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admiral fallon - he's my kind of guy

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Originally posted by: Pabster
Originally posted by: yllus
I think it's a little despicable that people would trash General Petraeus and give Admiral Fallon a thumbs up pretty much solely on the basis of their agreement with the latter and disagreement with the former. I guess maintaining respect for one's political/ideological opponents in spite of conflicting opinions is a little beneath most people nowadays.

Typical for the lefties around here.
Except it's false. As I pointed out above: "Reading back through the thread, it's also interesting to note I see only one person attacking Petraeus (before my first comment), and he is merely repeating Fallon's comment. In short, while the Bush drones immediately jumped on this to trash Fallon, the comments of the anti-Bush camp were considerably more temperate and less partisan."
 
Originally posted by: yllus
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: yllus
I think it's a little despicable that people would trash General Petraeus and give Admiral Fallon a thumbs up pretty much solely on the basis of their agreement with the latter and disagreement with the former. I guess maintaining respect for one's political/ideological opponents in spite of conflicting opinions is a little beneath most people nowadays.
And vise-versa. It seems to me your partisanship is showing since you failed to note the Bush faithful are equally engaged in trashing Fallon.

What partisanship? I don't really care who wins your kindergarten squabble; it's not my countrymen in Iraq.
You seem to care enough to attack people who "trash General Petraeus and give Admiral Fallon a thumbs up".


I didn't see anyone trashing Admiral Fallon, but to make you happy I will add "and vice versa" to my post.
Fern, TLC, and nick1985 to start, at least based on the creative standard you seem to apply when declaring people (plural) were trashing Petraeus. But you're not partisan, of course.
 
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Hard to believe Bush didn't listen to a Navy admiral about what we should do with ground troops in Iraq. I mean, that doesn't make a bit of sense. No doubt Fallon constantly takes advice from Army Generals concerning how to manage his Navy.

Well obviously if he is CENTCOM then his opinion on military matters, a large majority of which are land based is considered important. And I'm sure Fallon does take orders from his superiors on how to distribute his forces. Duh?
No doubt his opinion matters, and that's some of the root of the problem. His opinion was rejected for that of another and his ego was bruised. Since you've been in the military maybe you've been in a room full of brass muckamucks, maybe not? I have. The ego atmosphere is so thick that Steve Jobs couldn't even manage a breath.

That's not to mention that Fallon didn't become CENTCOM chief until March of this year, AFTER the surge strategy had already been laid out and implemented. So he was a little late to the party and his complaining at this point seems to be sour grapes because the focus is on Petraeus instead of himself.
 
Originally posted by: Genx87
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: yllus
I think it's a little despicable that people would trash General Petraeus and give Admiral Fallon a thumbs up pretty much solely on the basis of their agreement with the latter and disagreement with the former. I guess maintaining respect for one's political/ideological opponents in spite of conflicting opinions is a little beneath most people nowadays.
And vise-versa. It seems to me your partisanship is showing since you failed to note the Bush faithful are equally engaged in trashing Fallon.
What are we in 3rd grade?
I have no idea what grade you're in. What's your point? I wanted to call attention to a common tactic here, preemptively attacking the (nominal) left for allegedly doing what the traditional Bush supporters are actually doing. Such partisan misdirection tends to quickly derail threads, which, in my opinion, is the reason it is used.


Anyways lets not forget the point of this thread.
Cool. Do you have anything to contribute besides "/thread" (to the same comment above -- hypocrite, much?) and attacking me? What are your thoughts on Fallon calling Petraeus "an ass-kissing little chickenshit" and what evidence can you provide to show he is wrong? What objective, substantive evidence can you offer us to demonstrate Fallon's assessment of Iraq is somehow inferior to Petraeus'? Anything else you can contribute that is meaningful and on-topic?
 
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Fern, TLC, and nick1985 to start, at least based on the creative standard you seem to apply when declaring people (plural) were trashing Petraeus. But you're not partisan, of course.
Please show me where I trashed Amd. Fallon.

