Ahmadinejad: Iran is determined to eradicate Israel

[Chaosblade02]

How exactly would a Mig 35 "take down" an Israeli F-16 fighter jet? The only stock weaponry is the cannon, and since we arm the Israeli's with the most advanced air to air missiles in the world, and the Russians arm the Iranians with stuff they don't want anymore, it wouldn't exactly be a fair fight. 😉

Also while the Israeli's don't have stealth bombers, they have world renown avionics packages and are a developer of the "stealth" (reduced radar visibility) coating in use on many US aircraft.

The F-16 is still a generation 4 fighter Jet. State of the art is Generation 5. FA-22 Raptors, JSFs, and Russia has a Sukhoi PAK FA that is a gen 5. It is rumored that China also made Gen 5 fighter jet reverse engineered from the Russian design. F-16 is outdated, its 30 year old technology. Your F-16 fighters are not a Stealth aircraft, which makes them vulnerable to SAMs. America is giving Israel the stuff it doesn't want anymore. If Iran happens to get their hands on some Russian Gen 5 fighters, Israel would be in a world of shit. The Russians are known to be much more willing to sell their stuff than the US is. Maybe you guys should hit Russia up for some Gen 5 fighters with the money the US is giving you. They cost much less than the American ones.

 

[EagleKeeper]

What Gen 5 equipment does Iran have? The quality of anything that is a Gen 4 would be suspect.

China had Gen 4 fighters that were taken down by an unarmed P3.
The quality of training for the crew is a big differential - playing with yourself does not improve your training level.

 

[Chaosblade02]

What Gen 5 equipment does Iran have? The quality of anything that is a Gen 4 would be suspect.

China had Gen 4 fighters that were taken down by an unarmed P3.
The quality of training for the crew is a big differential - playing with yourself does not improve your training level.

I can't argue about the training of the pilot. And I doubt Iran currently has anything Gen 5, but its only a matter of time, because Russia is known to sell what they got to anyone with the money to buy it. They helped them build a nuclear reactor, why wouldn't they sell them a Gen 5 fighter?

Gen 4 taken out by a P3? Surely you must be joking. Those Viet Kong migs were doing a number on the US during Vietnam, one could argue their pilots and training was inferior, but they still raised total hell with what they had. Mig 19s were dropping F-4 Phantoms out of the air like they were going out of style.

 

[Doboji]

November 13, 2006

"Israel is destined for destruction and will soon disappear"
Israel is "a contradiction to nature, we foresee its rapid disappearance and destruction."

May 11, 2006

Israel is "a regime based on evil that cannot continue and one day will vanish."

December 8, 2005

"Some European countries insist on saying that Hitler killed millions of innocent Jews in furnaces.... Although we don't accept this claim, if we suppose it is true, our question for the Europeans is: Is the killing of innocent Jewish people by Hitler the reason for their support to the occupiers of Jerusalem? If the Europeans are honest they should give some of their provinces in Europe -- like in Germany, Austria or other countries -- to the Zionists and the Zionists can establish their state in Europe."
(While speaking to reporters at an Islamic summit in Mecca)

Do I need to keep going or do you want to continue playing semantics with the terms Zionism, Jews, and Regime?

 

[ProfJohn]

I can't argue about the training of the pilot. And I doubt Iran currently has anything Gen 5, but its only a matter of time, because Russia is known to sell what they got to anyone with the money to buy it. They helped them build a nuclear reactor, why wouldn't they sell them a Gen 5 fighter?

Gen 4 taken out by a P3? Surely you must be joking. Those Viet Kong migs were doing a number on the US during Vietnam, one could argue their pilots and training was inferior, but they still raised total hell with what they had. Mig 19s were dropping F-4 Phantoms out of the air like they were going out of style.

Vietnam was an active war where the pilots were getting lots and lots of flying time.

The current Iranian air force hasn't faced a real opponent since the Iran-Iraq war ended.

And anyone with a brain knows that in the end it comes down to training and the Israeli pilots are some of the best trained in the world.


And the biggest thing to keep in mind is avionics and the element of surprise. They blew up the Syrian reactor and were gone before the Syrian's even know they were there.

