine chip theory...

 

[Aluvus]

Originally posted by: Idontcare

I agree, any company who's marketing team takes a slam-dunk internal project codename like "sledgehammer" (original K7) and respins it as "Athlon" for the marketing name...I seriously doubt the marketing talent at AMD was ever put to use worrying about the consumer reaction to an internal project codename like K9 = canine.

SledgeHammer was the codename for the original Opteron. Both SledgeHammer and just Hammer were used to refer to the K8 microarchitecture (much in the way AMD sometimes refers to the Barcelona microarchitecture). The original K7 Athlon had the codename Argon, but is often just refered to as K7.

And again, "K9" would not have been just an internal codename. It would have been the name used by AMD, the press, merchants, and consumers to refer to every product ever made using that microarchitecture. Big, big difference. Codenames for individual products tend to fade from view (ClawHammer, anyone?) but microarchitecture names have legs (raise your hand if you're familiar with the term "NetBurst").

Originally posted by: AmberClad
Well, it wouldn't be the first time someone did something like that I suppose. Slackware Linux did a odd version number increment once, something like going from version 4 to version 7.

http://www.slackware.com/faq/do_faq.php?faq=general#0

But only skipping one revision number does lend itself to the idea that K9 might have been a scrapped design. But I guess half of you guys prefer the canine chip theory...

That is probably why the Inquirer has pushed that theory. Because it seems plausible enough. Notably, I have not heard any more reputable source back it up.

 

[AmberClad]

Originally posted by: Aluvus
Codenames for individual products tend to fade from view (ClawHammer, anyone?) but microarchitecture names have legs (raise your hand if you're familiar with the term "NetBurst").

*raises hand*

Although...with the amount of heat my Prescott pumped out, I remember wondering if maybe "NetExplode" or "NetKablooie" would have been more appropriate...

I assume that wasn't the type of "burst" Intel was alluding to though.

 

[Phynaz]

Originally posted by: Aluvus

Originally posted by: Idontcare

I agree, any company who's marketing team takes a slam-dunk internal project codename like "sledgehammer" (original K7) and respins it as "Athlon" for the marketing name...I seriously doubt the marketing talent at AMD was ever put to use worrying about the consumer reaction to an internal project codename like K9 = canine.

SledgeHammer was the codename for the original Opteron. Both SledgeHammer and just Hammer were used to refer to the K8 microarchitecture (much in the way AMD sometimes refers to the Barcelona microarchitecture). The original K7 Athlon had the codename Argon, but is often just refered to as K7.

And again, "K9" would not have been just an internal codename. It would have been the name used by AMD, the press, merchants, and consumers to refer to every product ever made using that microarchitecture. Big, big difference. Codenames for individual products tend to fade from view (ClawHammer, anyone?) but microarchitecture names have legs (raise your hand if you're familiar with the term "NetBurst").

Originally posted by: AmberClad
Well, it wouldn't be the first time someone did something like that I suppose. Slackware Linux did a odd version number increment once, something like going from version 4 to version 7.

http://www.slackware.com/faq/do_faq.php?faq=general#0

But only skipping one revision number does lend itself to the idea that K9 might have been a scrapped design. But I guess half of you guys prefer the canine chip theory...

That is probably why the Inquirer has pushed that theory. Because it seems plausible enough. Notably, I have not heard any more reputable source back it up.

Kristopher K. Posted about having knowlege about multiple K9 and K10 projects being cancelled.

It's also easy to figure out the timeframe yourself. K8 is a 1999 chip with 64bit extensions. So what has AMD been doing the last nine years?

There was also the Fred Weber presentation in 2003 of what the next generation AMD architecture would look like. Barcelona is not the cpu he presented.

Taking the timeframe involved, add in the missing cpu features, and it's pretty easy to determine that projects were cancelled.

 

[Aluvus]

Originally posted by: Phynaz

Kristopher K. Posted about having knowlege about multiple K9 and K10 projects being cancelled.

Then why not provide everyone here a link to that? For that matter, why not spell out last names so no one has to guess whether or not you mean Kristopher Kubicki, of AnandTech and DailyTech?

It's also easy to figure out the timeframe yourself. K8 is a 1999 chip with 64bit extensions. So what has AMD been doing the last nine years?

Who knows? What was Intel doing for all that time while they kept pumping out NetBurst products? One can only guess.

There was also the Fred Weber presentation in 2003 of what the next generation AMD architecture would look like. Barcelona is not the cpu he presented.

I guess my memory of presentations that apparently happened 4 years ago is not as strong as yours, but I bet you can provide a link to the presentation.

Taking the timeframe involved, add in the missing cpu features, and it's pretty easy to determine that projects were cancelled.

"Determine" and "assume" are not synonyms.