AIW TV quality suck?

[Whitedog]

I didn't REALLY buy this card for the TV Tuner, I bought it for AGP (which good AGP cards are becoming too expensive and hard to come by) and it was only a few bux more than the regular card.

ANYWAY, I'm totally unimpressed with the TV reception quality of the AIW. Is it typical that the TV quality be "less than" what you get on a normal television?

I have just normal cable. Not digital/HD or anything.

Opinions on AIW's welcome.

BTW, my PC is the driving force behind my HTPC... (home built projector and 120" screen).

Lookie here

So the AIW is actually a nic addition. Get to watch TV @120 inches.. (just a bit fuzzy ya know)

 

[Peter]

Actually, it is more that on high quality display equipment, you merely NOTICE just how bad the normal TV signal really is.

Sure, it looks a lot "better" on those blurry, huge dot pitch, slow phosphor TV unit CRTs, from the sofa.

 

[Whitedog]

Uh... no. I actually NOTICE how bad it looks through my AIW on my computer.

you merely NOTICE just how bad the normal TV signal really is

You don't have a clue what you're talking about. I've been an audio/video hobbiest for over 20 years. I know what's supposed to look like what...

It looks just fine on my TV. Like a normal TV picture... I can put the two side by side... and the computer looks like I'm watching a VHS.
Yep, that's about it. VHS quality is about what I'm getting out of this card.

Look at a TV Signal through an NextVision N6 on your PC. You'll eat your own words. A high quality monitor is not going to make a picture look "worse". I watch DVD's through my computer all the time. DVD picture quality is amazing, and it is just barely better than NTSC res.
My cable reception is about as good as it gets. TV picture looks "about as good as it gets". The reception I get through my AIW looks like I'm watching an old VHS.

Just wondering if anyone else has similar experiences... I just want to know if there are tweaks to get it better, or if to just not use the tuner and forget about AIW's in the future. I used an once.

 

[thebigdude]

i don't know about tweaks to improve picture or anything but i am also unimpressed with the tv picture on this card

supposedly it is much improved in the newer aiw cards that are all pcie

 

[justlnluck]

I have yet to find an NTSC tuner on the PC that actually looks good. The only Standard Definition material I can tolerate are broadcast on digital channels and seen with an ATSC tuner. I recommend the Fusion5 if you need a card to watch TV with on your PC monitor.

 

[kylebisme]

Originally posted by: Whitedog
Just wondering if anyone else has similar experiences...

Perhaps, I've never been able to get my PC to display SD captures well. But the isssues vary depending on playback methods so at least best I can tell the problems are not inherent to the captures themselves but rather the playback. Any chance you could post some screenshots and or upload example captures to illustrate specific issues with the TV quality though your PC?

 

[Ichigo]

So you're saying DVD's look better than standard cable. Anything else?

 

[kylebisme]

Yeah, standard cable directly to the TV looks notably better than standard cable running to the PC and then to the TV, did you miss that part?

 

[n7]

I have yet to see a tuner that provides a very clear picture due to the crappiness of the analog signal in the first place.

 

[moonboy403]

because pc monitor is designed to display HIGH resolution unlike most standard definition tv

since you're displaying analog tv signal to your monitor, you're just stretching the pixels from the source
if you run it in 1:1 ratio on the monitor, it'll be a completely different story (images will good much better)

 

[kylebisme]

n7 and moonboy, none of what either of you mention is any exuse for the captures though the PC to look any worse than the same analog signal sent directly to the same display.

 

[n7]

Originally posted by: TheSnowman
n7 and moonboy, none of what either of you mention is any exuse for the captures though the PC to look any worse than the same analog signal sent directly to the same display.

Maybe it's just because i'm nicely buzzed, but i cannot figure out wtf you are trying to say?

 

[dug777]

Originally posted by: n7

Originally posted by: TheSnowman
n7 and moonboy, none of what either of you mention is any exuse for the captures though the PC to look any worse than the same analog signal sent directly to the same display.

Maybe it's just because i'm nicely buzzed, but i cannot figure out wtf you are trying to say?

i'll second that

 

[Whitedog]

Originally posted by: justlnluck

I recommend the Fusion5 if you need a card to watch TV with on your PC monitor.

Thanks. I'll look into the Fusion5. It's not my normal monitor I watch TV through. I have an XGA projector I hook up to my PC for viewing movies (and now TV). Though it is essentually a 15" XGA flat panel monitor inside (See link in post#1).

Thanks for all the replies.

So you're saying DVD's look better than standard cable. Anything else?

I think you missed the point. It was being implied that a low res signal looks like CRAP on a high res monitor. DVD by comparison to my monitor resolution IS low res... yet it looks very good, because the PC can scale it Very well. In fact, DVD's look MUCH better on the PC than they do on a TV. That is why HTPC's are popular amoung Home Video enthusiest. There's no reason why TV signal can't scale to some degree. But to be worse? That's where I am quesioning the quality of the "course" of the tuner.

Again, thanks.