It is not like Iran has a bunch of fighter planes circling the skies waiting for the Israeli's to show up. With a well planned attack the bombs may be falling before the Iranian's have a chance to react and at that point they may not risk sending planes up.

 

[Chaosblade02]

November 13, 2006

"Israel is destined for destruction and will soon disappear"
Israel is "a contradiction to nature, we foresee its rapid disappearance and destruction."

May 11, 2006

Israel is "a regime based on evil that cannot continue and one day will vanish."

They mean nuclear, I cannot see of any other way a nation could suddenly "vanish", or "disappear". And it wouldn't take too many nukes to make that happen.

 

[Chaosblade02]

Vietnam was an active war where the pilots were getting lots and lots of flying time.

The current Iranian air force hasn't faced a real opponent since the Iran-Iraq war ended.

And anyone with a brain knows that in the end it comes down to training and the Israeli pilots are some of the best trained in the world.


And the biggest thing to keep in mind is avionics and the element of surprise. They blew up the Syrian reactor and were gone before the Syrian's even know they were there.

It is not like Iran has a bunch of fighter planes circling the skies waiting for the Israeli's to show up. With a well planned attack the bombs may be falling before the Iranian's have a chance to react and at that point they may not risk sending planes up.

Iran is confirmed to have an extensive radar net, and those F-16 fighters aren't stealth aircraft which means they will get a heads up when Israel sends them into the country. Many of the reactors above ground are also known to have lots of SAM batteries in the vicinity around them. They know this because they have reviewed satellite imagery. Comparing Iran to Syria is not a good comparison. Iran is much, much better equipped. If they were as weak as Syria, the IDF would have already bombed them. Its more than possible Israel could send a squadron into Iran and lose every single aircraft before they get anywhere near a reactor without having to launch a single fighter jet in the air. SAMs own non-stealth aircraft.

They could send a tomahawk cruise missile to hit the reactor, but it would just result in Tel Aviv being targeted by Iranian medium range missiles. They don't have any options that aren't going to result in a lot of casualties to take out that reactor, and its possible they will completely fail in the objective.

I am certain the IDF is aware of everything I just said, which would explain why they are so hesitant to take any action. They would have an enormous risk of sending some of their best pilots to their deaths. An Israeli pilot ejecting and landing in Iranian territory would also be certain death, probably by beheading.

 

[ProfJohn]

I think you are over estimating the effectiveness of Iranian SAM missiles.

Iraq supposedly had a good system too and we demolished it in a couple of hours.

And read up on the HARM missile. The first planes in would be the EW planes to jam radars and blow up any SAM site that made itself a target.


I would say the main reason they have yet to launch an attack is doubtfulness as to whether they could do enough damage to the bunkers and the fallout from bombing Iran. Plus the distance and logistics make it a tough mission, especially since we would have to give them go a head to fly over Iraq.

 

[Nebor]

The active air defense systems that the Iranians use would be jammed and destroyed with anti-radar missiles as the first order of business. Especially with assistance from the ever present AWACS in the region, which we employ with joint exercises with Israel regularly.

I think you're just failing to realize how advanced the Israeli military industrial complex is. We (the US) buy stuff from them.

 

[William Gaatjes]

I think you are over estimating the effectiveness of Iranian SAM missiles.

Iraq supposedly had a good system too and we demolished it in a couple of hours.

And read up on the HARM missile. The first planes in would be the EW planes to jam radars and blow up any SAM site that made itself a target.


I would say the main reason they have yet to launch an attack is doubtfulness as to whether they could do enough damage to the bunkers and the fallout from bombing Iran. Plus the distance and logistics make it a tough mission, especially since we would have to give them go a head to fly over Iraq.

Time for a bit of speculation :
This makes me think of the US invading Iraq on false premises as a strategic move in a game of real life war chess. It fit also the hostile behavior from the US against Iran after Iran negotiated with the Afghan warlords on behalf of the US in Afghanistan to find Al Qaeda bases. The US in Iraq would make it a lot easier. I suspect that if 2012 US president elections will present a conservative republican oriented president, Israel will get the go ahead to attack Iran.

