Question Alder Lake - Official Thread

[Hulk]

With the release of Alder Lake less than a week away and the "Lakes" thread having turned into a nightmare to navigate I thought it might be a good time to start a discussion thread solely for Alder Lake.

 

[igor_kavinski]

This kind of stupidity in a corporate environment is what makes companies go bankrupt.

It wasn't for lack of trying. Multiple CEOs have tried their best to sink this ship. It's too big

 

[Markfw]

@igor_kavinski

Stirring the pot doesn't achieve much. For nerds that look at the low level specs know what is what and ignore the marketing. When you dive into the specs and benchmarks those things are usually pointed out. The average consumer though doesn't care and buys whatever the under informed sales person advises them on.

Sales people in most environments don't know jack about the technology beyond the tag on the shelf. Some might have a small amount of info if they're interested enough to dig deeper but, stores don't provide much info on products. If someone is spending $400 on a CPU they probably did some homework on it before doing so. Or they're buying some prebuilt POS from Best Buy or Wal-Mart.

BUT... Companies buying server hardware are not so dumb.... Anymore. And between the people that have a clue on hardware, and the companies that have a clue buying server hardware, it can really hurt over time. Today is an example. Microsoft, and several businesses buying supercomputers are buying AMD. Many users are still buying AMD. If Intel doesn't "wake up and smell the roses" and stop with the marketing crap, and actually start providing some good hardware, their days are numbered.

 

[Markfw]

Buddy, you're wasting your time here. It's a lost cause trying to get certain people to understand the mass consumer market vs. a niche product. All the bankruptcy and Intel is dead! talks have been going on for a good 5 years. Not to mention that it's totally derailing the thread regarding the actual product and technology that people want to talk about. It's also spun into some Intel vs. AMD non-sense that has nothing to do with the actual conversation in general.

Derailing the thread ? Talking about Alder Lake, right ? Yes, the insanity behind the 12900KS ? Why don't you respond with something on-topic about this product, instead of personal insults. I guess you can't do that, as you have a personal agenda here.

 

[epsilon84]

What matters for gaming is not all out all core speed of 5.2Ghz, but more likely 5.5Ghz ST core, so advantage in clock speed is in range of 15-22% in gaming, probably nearer 22% in most games.
Still 96MB of L3 has merits of it's own, and i fully expect some games will love it, and there will still be more games where 99 percentile FPS will be better on X3D chip.

True, I'm just using the all core turbo as a baseline figure, the 5800X3D will also have a higher ST boost as well, but its just the relative difference in clockspeed/IPC vs the 96MB L3 that will determine which CPU comes out ahead in games.

 

[igor_kavinski]

I'm sure the 96mb cache is going to ensure the 5800X3D is going to have a different IPC than regular desktop Zen 3.

But only in cache sensitive workloads.

 

[Markfw]

Here we go again. The 12900K(S) is "useless" because 8p+8e cores don't beat a 16c 5950x in overall multithreaded workloads, and it loses to a yet to be reviewed 5800X3D. Are you seeing your bias here? I mean do you read what you type? Or, do I always have to step in and point out the bias to you? Whether you like it or not, the best all-round processor right now is ADL. Usually, you want to see reputable reviews before making your opinion known, right? RIGHT? Biased much?

Look at the posts below yours. Many here think the 5800X3D may very well beat the 12900KS, not just me. I am a realist, not a blinded Intel fan.

Biased much ? Do you own both ? No. Do I ? Yes ! And the power draw ?? Everybody knows thats the 12900KS will be a power hog and hot. Its right in the techpowerup title. Best all round ? Show me a review that says that. Everything I read says mixed bag, and thats before the 5800X3D for gaming. I admit right now ADL is best for gaming, but not productivity, and that aligns with most reviews.

 

[guidryp]

It's the Pentium 4 EE again, maxed beyond reason to try to fend off a very competitive CPU

Really it's not. Alder Lake is a very good CPU. This is just a binned part for those who want to pay the most money for a slightly higher performance.

 

[igor_kavinski]

This is just a binned part for those who want to pay the most money for a slightly higher performance.

Yeah. It will pay for the KFC buckets when their engineers are working late at night. Sometimes they do 80 hour work weeks.

 

[Markfw]

And all that is false. All the things that are not multithreaded don't consume more than 142 watts on ADL. And why 142 watts? Don't you see what he's doing?

To be clear, I was talking about benchmarks, that at full power in benchmarks (multi-threaded usually) the 5950x only does 142 watts, and wins MOST of them.

By comparison, My 12700F does sometimes 300 watts with all threads going, and usually at least 200. And my criticism of the 12900k and 12900ks is mostly about high power consumption and heat. I need a big tower cooler for my 12700F.

 

[Markfw]

That's a very different argument than the one you've been spending most of your time on. If you'd left it at that, we wouldn't be having this discussion at all.