I did nothing of the sort. No doubt he's a brilliant man in his own field. I just don't think ground troops and counter-insurgency tactics are his strong point. Those are Petraeus's strong point.
 
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Fern, TLC, and nick1985 to start, at least based on the creative standard you seem to apply when declaring people (plural) were trashing Petraeus. But you're not partisan, of course.
Please show me where I trashed Amd. Fallon.

I did nothing of the sort. No doubt he's a brilliant man in his own field. I just don't think ground troops and counter-insurgency tactics are his strong point.
Read all the words. I don't see the Petraeus-trashing Sully was complaining about either.


Those are Petraeus's strong point.
Still waiting for your evidence supporting this. It may be true, but I don't see it in his resume.
 
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Fern, TLC, and nick1985 to start, at least based on the creative standard you seem to apply when declaring people (plural) were trashing Petraeus. But you're not partisan, of course.
Please show me where I trashed Amd. Fallon.

I did nothing of the sort. No doubt he's a brilliant man in his own field. I just don't think ground troops and counter-insurgency tactics are his strong point.
Read all the words. I don't see the Petraeus-trashing Sully was complaining about either.


Those are Petraeus's strong point.
Still waiting for your evidence supporting this. It may be true, but I don't see it in his resume.
His resume? You claimed he was essentially a desk jockey, a lackey until I showed you otherwise. One would have thought you'd have done some further research after being taught the first lesson. I have to wonder if you've even glanced at his resume?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/...3/AR2007022301741.html

He Wrote the Book. Can He Follow It?

By Sarah Sewall
Sunday, February 25, 2007; Page B03

If anyone can save Iraq, it's David H. Petraeus, the ultimate can-do general. Installed in Baghdad earlier this month, he's bringing in his A-team and rolling up his sleeves. The question for the history books is before us: Will he be an alchemist, fusing existing elements of a moribund strategy with his knowledge and willpower to erase the United States' biggest mistake since the Vietnam War? Or does success in Iraq require more than is humanly possible?

Many of Petraeus's strongest supporters fear that his new assignment is a no-win mission, one that could not only stain his professional reputation but also, ironically, discredit the new counterinsurgency doctrine he spent the past year creating.

Petraeus is almost unique among senior Army leaders in fully embracing both the theory and practice of counterinsurgency. During two previous tours in Iraq, he provided relative security and fostered economic and political reform in Mosul and Nineveh province and later overhauled the coalition's training of Iraqi forces. He incorporated lessons from these experiences directly into FM 3-24, the revised counterinsurgency field manual whose preparation he oversaw. The new manual challenges the Army to think differently about how it conducts war.

That's why, as director of a human rights center, I supported his efforts by cosponsoring the doctrine revision seminar and helping shape the field manual. It features such counterintuitive paradoxes as "Sometimes, the more you protect your force, the less secure you may be," and "Some of the best weapons do not shoot."

...
 
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: BarneyFife
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Hard to believe Bush didn't listen to a Navy admiral about what we should do with ground troops in Iraq. I mean, that doesn't make a bit of sense. No doubt Fallon constantly takes advice from Army Generals concerning how to manage his Navy.

LMAO!! Only a moron couldn't tell that betray us was an ass kisser.

Did you write the moveon.com add? 😕


Also, could you please explain how a Navy Admiral has the grounds to bash an Army 4 star general on his ground campaign plan? Isnt that kind of like a baseball player criticizing how a football team operates?
It's not just the fact the Petraeus is a well-respected Army general (except, apparently, by at least one Adm.), it's that he wrote the handbook for counter-insurgency. Petraeus got his position in Iraq because of his qualifications, not because of his rank or who he knows. For once Bush finally did the right thing and assigned someone based on their qualifications instead of their connections, and people STILL bitch like little girls. Go figure.

Your posts are so full of bullshit that i rarely read them, but this one so clearly puts you in the bush faithful camp that its laughable that you try to deny it. Petraeus parroted the same shit DumbYa has been saying for a *long* time. Its blindingly clear that Patreaus lacks any sense of independence from this administration.
 