 

[woolfe9999]

The question of Israel's capacity to neutralize key Iranian nuclear sites was extensively analyzed in 2007:

http://belfercenter.ksg.harvard.edu/files/is3104_pp007-033_raas_long.pdf

Based on technology then available to both sides, the conclusion was that Israel had super-adequate capability to do so.

 

[Chaosblade02]

I think you are over estimating the effectiveness of Iranian SAM missiles.

Iraq supposedly had a good system too and we demolished it in a couple of hours.

And read up on the HARM missile. The first planes in would be the EW planes to jam radars and blow up any SAM site that made itself a target.


I would say the main reason they have yet to launch an attack is doubtfulness as to whether they could do enough damage to the bunkers and the fallout from bombing Iran. Plus the distance and logistics make it a tough mission, especially since we would have to give them go a head to fly over Iraq.

By we you are referring to America, not Israel. America is far more capable of dealing with such threats because they have Stealth Bombers. The first aircraft sent into Iraq were Stealth aircraft, a Stealth Bomber with its massive payload could take out dozens of radar installations and SAM sites in a single mission. Israel doesn't have this capability. They can grovel at Obama's feet all they want, but its unlikely he will take care of their dirty work for them. This is one area I actually support him in.

And if these Israeli F-16s are such amazing aircraft the Americans in Iraq shouldn't even know they even flew through the airspace.

 

[Nebor]

By we you are referring to America, not Israel. America is far more capable of dealing with such threats because they have Stealth Bombers. The first aircraft sent into Iraq were Stealth aircraft, a Stealth Bomber with its massive payload could take out dozens of radar installations and SAM sites in a single mission. Israel doesn't have this capability. They can grovel at Obama's feet all they want, but its unlikely he will take care of their dirty work for them. This is one area I actually support him in.

And if these Israeli F-16s are such amazing aircraft the Americans in Iraq shouldn't even know they even flew through the airspace.

Israeli IFFs will correspond with our Patriots. The Israeli's can't fly round trip without refueling over Iraq though, so hopefully we can help them out.

Or we could gift them some B2s.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Iran is confirmed to have an extensive radar net, and those F-16 fighters aren't stealth aircraft which means they will get a heads up when Israel sends them into the country. Many of the reactors above ground are also known to have lots of SAM batteries in the vicinity around them. They know this because they have reviewed satellite imagery. Comparing Iran to Syria is not a good comparison. Iran is much, much better equipped. If they were as weak as Syria, the IDF would have already bombed them. Its more than possible Israel could send a squadron into Iran and lose every single aircraft before they get anywhere near a reactor without having to launch a single fighter jet in the air. SAMs own non-stealth aircraft.

They could send a tomahawk cruise missile to hit the reactor, but it would just result in Tel Aviv being targeted by Iranian medium range missiles. They don't have any options that aren't going to result in a lot of casualties to take out that reactor, and its possible they will completely fail in the objective.

I am certain the IDF is aware of everything I just said, which would explain why they are so hesitant to take any action. They would have an enormous risk of sending some of their best pilots to their deaths. An Israeli pilot ejecting and landing in Iranian territory would also be certain death, probably by beheading.

Syria supposedly had the best Russian export radar and SAM system. Look what happens over there. The IAF has unhindered operations over Syria.

Because SAM systems are ground radar based; they are also susceptible to ground operations.

The quality of Iranian missiles is suspect. When they have to photoshop launches, it should raise questions.

The IDF does not want to go after Iran until all other world options are exhausted and their backs are feeling the wall. However, Iran's stall jobs (learned well from Iraq) and the support from Russia and others, make it difficult for the world to get an accurate determination of exactly what Iran has and is doing. They state one thing yet are acting in a different direction. Deliberate sleight of hand?

And your questionable statement regarding the P3 vs Mig. Look it up. A clue: April 2001

 

[Nebor]

Yeah I meant to mention if I didn't already, Iran doesn't have missiles capable of striking Israel, nor does Israel have missile capable of striking Iran as far as I know. Israel does have more regional force projection capabilities than Iran thoughn.

