All this from 1 Inch of Snow???!!: N.C. Declares Emergency After Snowstorm

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AmigaMan

Diamond Member
Oct 12, 1999
3,644
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Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
Originally posted by: SampSon
I can deal with 3-5 feet of snow before a single plow truck hits the roads.
Some of these people are ridiculous, spending the night at grocery stores, children spending the night at school. I understand that some bridges were closed, but comon, can't people walk?

Their roadways are poorly designed, most arn't crowned, and have very bad drainage. This happens to NC EVERY YEAR, you would think they would at least consider some sort of minimal extreme weather management for the future.
Boy, you really don't know what you're talking about. How do you figure most of our roads aren't crowned?

This does NOT happen to NC every year, it's never happened before in NC's history.
There's no reason at all for NC to have as much snow-removal equipment as say, West Virginia. It would sit unused 363 days a year.

You can deal with 3-5 feet of snow, unplowed? Not unless you have a big-ass 4x4 you can't. If it snows 5 feet you'll will be sitting at home just like everyone else.

People like you are the ones who are the most dangerous when we get road conditions like we see here when it snows. You think you know how to drive in the snow.....and what we get here most of the time ain't snow.


[/quote]

I don't quite buy your comments. Blaming northerners for most of the accidents in the snow and ice? While it may account for some accidents, the vast majority are because of NC natives who are not used to driving on it in the first place or who have too much confidence in their vehicle. And this does happen just about every year. We have at least a couple days of snow and ice a year, but it's still not enough to justify buying tons of equipment to deal with. Especially when you live in a state that has to balance it's budget every year and other public services are going needy.
 

aircooled

Lifer
Oct 10, 2000
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plus we have to save our money for the hurricanes in the summer. can't spend it all on snow/ice.
 

Pacfanweb

Lifer
Jan 2, 2000
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Originally posted by: SampSon
From what I understand most of the roads in the south arn't crowned. When I lived in SC most of their roads weren't crowned, so when it rained, it just collected on the flat roads.
This happens to NC every year, ever year you hear about how NC got hit with a storm and a large number of motoroists got in accidents etc. Mabey not to the degree of this past storm, but from what I see every year in the news, it happens down there. I'm not fabricating this because it happened last year too.
I drive over 1000 miles a week, I live in the most snow ridden area in the country, I know how to drive in winter conditions. Yes I do have awd, so that does make a difference. I have never wrecked my car in the snow, never got in an accident in the snow or winter conditions, I drive about 3x as much as most people. I also do a lot of driving on country routes where the snow control is extremely minimal, meaning the county plow goes through once, and that's it.

No storm last year right?
who said there was no bad weather last year? And where in that article does it say there was a huge traffic jam with 1000 accidents?
It doesn't, because it didn't happen. Sure, we get snow or ice at least every other year, but that ice storm was at least predicted and planned for(one of the few times the weathermen were right). The one the year before was much worse, but neither did much to the roads.
So that is an irrelevent reference.

What I mean is, a situation like happened Wednesday does NOT happen here every year. It has never happened before, and likely never will again.

You keep touting how you drive on bad, snowy roads...fine, but you aren't, for the most part, driving on a sheet of ice. I can drive in the snow/ice as well as anyone from anywhere, and if I had the choice of driving on Wednesday's ice, or 1 foot of snow unplowed, I'd take the snow every time.
And yes, I have a 4x4, and it does make a HUGE difference whether it's snow or ice....you can go and slow down much better. I proved that beyond a shadow of a doubt Wednesday.

The crown of the roads is irrelevant to this situation. Snow doesn't run off like rain.
Here's a quote from the OP's link that tells how the ice happened:
"You had some melting from the compression of people driving on the roads, followed rapidly by refreezing," he said. Road crews were forced to try applying melting agents to jammed roads.

The cars melted the snow, and it turned to ice. No matter where you're from, driving on ice is difficult, and nobody is really used to it.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
55,907
14,176
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SampSon,

I lived in GA, SC and NC for a total of ten+ years. And as far as I remember, most of the roads were crowned and had excellent drainage. I mean, the entire region gets a LOT of rain every year. They'd be flooded all the time without crowns and drainage... and they weren't flooded.
 

Pacfanweb

Lifer
Jan 2, 2000
13,149
57
91
Originally posted by: AmigaMan

I don't quite buy your comments. Blaming northerners for most of the accidents in the snow and ice? While it may account for some accidents, the vast majority are because of NC natives who are not used to driving on it in the first place or who have too much confidence in their vehicle. And this does happen just about every year. We have at least a couple days of snow and ice a year, but it's still not enough to justify buying tons of equipment to deal with. Especially when you live in a state that has to balance it's budget every year and other public services are going needy.[/quote]
Again, ask the body shops and tow truck drivers. Remember the 20+ inches of snow we had in 2000? Guess which people got stuck the most?