Originally posted by: homercles337
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: BarneyFife
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Hard to believe Bush didn't listen to a Navy admiral about what we should do with ground troops in Iraq. I mean, that doesn't make a bit of sense. No doubt Fallon constantly takes advice from Army Generals concerning how to manage his Navy.

LMAO!! Only a moron couldn't tell that betray us was an ass kisser.

Did you write the moveon.com add? 😕


Also, could you please explain how a Navy Admiral has the grounds to bash an Army 4 star general on his ground campaign plan? Isnt that kind of like a baseball player criticizing how a football team operates?
It's not just the fact the Petraeus is a well-respected Army general (except, apparently, by at least one Adm.), it's that he wrote the handbook for counter-insurgency. Petraeus got his position in Iraq because of his qualifications, not because of his rank or who he knows. For once Bush finally did the right thing and assigned someone based on their qualifications instead of their connections, and people STILL bitch like little girls. Go figure.

Your posts are so full of bullshit that i rarely read them, but this one so clearly puts you in the bush faithful camp that its laughable that you try to deny it. Petraeus parroted the same shit DumbYa has been saying for a *long* time. Its blindingly clear that Patreaus lacks any sense of independence from this administration.
You pressed the "Reply to Topic" button just a bit too soon.

See my post above.

Now don't you feel like a complete ass?
 
Excellent post! I'm with Fallon on this one, though I thought Petraeus was a fairly straight shooter who simply put the best cast on a very difficult argument before Congress.

-Robert
 
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Hard to believe Bush didn't listen to a Navy admiral about what we should do with ground troops in Iraq. I mean, that doesn't make a bit of sense. No doubt Fallon constantly takes advice from Army Generals concerning how to manage his Navy.

Well obviously if he is CENTCOM then his opinion on military matters, a large majority of which are land based is considered important. And I'm sure Fallon does take orders from his superiors on how to distribute his forces. Duh?
No doubt his opinion matters, and that's some of the root of the problem. His opinion was rejected for that of another and his ego was bruised. Since you've been in the military maybe you've been in a room full of brass muckamucks, maybe not? I have. The ego atmosphere is so thick that Steve Jobs couldn't even manage a breath.

That's not to mention that Fallon didn't become CENTCOM chief until March of this year, AFTER the surge strategy had already been laid out and implemented. So he was a little late to the party and his complaining at this point seems to be sour grapes because the focus is on Petraeus instead of himself.

Well, in all fairness it looks like Fallon was right. The surge (by all estimates, including Patraeus) has failed. It achieved military objectives which everyone already agreed were meaningless.

Insofar as ego buising goes, its certainly possible. What's also possible is that Patraeus really is just a brown nosing little $hit as Fallon says. Obviously none of us have any idea, but don't tell me that you didn't know plenty of people in the military who did well because they were adept at telling the boss what he wanted to hear. It seems that Fallon believes Patraeus to be one of these.
 
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Hard to believe Bush didn't listen to a Navy admiral about what we should do with ground troops in Iraq. I mean, that doesn't make a bit of sense. No doubt Fallon constantly takes advice from Army Generals concerning how to manage his Navy.

Well obviously if he is CENTCOM then his opinion on military matters, a large majority of which are land based is considered important. And I'm sure Fallon does take orders from his superiors on how to distribute his forces. Duh?
No doubt his opinion matters, and that's some of the root of the problem. His opinion was rejected for that of another and his ego was bruised. Since you've been in the military maybe you've been in a room full of brass muckamucks, maybe not? I have. The ego atmosphere is so thick that Steve Jobs couldn't even manage a breath.

That's not to mention that Fallon didn't become CENTCOM chief until March of this year, AFTER the surge strategy had already been laid out and implemented. So he was a little late to the party and his complaining at this point seems to be sour grapes because the focus is on Petraeus instead of himself.