 

[kylebisme]

There's barely more than 1000 km between Iran and Israel, while Iran's Shahab-3 can cover nearly twice that, Israel's Jericho III goes much further yet, and Israel has Dolphin-class subs from which they could nuke any piece of the planet from. That said, Ahmadinejad's proclamations of an end to the Zionist regime don't mean he's intent on nuking Israel just as Reagan's calls for an end to the Soviet regime didn't mean he was intent on bombing Russia. All the bluster suggesting otherwise is just a guise to distract attention from Israel's ongoing occupation and colonization of what little is left of Palestine.

 

[Chaosblade02]

Time for a bit of speculation :
This makes me think of the US invading Iraq on false premises as a strategic move in a game of real life war chess. It fit also the hostile behavior from the US against Iran after Iran negotiated with the Afghan warlords on behalf of the US in Afghanistan to find Al Qaeda bases. The US in Iraq would make it a lot easier. I suspect that if 2012 US president elections will present a conservative republican oriented president, Israel will get the go ahead to attack Iran.

I agree with this post, except for what I underlined, even though the comment as you intended it is spot on.

I quit calling them Republicans and Conservatives, because they no longer stand for strong Conservative principles, they are simply Zionists. The only true Conservative in the entire group of prospects is Ron Paul, the rest are simply Zionists. If you wear and Israeli pin on your clothes instead of an American one, you are a Zionist. If you make a pilgrimage to Israel during the recess, then you are a Zionist. If you speak more about your love for Israel than for your love of America, then you are a Zionist. If you vote to give Israel foreign aid, going against the conservative principles you ran on even when we are dirt broke, you are a Zionist.

And as someone who is a real Conservative, I would rather vote for a damn Liberal Commie than a Zionist claiming to be a Conservative under false pretenses. Republican my ass, its the Zio-Party.

And yes I will vote for Barack Hussein Obama over your goddamn Zio-Party.

I am not trying to troll Republicans on here, or anything, but I honestly feel that way.

And BTW fuck the Tea-Party, because I showed up with a sign saying "Vote the Zionists out" and I was asked to leave by 3 very big White boys.

 

[Oric]

I hate to see when people discuss with appetite how the tyrannt of the region is going to bomb another country

 

[Abwx]

Syria supposedly had the best Russian export radar and SAM system. Look what happens over there. The IAF has unhindered operations over Syria.

You re a joke , EK...

Syria has only very old air defense systems, though this will
change since they re currently receiving russian made Favorit
S300 , wich although relatively old , are way superior to the
US dwindling Patriot system...

 

[Abwx]

s.

Iraq supposedly had a good system too and we demolished it in a couple of hours.

Yet another one that has no idea of what he is talking about..

You destroyed nothing since there was almost nothing to destroy
as Iraq was disarmedprior to the war and had only a few remnant of old early 80s air defense gear.

Since they were under total embargo since 1991 , where would have
they found some new gears ??..

Indeed, should Iraq had the same army than in the 80s , never
the US would have dared to try an invasion....

 

[Abwx]

All the bluster suggesting otherwise is just a guise to distract attention from Israel's ongoing occupation and colonization of what little is left of Palestine.

And it works well given the surprising number of zio medics brainwashed
US "citizens" that are hanging by there to spread their junk..:biggrin:

 

[Chaosblade02]

And it works well given the surprising number of zio medics brainwashed
US "citizens" that are hanging by there to spread their junk..:biggrin:

Not all of us here are Zio-Party voters. I despise them, for more reasons than just one. For them to put the interests of Israel ahead of that of their own nation makes them traitors by the very definition, and they should be tried as such in a court of law. America is broke, but they still give Israel $3 billion a year in weapons and aid. If they took a vote just based on that it would be nearly unanimous. We borrow the money from China just to turn around and give it to Israel.

I hope Ahmadinejad is successful in his goals, it would just mean a whole lot less drama in the region and the world would be a whole lot more peaceful and stable. One thing is going to have to happen, either Israel has gotta go, or all of the Muslim countries are going to have to be defeated. Seeing how Israel is just a blip on the world map that can barely be seen, its much more likely they will be the ones defeated.

I never forgave Israel for what they did to the USS Liberty in their treachery. And when payback finally comes back around, it will be re payed in spades. And the poor girl Rachel Corrie that was murdered in cold blood by an Israeli bulldozer, bless her heart.

