advice on a situation a friend is in at work.

[waggy]

I have a friend (Not me. hell i haven't worked for years) who does stuff at work i think is going to get him fired. He says they won't. anyway here is the situation. I should mention this is his first real job.

He gets 2 weeks vacation every year. he blows through the 2 of vacation by Feb. Also whenever he gets 6 hours of sick time he uses it. Every now and then he will just take a day off if he only has 1 point. You get a point for each day missed (non vacation). if you get 3 points you get written up, 4 and you get a final written notice. they drop off after 6 weeks. So he has it marked when they drop off so he can take a day off.

Also 2-3 times a year they will get "hurt" and get off of work for a week using short term disability so he gets paid.

He has worked at the place for 6 years now and been doing stuff like this for at least 4 of those years. Granted when he is there he bust ass and out works most everyone else. He does not sit and talk or goof off. he is there for 8 and works all 8.



A) I say that he is pushing it. Eventually the place is going to get tired of it and fire him. Which he can't afford since he has a few kids.

B) he says eh is not doing anything wrong. The sick time is there to be used. they won't do anything to him for it. As for the short term disability well he says he is hurt (i have seen him bowling when he is "hurt") so thats what it is for. He says they won't fire him since he is using things they offer!


which one of us is right (yeah i know my grammar.spelling is not right)? yeah i know i should keep my nose out of it. just a really good friend who has kids

 

[mundane]

There's really no question, his behavior is going to come back and bite him in the ass.

 

[lightpants]

Isn't short-term disability paid by their insurance company? If so, I would say that would be insurance fraud and not a good idea. Plus the company's insurance rate will go up.

 

[dullard]

As long as things stay as they are, then he is correct. He has been doing this for 4 years, and will likely do it for 4 more years.

However, he fails to see what he is missing. He'll probably never be promoted, he won't be liked at work, etc. And if the boss/manager position ever changes, he'll be out on the street instantly. So, long term, you are correct.

 

[mcvickj]

He will have all the time in the world after they kick his ass to the curb. I'm sure the company wouldn't have to look far to find a dozen people willing to show up on time for a 8hr / 5 day a week shift.

 

[krunchykrome]

If he has kids, he should be a lot less careless and more responsible with his job. Technically, he is doing things by the books, but that doesnt mean that Management doesnt recognize his behavior and patterns.

 

[MisterJackson]

Sounds like legally he's in the clear. Although if it's at will employment they can fire him.

Is what he's doing ethical, no.

Let's talk about you admiting you're there but actually doing no work yourself

 

[Skacer]

I've known guys who have survived for ages like this, as long as they don't fuck up. But yea, like Dullard said, these people usually aren't liked but they still recieve a paycheck at the end of the week.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: dullard
As long as things stay as they are, then he is correct. He has been doing this for 4 years, and will likely do it for 4 more years.

However, he fails to see what he is missing. He'll probably never be promoted, he won't be liked at work, etc. And if the boss/manager position ever changes, he'll be out on the street instantly. So, long term, you are correct.

right now all the managers love him. there are certian jobs (its a packing plant..kinda) that have expensive stuff that have to be packed in a certian way. Only 3 people besides managment (over all 3 shifts) are allowed to do it. he is one of them.

He does not make many mistakes. When he does he fix's it. If his machine is down he finds something else to do. when there he bust ass.

trouble is he just does not have a clue on how managment thinks. i have tried to talk to him (i was managment before i retired) but he does not belive me.


edit; oh yeah he is already as high as he can go promotion wise. to get any higher you need at least a AS degree and he just has a high school diploma.

 

[clamum]

I don't think he's really doing anything real bad (except saying he's hurt when he's not)... but I don't think that sort of behavior would look that good. Then again, he's been doing it for four years and hasn't been talked to about it? Guess his manager is pretty chill.

 

[dullard]

Originally posted by: waggy
right now all the managers love him.

edit; oh yeah he is already as high as he can go promotion wise. to get any higher you need at least a AS degree and he just has a high school diploma.

Then, he has made his bed, let him lay in it. He'll never go any higher, and as soon as the management team shifts, he'll be gone. But for now, he is correct. He can be doing that for years and have no problems.