Well, in all fairness it looks like Fallon was right. The surge (by all estimates, including Patraeus) has failed. It achieved military objectives which everyone already agreed were meaningless.

Insofar as ego buising goes, its certainly possible. What's also possible is that Patraeus really is just a brown nosing little $hit as Fallon says. Obviously none of us have any idea, but don't tell me that you didn't know plenty of people in the military who did well because they were adept at telling the boss what he wanted to hear. It seems that Fallon believes Patraeus to be one of these.
Suddenly miltary/security objectives in Iraq are meaningless. It's no longer important whether Iraqis are more secure, it's what the politicians are doing.

So what is the focus going to be shifted to if the politicians end up coming to an agreement? Do you have an exit strategy?
 
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: homercles337
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: BarneyFife
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Hard to believe Bush didn't listen to a Navy admiral about what we should do with ground troops in Iraq. I mean, that doesn't make a bit of sense. No doubt Fallon constantly takes advice from Army Generals concerning how to manage his Navy.

LMAO!! Only a moron couldn't tell that betray us was an ass kisser.

Did you write the moveon.com add? 😕


Also, could you please explain how a Navy Admiral has the grounds to bash an Army 4 star general on his ground campaign plan? Isnt that kind of like a baseball player criticizing how a football team operates?
It's not just the fact the Petraeus is a well-respected Army general (except, apparently, by at least one Adm.), it's that he wrote the handbook for counter-insurgency. Petraeus got his position in Iraq because of his qualifications, not because of his rank or who he knows. For once Bush finally did the right thing and assigned someone based on their qualifications instead of their connections, and people STILL bitch like little girls. Go figure.

Your posts are so full of bullshit that i rarely read them, but this one so clearly puts you in the bush faithful camp that its laughable that you try to deny it. Petraeus parroted the same shit DumbYa has been saying for a *long* time. Its blindingly clear that Patreaus lacks any sense of independence from this administration.
You pressed the "Reply to Topic" button just a bit too soon.

See my post above.

Now don't you feel like a complete ass?

Nope. Youre still a blind partisan parroting the current right-(non)think/talking points. You can try to deny it, but your posts make your perspective clear as an azure blue sky. Question, how many hours a day to spend listening to right-wing pundits? Your finger seems to be placed squarely on the pulse of the spin doctoring right.
 
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: yllus
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: yllus
I think it's a little despicable that people would trash General Petraeus and give Admiral Fallon a thumbs up pretty much solely on the basis of their agreement with the latter and disagreement with the former. I guess maintaining respect for one's political/ideological opponents in spite of conflicting opinions is a little beneath most people nowadays.
And vise-versa. It seems to me your partisanship is showing since you failed to note the Bush faithful are equally engaged in trashing Fallon.

What partisanship? I don't really care who wins your kindergarten squabble; it's not my countrymen in Iraq.
You seem to care enough to attack people who "trash General Petraeus and give Admiral Fallon a thumbs up".


I didn't see anyone trashing Admiral Fallon, but to make you happy I will add "and vice versa" to my post.
Fern, TLC, and nick1985 to start, at least based on the creative standard you seem to apply when declaring people (plural) were trashing Petraeus. But you're not partisan, of course.

You call my opinion on trashing a career military man and four-star general on the basis of disagreeing with what he says partisan? I'd say the exact same thing if the general was advocating leaving Iraq immediately. In fact, I've done as much circa 2000 when I was telling conservatives to cool it with the ridiculous things they came up with against the Clinton administration. CADsortaGUY, Red Dawn and others should remember that well.

It's stuff like this which solidifies in my head that thought that the lot of you deserve the bunch of politicians you end up with. You're so willing to engage in self-deception and hackery that it's only natural you end up ruled by the same.
 
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Fern, TLC, and nick1985 to start, at least based on the creative standard you seem to apply when declaring people (plural) were trashing Petraeus. But you're not partisan, of course.
Please show me where I trashed Amd. Fallon.