There's no way to measure where the people were from, at least no scientific way, but if you watched the news back then, and worked in the automotive field like I do, you'd at least have an informal poll of them. And most shops and tow drivers will tell you that when it snows here, they see a very high percentage of northerners getting stuck/having accidents.
Then again, nowadays there's almost more yankees here than NC natives.

 

Spencer278

Diamond Member
Oct 11, 2002
3,637
0
0
Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
Originally posted by: Spencer278
Just wonder but when you say cold do you mean around zero or do you mean a warm 32 degrees?
It was in the 20's all day.

That can be a bad temp to get snow. The snow would wet and not the nice and fluffy powered other place get and then with heavy traffic I can see it getting packed down. Also I'm willing to bet most people don't have snow tires.
 

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
Originally posted by: SampSon
From what I understand most of the roads in the south arn't crowned. When I lived in SC most of their roads weren't crowned, so when it rained, it just collected on the flat roads.
This happens to NC every year, ever year you hear about how NC got hit with a storm and a large number of motoroists got in accidents etc. Mabey not to the degree of this past storm, but from what I see every year in the news, it happens down there. I'm not fabricating this because it happened last year too.
I drive over 1000 miles a week, I live in the most snow ridden area in the country, I know how to drive in winter conditions. Yes I do have awd, so that does make a difference. I have never wrecked my car in the snow, never got in an accident in the snow or winter conditions, I drive about 3x as much as most people. I also do a lot of driving on country routes where the snow control is extremely minimal, meaning the county plow goes through once, and that's it.

No storm last year right?
who said there was no bad weather last year? And where in that article does it say there was a huge traffic jam with 1000 accidents?
It doesn't, because it didn't happen. Sure, we get snow or ice at least every other year, but that ice storm was at least predicted and planned for(one of the few times the weathermen were right). The one the year before was much worse, but neither did much to the roads.
So that is an irrelevent reference.

What I mean is, a situation like happened Wednesday does NOT happen here every year. It has never happened before, and likely never will again.

You keep touting how you drive on bad, snowy roads...fine, but you aren't, for the most part, driving on a sheet of ice. I can drive in the snow/ice as well as anyone from anywhere, and if I had the choice of driving on Wednesday's ice, or 1 foot of snow unplowed, I'd take the snow every time.
And yes, I have a 4x4, and it does make a HUGE difference whether it's snow or ice....you can go and slow down much better. I proved that beyond a shadow of a doubt Wednesday.

The crown of the roads is irrelevant to this situation. Snow doesn't run off like rain.
Here's a quote from the OP's link that tells how the ice happened:
"You had some melting from the compression of people driving on the roads, followed rapidly by refreezing," he said. Road crews were forced to try applying melting agents to jammed roads.

The cars melted the snow, and it turned to ice. No matter where you're from, driving on ice is difficult, and nobody is really used to it.
Did you read the articles or not? Quoted from the article from 2002(you may have missed it, I added it on an edit). Link if you didnt see it.

The magnitude of the ice storm in the Carolinas even surprised forecasters. A half inch to an inch of ice covered most of central North Carolina.

"The ice was definitely abnormal," Oravec said.


Now to quote you.

This does NOT happen to NC every year, it's never happened before in NC's history.

That was just from a very quick 30 second search. I clearly remember every year there being a large(definatly not 1000) accidents because of a winter storm.

I will continue to tout how I can drive in adverse weather, because you made the claim that most of the accidents in these conditions are from notherners, which is bs. "Goign around and asking tow truck drivers and body shops" isn't really good imperical data. What if these proprietors are southerners and the sentiment is "damn thoes yankees!" Either way it doesn't really matter. I don't want this to be a north vs south argument, that is pointless. Though you're the one that started it on that tract.

The conditions we get up here are worse every week, and I'm not going to assert that northern drivers are better than southern drivers, in my opinion everyone sucks in general. But claming that NC doesn't get hit with an ice storm every year is just bs.

[QI lived in GA, SC and NC for a total of ten+ years. And as far as I remember, most of the roads were crowned and had excellent drainage. I mean, the entire region gets a LOT of rain every year. They'd be flooded all the time without crowns and drainage... and they weren't flooded. [/quote]
Then I'd definatly be inclined to believe you. From what I remember in living in the Charleston area, many of the roads weren't crowned and when it rained they were near flooded very quickly. Many of these roads I'm talking about are around the james island, folly island and kiawah island area, so I would suppose the barrier island topography would have something to do with the way infastructure was engineered.
 

