AMD CEO talks of long-term turnaround

[Fjodor2001]

No. let me know when 4 core vs 4 core is competitive.

How about we switch it around and compare 8 core Intel CPUs to 4 core AMD CPUs. Talk about demolishing the competition.

According to info so far, Zen desktop CPUs will be 8 cores without iGPU in 2016. Then APU versions in 2017.

Do you know any of 8 core Intel mainstream CPUs that will be available in 2016? HEDT does not count, as it is not mainstream.

Again, do you have any info that mainstream Zen will be 8 cores? If not, then you are just making up fake scenarios so your team wins.

http://www.kitguru.net/components/c...-based-microprocessors-in-late-2016-document/

And FYI, I have no "team" as you do. In fact my CPUs are all from Intel and ARM currently. I'm still interested in what all players on that market including AMD will provide though. You on the other hand seems to be 100% focused on Intel alone, and bashing everything else. So don't get into a pissing contest about fanboyism here please.

 

[mrmt]

Jesus christ. IIRC his point was that an 8-core desktop version of Zen would be competitive to Intels offerings if it indeed stacks up to AMD's own claims.

When was the last time that happened? Plus IPC alone doesn't matter, they have to reach a certain clock threshold.

 

[mrmt]

According to info so far, Zen desktop CPUs will be 8 cores without iGPU in 2016. Then APU versions in 2017.

Do you know any of 8 core Intel mainstream CPUs that will be available in 2016? HEDT does not count, as it is not mainstream.

There are already 8 cores AMD mainstream processors today, doesn't change much, does it?

Basically you and other people believe that AMD can have a much beefier core in high quantities and clocking as high as 32nm clocks while being extremely efficient at these high clocks, that's a fairy tale, especially when Samsung isn't really targeting this kind of clocks for their process node.

 

[Sweepr]

There are already 8 cores AMD mainstream processors today, doesn't change much, does it?

Basically you and other people believe that AMD can have a much beefier core in high quantities and clocking as high as 32nm clocks while being extremely efficient at these high clocks, that's a fairy tale, especially when Samsung isn't really targeting this kind of clocks for their process node.

Don't forget that it's a 95W and below product too. Call me crazy but Haswell+ IPC, 8 cores, +3.5GHz clocks and up to 95W doesn't fit with AMD's record. Maybe 2 of these, 3 if we're lucky.

Oh, if the latest leak is correct then we're talking about October 2016 launch if everything goes according to plan (read 2016 as late 2016).

 

[Spartak]

Especially when Samsung isn't really targeting this kind of clocks for their process node.

But GlobalFoundries is the one with the tooling expertise for high voltage, high performance. If it was simply a one to one translation for similar chips GlobalFoundries would be churning out those 14nm wafers this year already. There's a reason they need one and a half(!) year for the exact same process if the october '16 release window is correct.

 

[ShintaiDK]

But GlobalFoundries is the one with the tooling expertise for high voltage, high performance. If it was simply a one to one translation for similar chips GlobalFoundries would be churning out those 14nm wafers this year already. There's a reason they need one and a half(!) year for the exact same process if the october '16 release window is correct.

GloFo is to have part of the A9 production. And they currently suffer huge on yields with 30% or so. Hence why Apple also have to use TSMC as a 3rd supplier for A9.

GloFo uses the same node as Samsung because they had to license it after completely failing to develop one themselves.

I dont get where anyone get the idea that GloFo is somehow specialized in high performance products.

 

[mrmt]

But GlobalFoundries is the one with the tooling expertise for high voltage, high performance. If it was simply a one to one translation for similar chips GlobalFoundries would be churning out those 14nm wafers this year already. There's a reason they need one and a half(!) year for the exact same process if the october '16 release window is correct.

Do you think Globalfoundries is going to fine tune a node for AMD? Even if GLF was able to do it they wouldn't do it for free.

 

[mrmt]

I dont get where anyone get the idea that GloFo is somehow specialized in high performance products.

AMD was never able to develop a node by themselves, they were limited to implement nodes licensed from Motorola and IBM, when the manufacturing arm was spun off GLF management tried to build a R&D arm inside the foundry, but failed twice already.

 

[Spartak]

GloFo is to have part of the A9 production. And they currently suffer huge on yields with 30% or so. Hence why Apple also have to use TSMC as a 3rd supplier for A9.

GloFo uses the same node as Samsung because they had to license it after completely failing to develop one themselves.

I dont get where anyone get the idea that GloFo is somehow specialized in high performance products.

Yes they had to throw out their own design, what's your point?
Let me refrase it since nothing you wrote contradicts with what you replied to:
they need a full extra year to go from a low-voltage A9 to Zen.

I'm wondering why you expect GlobalFoundries yields right now to be up or near to Samsung's levels when:
a. it's not their own process design, it takes time to do a proper implementation
b. they are still testing
c. low-voltage is not their expertise
d. not just GlobalFoundries is suffering from poor yields on 14nm; Samsung and Intel are / have been as well

 

[Fjodor2001]

There are already 8 cores AMD mainstream processors today, doesn't change much, does it?

So you consider current FX CPUs to be pure 8 cores now all of a sudden?

And you don't see the shift away from CMT that is being made with Zen? Come on... you know better than that..

Basically you and other people believe that AMD can have a much beefier core in high quantities and clocking as high as 32nm clocks while being extremely efficient at these high clocks, that's a fairy tale, especially when Samsung isn't really targeting this kind of clocks for their process node.