I did nothing of the sort. No doubt he's a brilliant man in his own field. I just don't think ground troops and counter-insurgency tactics are his strong point. Those are Petraeus's strong point.

Are attempting to imply that this has some kind of bearing on the words of Fallon? I don't think it does.
 
Wow. Let's be honest here folks, Petreaus does look like the typical chickenshit sycophant. The man looks like a dimunitive (sic?) hunchback in search of his mother's tits. What I've wondered about him is why he chose to be the spokesperson for the Bush Administration in the first place. Generals shouldn't be doing that.
 
Originally posted by: homercles337
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: homercles337
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: BarneyFife
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Hard to believe Bush didn't listen to a Navy admiral about what we should do with ground troops in Iraq. I mean, that doesn't make a bit of sense. No doubt Fallon constantly takes advice from Army Generals concerning how to manage his Navy.

LMAO!! Only a moron couldn't tell that betray us was an ass kisser.

Did you write the moveon.com add? 😕


Also, could you please explain how a Navy Admiral has the grounds to bash an Army 4 star general on his ground campaign plan? Isnt that kind of like a baseball player criticizing how a football team operates?
It's not just the fact the Petraeus is a well-respected Army general (except, apparently, by at least one Adm.), it's that he wrote the handbook for counter-insurgency. Petraeus got his position in Iraq because of his qualifications, not because of his rank or who he knows. For once Bush finally did the right thing and assigned someone based on their qualifications instead of their connections, and people STILL bitch like little girls. Go figure.

Your posts are so full of bullshit that i rarely read them, but this one so clearly puts you in the bush faithful camp that its laughable that you try to deny it. Petraeus parroted the same shit DumbYa has been saying for a *long* time. Its blindingly clear that Patreaus lacks any sense of independence from this administration.
You pressed the "Reply to Topic" button just a bit too soon.

See my post above.

Now don't you feel like a complete ass?

Nope. Youre still a blind partisan parroting the current right-(non)think/talking points. You can try to deny it, but your posts make your perspective clear as an azure blue sky. Question, how many hours a day to spend listening to right-wing pundits? Your finger seems to be placed squarely on the pulse of the spin doctoring right.
All it makes clear is that you made a very poor accusation and stepped on your pud in the process. I provided the backup for my claim. You provided nothing but lame, and ultimately baseless, accusations that are plainly rebutted by that bastion of right-wing talking points, the Washington Post.
 
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Fern, TLC, and nick1985 to start, at least based on the creative standard you seem to apply when declaring people (plural) were trashing Petraeus. But you're not partisan, of course.
Please show me where I trashed Amd. Fallon.

I did nothing of the sort. No doubt he's a brilliant man in his own field. I just don't think ground troops and counter-insurgency tactics are his strong point.
Read all the words. I don't see the Petraeus-trashing Sully was complaining about either.
Note that you didn't address this.


Those are Petraeus's strong point.
Still waiting for your evidence supporting this. It may be true, but I don't see it in his resume.
His resume? You claimed he was essentially a desk jockey, a lackey until I showed you otherwise.
There you go again. What I actually said was, "based on this article, Petraeus' expertise seems to lie more in the realm of filing paperwork, writing reports, and polishing Brass than in directing combat missions." Given that the "combat" portion of his career started only four years ago, my comment appears to be accurate. Fallon, in contrast, has substantially more experience in combat assignments.


One would have thought you'd have done some further research after being taught the first lesson. I have to wonder if you've even glanced at his resume?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/...3/AR2007022301741.html

He Wrote the Book. Can He Follow It?