 

[Dman877]

ATI's older tuners suck. Their new 550 chip isn't bad but it's buggy and unstable in my experience. Go with hauppage/dscalar for analog signals on a pc imo.

 

[Whitedog]

Originally posted by: moonboy403
because pc monitor is designed to display HIGH resolution unlike most standard definition tv

since you're displaying analog tv signal to your monitor, you're just stretching the pixels from the source
if you run it in 1:1 ratio on the monitor, it'll be a completely different story (images will good much better)

See post #3 Replace Post#2's comments with these. :roll:

 

[kylebisme]

Originally posted by: n7

Originally posted by: TheSnowman
n7 and moonboy, none of what either of you mention is any exuse for the captures though the PC to look any worse than the same analog signal sent directly to the same display.

Maybe it's just because i'm nicely buzzed, but i cannot figure out wtf you are trying to say?

Simply put:

Cable -> PC -> TV = looks like crap

Cable -> TV = looks notably less crappy

Your "crappiness of the analog signal in the first place" and moonboy's "pc monitor is designed to display HIGH resolution" arguments are irrelevent since the
the cable signal and the TV are the same in both equations.

 

[kylebisme]

And again,Whitedog, any chance you could post some screenshots and or upload example captures to illustrate specific issues with the TV quality though your PC? Or at least try to describe them? There really isn't much anyone can do to tell you how to improve your image quality unless you first give an explanation of what you see wrong with it.

 

[Peter]

Well, I've got enough experience in the area to help you identify and improve possible causes, in signal input, hardware environment, and software setup.

Seeing what a friendly guy you are, I won't. Get lost.

 

[Whitedog]

Originally posted by: Peter
Well, I've got enough experience in the area to help you identify and improve possible causes, in signal input, hardware environment, and software setup.

Yea, I gathered that from post #2. And uhmm... I don't recall asking for any help. Just opinions on "AIW's". See post #3.
Actually, in real life, I am a very nice guy. But this is forums, and you're right. I'm not very nice. At least not at this one. I guess it's due to constantly having to deal with people's ego's. Anyway, bye.

Hey TheSnowman again, I don't recall stating I had problems I'm trying to resolve. Just asking for opinions on "others experiences" with AIW or similar cards.
I doubt there's anything I could do to "improve" my situation, other than... get different hardware? But thanks.

 

[Whitedog]

Originally posted by: Dman877
ATI's older tuners suck. Their new 550 chip isn't bad but it's buggy and unstable in my experience. Go with hauppage/dscalar for analog signals on a pc imo.

Now there's a post worthy to deserve a big Thanks! http://www.hauppauge.com/

I think I'm going to redirect this over to AVSForums.

Vrooooooooooooooooooommmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.................

 

[will889]

Pic quality was ok with a minimized/resized smaller boxed screen, but you already know that right? That was really all i i wanted the AIW for to begin. I would have bought a hauppage if i truely wanted full screen pic quality. So yes, i got a grainy screen as well when running fuill screen with the AIW. I actually used thu-view with about a 3x5 box screen while i was sufing more than anything else. I have seen a hauppage PVR 250 full screen and it was noticably better.

 

[user3657]

hell, i have a 4 year old turner, and its great. it only does analog but for the tvs we have digital boxs, and the turner is just as sharp as watching tv on the sony with digital cable.

i dont know if it matters, but i just use the turner for the pc, i dont tv-out or anything.

 

[kylebisme]

Originally posted by: Whitedog

Originally posted by: Peter
Well, I've got enough experience in the area to help you identify and improve possible causes, in signal input, hardware environment, and software setup.

Yea, I gathered that from post #2. And uhmm... I don't recall asking for any help. Just opinions on "AIW's". See post #3.
Actually, in real life, I am a very nice guy. But this is forums, and you're right. I'm not very nice. At least not at this one. I guess it's due to constantly having to deal with people's ego's. Anyway, bye.

Hey TheSnowman again, I don't recall stating I had problems I'm trying to resolve. Just asking for opinions on "others experiences" with AIW or similar cards.
I doubt there's anything I could do to "improve" my situation, other than... get different hardware? But thanks.

Sure I understand, you want to "improve your situation" without even taking the time to clarify what you find lacking in your current situation. You just want to discount all the software involved in the process of capturing live TV and blame it on the hardware in the hopes that replacing that will solve the problem which you have trouble even acknowledging. So yeah, just buy a new card and cross your fingers, that might do the trick.

Oh, and Peter is actually rather light on ego considering his expertise on this subject, he works with various capturing hardware and software probably more than anyone else on this forum and has even written drivers for capture cards.

But again, yeah, you are welcome to just brush off all the other possibilities and advice you might get here and just buy yourself a Hauppauge. I've used some Hauppauge cards before as well as Theater200 based cards like the one you are using now and other makes of capture cards as well, so if you did take the time to specify what you are looking to achieve I might be able to recomend a card that will live up to your expectations. But obviusly you aren't interested in taking the time to do that, so I suppose I just recommend that you pray to the Easter Bunny or something and hope the next card you suits your expectations.

 

[will889]

Yes i too was suprised that Peter constrained himself.