Lots of words. Can we have some actual numbers as requested please? How do you expect Zen to perform in ST and MT, in relation to some reference Intel CPU being at index 100?

Why do you keep avoiding that question?

 

[Spartak]

Do you think Globalfoundries is going to fine tune a node for AMD? Even if GLF was able to do it they wouldn't do it for free.

Yes. There is no assuming here, it's a necessity. You need different layers for higher voltages and I'm sure there are other differences. TSMC and Intel and anybody else use different implementations for high and low voltage.

TSMC got 20nm running for low voltage, but their high voltage process was a failure without FinFET so AMD and nVidia needed to stick with 28nm.

 

[mrmt]

So you consider current FX CPUs to be pure 8 cores now all of a sudden?

And you don't see the shift away from CMT that is being made with Zen? Come on... you know better than that..


Lots of words. Can we have some actual numbers as requested please? How do you expect Zen to perform in ST and MT, in relation to some reference Intel CPU being at index 100?

Why do you keep avoiding that question?

I told you already. Nehalen ipc with nehalen clocks.

 

[Fjodor2001]

Don't forget that it's a 95W and below product too. Call me crazy but Haswell+ IPC, 8 cores, +3.5GHz clocks and up to 95W doesn't fit with AMD's record. Maybe 2 of these, 3 if we're lucky.

Remember that Zen is on 14 nm compared to current 28 nm for AMD, and it doesn't have any iGPU in the 2016 SKUs.

 

[Fjodor2001]

I told you already. Nehalen ipc with nehalen clocks.

No you did not tell us before.

But seriously? What info and reasoning do you base that estimate on?

 

[Phynaz]

Jesus christ, he won't be able to let you know until it's actually released, wont he? But AMD's 40% claim would imply it's in the same ballpark.

So an 8-core desktop version of Zen would be competitive to Intels offerings in the high performance segment if it indeed stacks up to AMD's own claims. It doesnt need to beat Core i7's IPC performance for it to be a good value proposition in the high-performance segment.

Here's one source for your 'fake scenario': http://www.kitguru.net/components/c...en-processors-is-our-largest-rd-spending-now/

You're new here, so welcome to the forums.

Since you're new, I advise you to watch your language. You may want to edit your post before the mods see it.

Second, when was the last time the performance of an AMD device actually met their marketing claims? The best indicator of future performance is past performance.

 

[Spartak]

No you did not tell us before.

But seriously? What info and reasoning do you base that estimate on?

It's a rough deduction form AMD's own 40% IPC improvement claim. Can you stop harping on that?

 

[Fjodor2001]

It's a rough deduction form AMD's own 40% IPC improvement claim. Can you stop harping on that?

Well, most people on the forum has put Zen estimates at SB to Haswell performance level based on that info. So I think saying it's at Nahalem performance level mandates an explanation, since it deviates from that.

 

[Spartak]

Since you're new, I advise you to watch your language. You may want to edit your post before the mods see it.

Second, when was the last time the performance of an AMD device actually met their marketing claims? The best indicator of future performance is past performance.

You are the own that needs to watch your words. You're accusing someone of contriving a claim when there have been reports about it and in a thread discussing them you'd expect people to be at least a bit informed.

I'm not a little kid that needs your welcome. Reason I joined is my annoyance with ill-informed people making accusations and ridiculous claims.

I've had my forum time for the coming time, have fun with the rest of the ride.

 

[Phynaz]

According to info so far, Zen desktop CPUs will be 8 cores without iGPU in 2016. Then APU versions in 2017.


http://www.kitguru.net/components/c...-based-microprocessors-in-late-2016-document/

Lol, hilarious...here's you're source,

according to a document published by a web-site.

 

[Spartak]

Well, most people on the forum has put Zen estimates at SB to Haswell performance level based on that info. So I think saying it's at Nahalem performance level mandates an explanation, since it deviates from that.

Nobody knows. Some will take it at face value and some will see it as cherry picking some performance scenarios where it does.

The truth will probably be somewhere in the middle.

 

[Fjodor2001]

Lol, hilarious...here's you're source,

Here's another one for you:

Got some other source contradicting it?

 

[Phynaz]

You are the own that needs to watch your words. You're accusing someone of contriving a claim when there have been reports about it and in a thread discussing them you'd expect people to be at least a bit informed.

I'm not a little kid that needs your welcome. Reason I joined is my annoyance with ill-informed people making accusations and ridiculous claims.

I've had my forum time for the coming time, have fun with the rest of the ride.

My words are not against the forum rules, but thanks anyways for watching out for me

 

[Phynaz]

Here's another one for you:

Got some other source contradicting it?

Got that slide from an AMD source?

Edit:
Nevermind, it's too nice of day out to spend it arguing with you.

 

[Spartak]

Lol, hilarious...here's you're source,

May I remind you the whole discussion here is based on rumours and 'leaked info'? It wasnt made up by himself like you claimed but thanks for the red herring.

Here's the quote again for your own recollection:

Again, do you have any info that mainstream Zen will be 8 cores? If not, then you are just making up fake scenarios so your team wins.

 

[Spartak]

My words are not against the forum rules, but thanks anyways for watching out for me

I'm not watching out for you, I'm calling you out for misbehaviour. Tone it down son.