By Sarah Sewall
Sunday, February 25, 2007; Page B03
[ ... ]
Petraeus is almost unique among senior Army leaders in fully embracing both the theory and practice of counterinsurgency. During two previous tours in Iraq, he provided relative security and fostered economic and political reform in Mosul and Nineveh province and later overhauled the coalition's training of Iraqi forces. He incorporated lessons from these experiences directly into FM 3-24, the revised counterinsurgency field manual whose preparation he oversaw. The new manual challenges the Army to think differently about how it conducts war.
[ ... ]
That he wrote a book only shows he can write. We can all point to plenty of examples of writers who are blithering idiots. Sewall's opinions are interesting, but they are only opinions. She may be right; she may have been engaged in wishful thinking. Either way, her opinion is no substitute for solid credentials. The fact remains, Petraeus got his first combat assignment only four years ago. The fact also remains that outside of the Bush administration and its supporters, his assignment to train Iraqi forces is considered a failure. I am still waiting for you to show objective evidence to support your claim "ground troops and counter-insurgency tactics are his strong point," especially in comparison to Fallon who has substantially greater experience in combat assignments. You keep repeating the claim, but your "evidence" is an op-ed by someone who happens to agree with you. (A bit of a double standard on standards for evidence, by the way, given your comments in threads about BushCo lies.) Anyway, give us something of substance or acknowledge that your support of Petraeus over Fallon is based on partisanship, nothing more.
 
Originally posted by: Dari
Wow. Let's be honest here folks, Petreaus does look like the typical chickenshit sycophant. The man looks like a dimunitive (sic?) hunchback in search of his mother's tits. What I've wondered about him is why he chose to be the spokesperson for the Bush Administration in the first place. Generals shouldn't be doing that.
If you are doing drugs, you should stop immediately.

If you are not doing drugs, you should start immediately.
 
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Dari
Wow. Let's be honest here folks, Petreaus does look like the typical chickenshit sycophant. The man looks like a dimunitive (sic?) hunchback in search of his mother's tits. What I've wondered about him is why he chose to be the spokesperson for the Bush Administration in the first place. Generals shouldn't be doing that.
If you are doing drugs, you should stop immediately.

If you are not doing drugs, you should start immediately.

You need to take your own advice. That General looks small and eager. He looks like a brown-noser. And, like I said before, his ass shouldn't be in the business of playing politics while he's in the uniform.
 
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
All it makes clear is that you made a very poor accusation and stepped on your pud in the process. I provided the backup for my claim. You provided nothing but lame, and ultimately baseless, accusations that are plainly rebutted by that bastion of right-wing talking points, the Washington Post.

Again more dodge/weave by the bush faithful. My comment stands on its own merits, does yours? Let me answer for you. Nope.
 
Originally posted by: yllus
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: yllus
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: yllus
I think it's a little despicable that people would trash General Petraeus and give Admiral Fallon a thumbs up pretty much solely on the basis of their agreement with the latter and disagreement with the former. I guess maintaining respect for one's political/ideological opponents in spite of conflicting opinions is a little beneath most people nowadays.
And vise-versa. It seems to me your partisanship is showing since you failed to note the Bush faithful are equally engaged in trashing Fallon.

What partisanship? I don't really care who wins your kindergarten squabble; it's not my countrymen in Iraq.
You seem to care enough to attack people who "trash General Petraeus and give Admiral Fallon a thumbs up".


I didn't see anyone trashing Admiral Fallon, but to make you happy I will add "and vice versa" to my post.
Fern, TLC, and nick1985 to start, at least based on the creative standard you seem to apply when declaring people (plural) were trashing Petraeus. But you're not partisan, of course.
You call my opinion on trashing a career military man and four-star general on the basis of disagreeing with what he says partisan?
No, try reading what I actually wrote. I said your calling out the alleged Petraeus-trashers while ignoring the very real Fallon-bashers is partisan.


[ ... ]
It's stuff like this which solidifies in my head that thought that the lot of you deserve the bunch of politicians you end up with. You're so willing to engage in self-deception and hackery that it's only natural you end up ruled by the same.
All I can tell you is that from my perspective, you are the one mired in self-deception. You somehow miss the comments criticizing Fallon while imagining "people" trashing Petraeus. Personally, I think both parties suck. At the moment, the Democrats simply suck less than the Bush Republicans. Re. this article, it appears to me Fallon has better military credentials than Petraeus, and I think there is plenty of objective evidence Fallon is correct with respect to the "surge" strategy. That doesn't mean Petraeus is a bad general or a hack. He may well have sincerely believed the "surge" strategy was the right one. On the other hand, it would not be the first time someone convinced himself a bad plan was suddenly a good plan if it advanced his career.
 