Pacfanweb

Lifer
Jan 2, 2000
13,149
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SampSon, those were freezing rain events. Not snow that got compressed into ice on the road. You are misunderstanding what I mean. I'm saying that we have NEVER had traffic conditions like Wednesday....ever. And nowhere in those articles does it say that, either.
Those ice storms WERE predicted, (pretty much), and the road conditions were nowhere near as bad as this past Wednesday. But they were expected, and most folks prepared appropriately, so there was nowhere near the road problems. Plus the roads weren't bad anyway.
But I WILL claim that NC does NOT get hit with an ice storm every year. We don't. We went through most of the 90's and didn't even get any significant snows or ice.
We did have a freezing rain even the last 2 winters....but nobody can remember when the last one before that was.
So the fact that we did have freezing rain last year and the year before does NOT mean that we "have an ice storm every year".

I agree with your assertion that most everyone's driving sucks. And I'm not saying that you personally, are not a good snow driver. BUT, every time we get some snow or ice here, we hear all sorts of northerners cracking about how we don't know how to drive, etc......but the ones down here wreck at least as much, or IMO more, than the natives.
All you have to do is drive slowly and act like you have some sense. Since lots of us think that most drivers don't have any sense in normal conditions, it stands to reason that those same drivers are even worse in winter weather.
 

Pacfanweb

Lifer
Jan 2, 2000
13,149
57
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Originally posted by: Spencer278
Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
Originally posted by: Spencer278
Just wonder but when you say cold do you mean around zero or do you mean a warm 32 degrees?
It was in the 20's all day.

That can be a bad temp to get snow. The snow would wet and not the nice and fluffy powered other place get and then with heavy traffic I can see it getting packed down. Also I'm willing to bet most people don't have snow tires.
That would be a good bet. And that's exactly what happened.
 

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
SampSon, those were freezing rain events. Not snow that got compressed into ice on the road. You are misunderstanding what I mean. I'm saying that we have NEVER had traffic conditions like Wednesday....ever. And nowhere in those articles does it say that, either.
Those ice storms WERE predicted, (pretty much), and the road conditions were nowhere near as bad as this past Wednesday. But they were expected, and most folks prepared appropriately, so there was nowhere near the road problems. Plus the roads weren't bad anyway.
But I WILL claim that NC does NOT get hit with an ice storm every year. We don't. We went through most of the 90's and didn't even get any significant snows or ice.
We did have a freezing rain even the last 2 winters....but nobody can remember when the last one before that was.
So the fact that we did have freezing rain last year and the year before does NOT mean that we "have an ice storm every year".

I agree with your assertion that most everyone's driving sucks. And I'm not saying that you personally, are not a good snow driver. BUT, every time we get some snow or ice here, we hear all sorts of northerners cracking about how we don't know how to drive, etc......but the ones down here wreck at least as much, or IMO more, than the natives.
All you have to do is drive slowly and act like you have some sense. Since lots of us think that most drivers don't have any sense in normal conditions, it stands to reason that those same drivers are even worse in winter weather.
Alright well, good luck with the cleanup!
 

Pacfanweb

Lifer
Jan 2, 2000
13,149
57
91
Heck, it all melted off yesterday. They predicted 1-3 inches last night. I have a bit of snow on my truck, that's it. Weathermen just can't get it right around here.
 

Spencer278

Diamond Member
Oct 11, 2002
3,637
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Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
Originally posted by: Spencer278
Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
Originally posted by: Spencer278
Just wonder but when you say cold do you mean around zero or do you mean a warm 32 degrees?
It was in the 20's all day.

That can be a bad temp to get snow. The snow would wet and not the nice and fluffy powered other place get and then with heavy traffic I can see it getting packed down. Also I'm willing to bet most people don't have snow tires.
That would be a good bet. And that's exactly what happened.

Of course I agree with the general idea that southerns can't drive in south or otherwise. You want to know who is blocking northen roads when it snows? Idiots from the south that can't drive and panic when the see 7 snow flakes.
 

MrMaster

Golden Member
Nov 16, 2001
1,235
2
76
www.pc-prime.com
Freezing rain is bad especially when it is black ice. Our first real winter storms cause plenty of accidents in WI.

The problem is here in Milwaukee, they dump tons of salt literally. In northern WI they use sand for the most part and only salt the highways. You also are lucky if they actually plow anything besides the highway or major county roads. It might not snow for say 2 weeks and you still have to travel very slow on the backroads cause it is packed snow and ice. It is just what you get use to.

 

Apathetic

Platinum Member
Dec 23, 2002
2,587
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I live in Raleigh and let me tell you it was pretty bad. It was essentialy a light freezing rain combined with some wet snow that melted and then refroze. Black ice everywhere. Combine that with rush hour traffic (everyone trying to leave early to pick up kids, etc) and a *LOT* of idiots on the roat and the result was pure chaos. There were about 1000 wrecks/disabled vehicles (literally) which were reported to the police. The gridlock was absolutely unbelieveable. One guy I work with who, like me, is from Great Lakes and is certainly used to nasty weather, needed 10 hours to get home (he lives out in the sticks).

Dave