 

[Abwx]

Not all of us here are Zio-Party voters. I despise them, for more reasons than just one. For them to put the interests of Israel ahead of that of their own nation makes them traitors by the very definition, and they should be tried as such in a court of law. America is broke, but they still give Israel $3 billion a year in weapons and aid. If they took a vote just based on that it would be nearly unanimous. We borrow the money from China just to turn around and give it to Israel.

I hope Ahmadinejad is successful in his goals, it would just mean a whole lot less drama in the region and the world would be a whole lot more peaceful and stable. One thing is going to have to happen, either Israel has gotta go, or all of the Muslim countries are going to have to be defeated. Seeing how Israel is just a blip on the world map that can barely be seen, its much more likely they will be the ones defeated.

The indirect cost is way more than 3bn , and amount to hundreds
of billions yearly.

This is the induced cost for the US of being deprived of most of the
Islamic countries markets and huge contracts that are given either
to asian corporates or european ones.

The US zionist inspired desesperate move to block islamic countries from gaining technological know how harm the US incredibly , yet this country
is continuing on this suicidal path thanks to an ideoligical enslavement
built by US zionists agents.

US people are starting to feel the results of this influence through
a dwindling economy , yet , they are unable to relate it to their
country being economically less present in the world , with the presence
in china as a convenient way to turn a blind eye on reality.

On the long run , though , the islamic world market will be more
important than a few millions desperados pursuing their wet dream
of keeping the land grabs they performed...

 

[Chaosblade02]

The indirect cost is way more than 3bn , and amount to hundreds
of billions yearly.

This is the induced cost for the US of being deprived of most of the
Islamic countries markets and huge contracts that are given either
to asian corporates or european ones.

The US zionist inspired desesperate move to block islamic countries from gaining technological know how harm the US incredibly , yet this country
is continuing on this suicidal path thanks to an ideoligical enslavement
built by US zionists agents.

US people are starting to feel the results of this influence through
a dwindling economy , yet , they are unable to relate it to their
country being economically less present in the world , with the presence
in china as a convenient way to turn a blind eye on reality.

On the long run , though , the islamic world market will be more
important than a few millions desperados pursuing their wet dream
of keeping the land grabs they performed...

If the Israeli is taken out, the US will no longer have any motivation to get involved in the affairs of Muslim nations. Which I think is the end result of what you guys want to begin with, correct?

We have oil in the US, resources that are mostly untapped. They estimate we could run another 50-100 years on what we have, if we actually drilled for it. But what they are doing is making you all drill up all of your oil and use what you have first. When your countries have no oil left, then you have nothing to bargain with of any interest to the US. What do you guys make that we actually buy besides crude oil?

I will tell you exactly why the US is supporting Israel. It is mostly due to Christian ideology, of believing the Israelites are gods chosen peoples, and they must do anything they can to protect them at all costs, even at the cost of their own. Because they think siding with Israel is siding with God. It is a crazy and suicidal ideology at the same time, we call it Zionism.

 

[Abwx]

If the Israeli is taken out, the US will no longer have any motivation to get involved in the affairs of Muslim nations. Which I think is the end result of what you guys want to begin with, correct?

We have oil in the US, resources that are mostly untapped. They estimate we could run another 50-100 years on what we have, if we actually drilled for it. But what they are doing is making you all drill up all of your oil and use what you have first. When your countries have no oil left, then you have nothing to bargain with of any interest to the US. What do you guys make that we actually buy besides crude oil?

I m talking of industrial and infrastructure contracts, not of oil.
The US corporate are not much present in islamic countries
or their offers are purpotedly rejected.
When Bechtel did bid for a 15bn contract for a 1000km six lane highway
in north Africa , their offer was rejected in favor of a chinese and a japanese groups.
I dont think japanese infrastrucures orientated entreprises are more
competitive than US ones , though , and these kind of exemples
are countless.

I will tell you exactly why the US is supporting Israel. It is mostly due to Christian ideology, of believing the Israelites are gods chosen peoples, and they must do anything they can to protect them at all costs, even at the cost of their own. Because they think siding with Israel is siding with God. It is a crazy and suicidal ideology at the same time, we call it Zionism.

Mental slavery ,yet, the US call herself a land of freedom...🙂