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Bowfinger
Fern, TLC, and nick1985 to start, at least based on the creative standard you seem to apply when declaring people (plural) were trashing Petraeus. But you're not partisan, of course.
Please show me where I trashed Amd. Fallon.

I did nothing of the sort. No doubt he's a brilliant man in his own field. I just don't think ground troops and counter-insurgency tactics are his strong point.
Read all the words. I don't see the Petraeus-trashing Sully was complaining about either.
Note that you didn't address this.


Those are Petraeus's strong point.
Still waiting for your evidence supporting this. It may be true, but I don't see it in his resume.
His resume? You claimed he was essentially a desk jockey, a lackey until I showed you otherwise.
There you go again. What I actually said was, "based on this article, Petraeus' expertise seems to lie more in the realm of filing paperwork, writing reports, and polishing Brass than in directing combat missions." Given that the "combat" portion of his career started only four years ago, my comment appears to be accurate. Fallon, in contrast, has substantially more experience in combat assignments.
In that case, maybe you shouldn't base your opinion on a single article simply because it tells you what you want to hear? You wouldn't have to make extremely poor assumptions in that case.

One would have thought you'd have done some further research after being taught the first lesson. I have to wonder if you've even glanced at his resume?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/...3/AR2007022301741.html

He Wrote the Book. Can He Follow It?

By Sarah Sewall
Sunday, February 25, 2007; Page B03
[ ... ]
Petraeus is almost unique among senior Army leaders in fully embracing both the theory and practice of counterinsurgency. During two previous tours in Iraq, he provided relative security and fostered economic and political reform in Mosul and Nineveh province and later overhauled the coalition's training of Iraqi forces. He incorporated lessons from these experiences directly into FM 3-24, the revised counterinsurgency field manual whose preparation he oversaw. The new manual challenges the Army to think differently about how it conducts war.
[ ... ]
That he wrote a book only shows he can write. We can all point to plenty of examples of writers who are blithering idiots.
fwiw, I think you can write fairly well.

Sewall's opinions are interesting, but they are only opinions. She may be right; she may have been engaged in wishful thinking. Either way, her opinion is no substitute for solid credentials. The fact remains, Petraeus got his first combat assignment only four years ago. The fact also remains that outside of the Bush administration and its supporters, his assignment to train Iraqi forces is considered a failure. I am still waiting for you to show objective evidence to support your claim "ground troops and counter-insurgency tactics are his strong point," especially in comparison to Fallon who has substantially greater experience in combat assignments. You keep repeating the claim, but your "evidence" is an op-ed by someone who happens to agree with you. (A bit of a double standard on standards for evidence, by the way, given your comments in threads about BushCo lies.) Anyway, give us something of substance or acknowledge that your support of Petraeus over Fallon is based on partisanship, nothing more.
My support of Patraeus is because he's qualified for the job, as I've already shown.

Please demonstrate your dismissal of Petraeus is based on anything other than partisanship, not to mention your seemingly complete ignorance of the man since I've had to take you to school on him twice in this thread already.
 
Originally posted by: homercles337
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
All it makes clear is that you made a very poor accusation and stepped on your pud in the process. I provided the backup for my claim. You provided nothing but lame, and ultimately baseless, accusations that are plainly rebutted by that bastion of right-wing talking points, the Washington Post.
Again more dodge/weave by the bush faithful. My comment stands on its own merits, does yours? Let me answer for you. Nope.
ROFL. I especially like his double standard on evidence, where he blithely dismisses the mountains of evidence the Bush admin lied, yet considers a single op-ed proof his partisan faith in Petraeus is justified.
 
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