AGP 4x ??? Finally... a definitive answer !!!!

[mugwampbro]

I have an MSI 6337 LITE v3.0 mobo with an i815EP chipset. My video card is an ASUS 7100 PRO/PURE (GeFORCE 2 mx 400/ 64mb). My AGP slot is 'universal' agp 2x/4x . Both mobo and video card are 2.0 compliant.
I CANNOT get this combo to run at 4x AGP. I have tried various programs (NVMAX, etc.) and although 4x AGP stays "tic'd" in the program, SANDRA reports 2x AGP.
MSI says this mobo is supposed to "auto-detect" and apply 4x AGP but it doesn't. There is no option in the bios to enable 4x AGP. I am going to flash a new (FULL version) bios to see if this will fix the problem.
I have been researching this problem for over 2 mos. now and NOBODY, I mean NOBODY !!!!...knows the answer. I think I may have found the answer but I need some confirmation....here goes....( correct me if I'm wrong)
Through my searches............... I found that (according to INTEL) the 815EP chipset will only allow 4x AGP if the video card runs at 1.5 volts. My video card runs at 3.3 volts. AH-HA !!!!!!
Since MSI says..."duh.....it's SUPPOSED to work" (by that, I guess they mean that the mobo is supposed to instruct the chipset that the card is running at 1.5 volts instead of 3.3 volts) but doesn't....is there a way to physically change the supplied voltage of the card ?? or do I even want to do that ..(less performance, etc.) ????
So many people I've talked to on this issue simply bought new mobos or video cards. I don't like taking the easy way out, plus theres the $$$$$$ issue.
I KNOW theres not that much difference between 2x's and 4x's AGP... but I paid for it and I want it to work ( waa,waa,waa) !! ( or at least FIND OUT FOR SURE, why it doesn't).
If all else fails.....I do have a BIG hammer and I know where THEY live.
Anybody got an answer?????
Thanks for all help, but Please don't reply unless it concerns the voltage or bios issue....believe me, I've tried most everything else.

 

[WarCon]

I really don't have much on the ways of suggesting, but have you made sure that Sandra is reporting correctly? WCPUID gives that info also. link to h-oda's website for WCPUID

 

[mugwampbro]

Thanks...yes CPUID reports same, but with a little more info. It shows that only 1x and 2x are available and that (under 'command'), 2x is currently being implemented.:disgust:

 

[WarCon]

Good luck with your flashing. (Is it safe to flash the "Lite" mobo with a full version?)

Honestly I think its just a matter of the mobo doesn't see your card as 4x capable because it runs at 3.3v.

When you upgrade mobo's again (if you still have that video card then), make sure the board supports 3.3v. My ASUS P4B266-C won't boot with that video card in, it has to be a 1.5volt version.

 

[Bozo Galora]

Under AGP specification 2.0 by Intel:
4X is 1.5V only
1X 2X CAN be 3.3V or 1.5V
one of the edge connector pins on the vicard acts as a detector to what is being SUPPLIED by the motherboard's
voltage distribution circuits at a specific MOTHERBOARD bios AGP setting
the VIDCARD bios and card components determines what voltage IT will run and at what AGP setting
the notches in cardedge were used to prevent inappropriate insertions of noncompliant cards
the lazy mobo manufacturers have now utilized a universal slot that will take any card (unfortunately)
GF3 and 4 run at 1.5V when set in mobo bios to 1X, 2X or 4X
the GF2 MX is a borderline card that was sold as a 4X "RATED" but not runnable at 4X - its phoney
there is nothing you can change.

you may find the following relevant:

(Quote)

AGP Graphic Boards on Intel i845 and i850 Chipsets [Update]

The Reason for Updating

In our recently (21st of October) published article dealing with this issue we tried to show an absolutely reliable method for definitely distinguishing 3.3V AGP2x graphic boards from 1.5V AGP2x/4x boards for the purpose of avoiding hardware damage when operating these graphic boards into i845/i850-based motherboards.

There was ample feedback of our readers, but merely little of the graphic board's manufacturers. Solely Hercules, unfortunately classified as concerned in that article, looked into the matter and was now able to point out that our demonstrated testing method is incorrect!

[AGP Graphic Boards on Intel i845 and i850 Chipsets]

http://www.hardtecs4u.com/reviews/2001/agp4x_e/index2.php
http://www.hardtecs4u.com/reviews/2001/agp4x_e/index3.php
http://www.hardtecs4u.com/reviews/2001/agp4x_update_e/

Summary of the Problem

1. At present there are various types of graphic boards on the market. Some of the actual models are pure AGP2x boards, some of them are capable of both AGP2x and AGP4x mode. These modes and their technical requirements are exactly defined by Intel's AGP2.0 Specifications.

Among others these specifications are prescribing a voltage of 1.5V for AGP4x graphic boards, whereas AGP2x boards may quite possible be manufactured for 1.5V or 3.3V working voltage.
Signaling Level- AGP 1x Mode- AGP 2x Mode -AGP 4x Mode
3.3 Volt .................yes.....................yes......................no
1.5 Volt .................yes.....................yes......................yes

2. Corresponding to the different AGP graphic boards there are different types of AGP sockets. While the AGP4x slot and the AGP2x slot are very seldom found, predominantly AGP universal slots are used in current motherboards. This slot allows to plug in easily AGP1x up to AGP4x graphic boards. These already demonstrated pictures show the difference in slot structure.

3. Current popular chipsets like Intel i815, VIA KT133(A), KT266(A), AMD 760(MP) etc. are supporting both AGP working voltages of 1.5 and 3.3V, whereas motherboards based on Intel's i845 or i850 chipset and nVIDIA's forthcoming nForce are unable to work with 3.3V graphic boards, absolutely requiring an 1.5V AGP graphic board for avoiding damage of both mother- and graphic board. For the same purpose it is compulsory to use only AGP4x slots on the concerned motherboards, yet applying to all available i845, i850 and nForce motherboards according to our present knowledge.

Unfortunately some manufacturers put AGP2x graphic boards with AGP4x-shaped plugs on the market, therefore fitting into AGP4x coded slots. This should be no problem as long as these graphic boards provide a signaling level of 1.5 Volt or are solely used in motherboards with the above listed 1.5/3.3V-compatible chipsets. But exactly this seems not be ensured in all cases, as there was feedback from motherboard manufacturers and users as well, informing about hardware damage after plugging such a graphic board into an i845 motherboard and therewith providing the basis of our article.

 

[WarCon]

Well there ya go........................

Nice article Bozo (very definative), I had a Geforce2 MX board that came advertised as a 4x capable (false advertising?), but it would cause system lockups in my Abit KT7A every time I tried 4x. I now know why.......

There is a term for that, but I really try not to swear......

 

[GrumpyMan]

See there ask and thy shall recieve. Bozo knows..............

 

[mugwampbro]

I read that article, while in my quest for answers, and agree that it's an excellent article. In fact, it's what brought me to this forum. Well finally an answer...allright. MSI and ASUS just kept saying "it should work..". What gets me is that they probaly knew the answer all along, and just wasted my time. I thought I was on the right track...to MSI and especially ASUS, I say..."that's a BOZO no-no !!"
Thanks to all and especially BOZO. That card is going back and I'm getting the GAINWARD GeFORCE 3 POWERPAK ti/450 featured in ANANDTECH's january/2002 roundup. It's only around $125.00 now and just about as fast as the G4's (and hopefully 1.5 volts) !!!
Thanks again for the answer and the excellent "round-up" !!!