 

[ViviTheMage]

goner in my eyes...assuming they catch him in the act.

 

[j00fek]

he will be let go shortly

 

[BoomerD]

Has he ever been written up? You say there's a policy/procedure for such things...

Yeah, what he does is possibly un-ethical, and certainly won't earn him brownie points for dedication, (like some people who accumulate thousands of hours of sick leave) but it sounds like he's a great worker (when he's there) and since management likes him...I'd say he's ok...at least until there's a management change or lay-offs.

 

[Aharami]

he's playing the game by the rules. Doesnt mean that he isnt risking termination though

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: BoomerD
Has he ever been written up? You say there's a policy/procedure for such things...

Yeah, what he does is possibly un-ethical, and certainly won't earn him brownie points for dedication, (like some people who accumulate thousands of hours of sick leave) but it sounds like he's a great worker (when he's there) and since management likes him...I'd say he's ok...at least until there's a management change or lay-offs.

never been written up from what i know of. but i can't say for 100% sure.

 

[pontifex]

i'd be inclined to say he would be goen soon, but since he's been doing it for 4 years without any kind of warning, then he'll probably be fine.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Only the 'getting hurt' thing is questionable. Otherwise he's totally right. Americans idea of 'work ethic' is generally pretty screwed up. I have much more of a European view. Work is the least important thing you will ever do, so don't let it interfere with the things that matter. When you work you should do your absolute best, but there's no reason to make it such an important part of your life.

 

[Modular]

12-0 Ouch!

The truth is that he isn't making good long-term decisions. What it comes down to is that even though he is a valuable employee (when he's there) at some point corporate will notice the pattern, or as others have mentioned, management will change and they will enact new rules, regulations, etc. When that happens it's hard to say whether or not he will be fired. It's more likely that he will receive some disciplinary action.

 

[CPA]

Originally posted by: lightpants
Isn't short-term disability paid by their insurance company? If so, I would say that would be insurance fraud and not a good idea. Plus the company's insurance rate will go up.

Not all. If a company is "self-insured" the company will pay it.

 

[nageov3t]

there's no way I'd put up with it if I were his manager, but if it's working for him right now, I guess there's no reason to stop doing it. he just better hope that his manager never gets fired.

 

[Mxylplyx]

The big question is....

IS HE UNION??

You work at a packing plant, so I'm going to assume he is. While I wouldnt pull such a thing in an office environment, it sounds like he knows what he can get away with, and is doing it. They wouldnt dare fire his ass for playing by the books if he is union. I dont much care for the whole union thing, but if I were in his shoes, promoted as high as I can go and protected by the union, I'd probably be doing the exact same thing.

If he isnt union, disregard everything I just said, but it looks like he knows the ropes around there, is well liked by those that count, so he is working to live, and not living to work.

 

[bluxa]

The fact is that he is probably right. If the management consider him valuable (which from sound of it they do) and he works hard then they will turn a blind eye as long as he doesn't break any serious rules. If they like him then its likely that they will warn him if they think he is going too far. The fact is that many people do such things at work and get away with it who dont 'work their asses off'. An employer would take into consideration how long and how much it would take to recruit and train someone to do what he does and even then there is no guarantee the person will work as hard. As long as he keeps things minor and works hard he should be fine. The only problem would be if he did something that forced the management to act or he got caught up in some office politics.

 

[BoomerD]

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: lightpants
Isn't short-term disability paid by their insurance company? If so, I would say that would be insurance fraud and not a good idea. Plus the company's insurance rate will go up.

Not all. If a company is "self-insured" the company will pay it.

As long as he gets doctor's notes for his "injuries", there's not much they can do about those either, except perhaps send him to a "company doctor" for confirmation of the injuries...Are these injuries work-related or happen on personal time?
If they're work related, then workmans comp should be involved, whether he wants it or not. Protects both the worker and the company.

 

[jandrews]

wow, not only does that show a complete lack of integrity and character it must really make his coworkers angry I would be so furious. Also I am a manager at an IT firm and if someone here was doing that I dont care how good they were they would be fired as soon as I trained in a decent replacement.

Plus he has a few kids, what is he teaching them? Manipulation, theft, absolutely no integrity? What a joke.