Its the way you interpret my posts. I have to be very clear sometimes not to be misquoted.

 

[AdamK47]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1554639531881553920

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1556095124714639365

Windows 11 Search bar being slowed down by E-cores.

Also found this: Workload balancing on E-cores seems strange on desktop - Microsoft Tech Community

E-cores should really be called V-cores (vampire cores) coz they suck the performance out of your workloads.

Running a base clock over 100MHz skews memory results in AIDA64 making it look much higher than they should be. The developers call it a bug. I believe they have their own made up formula assuming people run a 100MHz base clock.

 

[blckgrffn]

I really want Alder Lake to be great, but…

I am suspicious the platform (chipsets), ram and maybe even the combination of cores (while I like the 6C all P core CPU, I think adding four E cores and having 16 total threads would be the sweet spot) this time next year will be more compelling.

Excited to read reviews that might change my mind!

 

[jpiniero]

I'm convinced that DDR4 is the way to go if you were going to buy at launch. This always happens with new memory but unlike last time Intel changed memory you have a choice.

 

[UsandThem]

I'm convinced that DDR4 is the way to go if you were going to buy at launch. This always happens with new memory but unlike last time Intel changed memory you have a choice.

When Skylake launched with DDR4, they still had a limited number of boards that supported DDR3:

https://www.anandtech.com/show/9483/intel-skylake-review-6700k-6600k-ddr4-ddr3-ipc-6th-generation/7

It appears to be a similar situation this time with DDR5.

 

[Zucker2k]

I think Intel going with DDR5 for reviews (do they really have a choice?) means that overall, DDR5 provides better performance than DDR4 across the board. The jury is still out on DDR4 vs DDR5 on gaming, but looking at the fact that Intel even chose to support DDR4 on the new platform probably means it has its uses, outside of financial considerations for consumers, and especially, enthusiasts.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Is it true that we are finally getting ECC standard on DDR5 DIMMs? I thought that I had read that somewhere.

 

[Markfw]

Is it true that we are finally getting ECC standard on DDR5 DIMMs? I thought that I had read that somewhere.

Well, newegg has quite a few DDR5, none are ECC

 

[jpiniero]

When Skylake launched with DDR4, they still had a limited number of boards that supported DDR3:

https://www.anandtech.com/show/9483/intel-skylake-review-6700k-6600k-ddr4-ddr3-ipc-6th-generation/7

It appears to be a similar situation this time with DDR5.

Right now on Newegg they have 12 DDR4 boards versus 11 DDR5. We'll have to see what people choose but it's definately not going to be like Skylake's limited DDR3L support.

Big diff is that DDR4 had been available on the market for a year when Skylake was released.

 

[VirtualLarry]

So one same board can't take DDR4 and DDR5 in the same slots? That's what I kind of figured.

 

[Arthav]

It is the next-gen processors will heat up the AMD vs. Intel gaming

 

[Aikouka]

Is it true that we are finally getting ECC standard on DDR5 DIMMs? I thought that I had read that somewhere.

ECC is built into the module itself.

 

[dweilbacher]

I have not built a PC in a while (since 4th Gen intel). So it is time. The Alder Lake appears to be the right upgrade for me. PCI 5, DDR5. And I'm very interested/curious about the P / E Cores performance. Should be a fun build.

 

[KompuKare]

Is it true that we are finally getting ECC standard on DDR5 DIMMs? I thought that I had read that somewhere.

Sort of. If you are a marketeer.
DDR5 modules can have internal ECC. But that's not the same as proper ECC and I don't think the modules can signal anything to the CPU's memory controller about any errors.
What this seems to be more about, is that if the memory chips are run at high speeds which might cause errors, they can try to detect or correct those, AFAIK.
So I'd consider this more like how multi-layer NAND can and has to do error checking.

 

[phillyman36]

I wound up ordering
12900k PreOrder Newegg
Asus z690 Hero Pre order Newegg
Corsair Dominator 2x16 ddr5 5200Mhz (cl36) ram Directly from Corsair
I sold some of my old pc equipment so the money went towards Alder Lake. Ram should be here by Wednesday at the latest.

I'm either going to put it in my Corsair 680x case with a Noctua D15 Chromax black or in my Lian Li O11 dynamic xl case with the Galahad 360 AIo. (I have the lga 1700 mounting brackets for both.) For those getting it you doing air or water cooling? I leaning towards air since im probably not going to overclock. (unless someone gives me a good reason to go aio instead)
Once its set up ill probably sell my 5900x rig for more money for a second rig. ( I know someone will ask but the 5900x with the dark hero has been a headache for me usb disconnects memory error post codes of 40 even under default.) Im off the 4th and 5th so hopefully Newegg ships early so i can put it together.

 

[Hougy]

Looks like all the K chips will be based on the 8+8 die. So will the 6 core die be used only for locked, low frequency chips? Will they also bin these chips or will they waste the golden samples? Why?