Acts of senseless violence

[BullsOnParade]

So this Monday's story is:

Her: this guy was driving his horse drawn buggy down the road and some person passed him in a car and threw something at him
Her: it hit his head
Her: they think it was a tire iron or an axe
Me: jesus christ
Me: i'm guessing he didn't get the lisence plate
Her: his head was split open and his entire right ocular cavity was destroyed
Her: his eye was split down the center
Me: man that's just sad
Her: yeah
Me: thats apalling
Her: he seemed like a really nice, hard working guy
Her: i'd say the split that was above his eye was about 2 inches across
Her: i know
Her: everyone was like that

i dunno makes me sick to my stomach.
and then this...

Her: i think he might be amish
Her: cuz his whole family drives buggies
Her: cuz they were wondering how the people were going to get to the hospital
Her: all his relatives

Piecing it together afterward they think a driver behind the buggy got mad, passed the buggy
and threw something at the buggy driver. The object was pretty sharp as the injury was a clean
deep cut from the center bottom of the right eye 2 inches up to the skull. The guys skull was cracked/split above his eye. He seemed okay mentally etc... aside from the injury.

 

[Chronoshock]

Wow that's horrible...

 

[trilks]

:| Man, that's friggin low...

 

[BullsOnParade]

i know right, i mean if she'd have told me he got shot or something it'd be different, but
the guy just had his face mangled just randomly.

 

[BullsOnParade]

Aw man even worse:
Her: i think he might be amish
Her: cuz his whole family drives buggies
Her: cuz they were wondering how the people were going to get to the hospital
Her: all his relatives

 

[acemcmac]

I'm going to baltimore this weekend...

thanks for giving me something *else* to think about... thats horrible

 

[Zanix]

Seriously speaking, could this be a hate crime?

 

[Mo0o]

Give em the chair.

 

[Yo Ma Ma]

That's sick, and very sad. There are a lot of Amish around here. It's dangerous enough on the roads full of fast cars, let alone some piece of trash hurting them on purpose.

As for getting to the hospital, they have (non-Amish) drivers, and that is probably how they will get there.

 

[bradruth]

Originally posted by: Zanix
Seriously speaking, could this be a hate crime?

Any crime of violence is a "hate crime" in my opinion. I say up the penalties for all violent crime and don't make race, color, creed, etc. an issue.

 

[BullsOnParade]

well committing violence against the guy who's cheating with your wife is sort of a motivated crime.
Targeting some specific group 'senselessly' (of course this is some what handwaving) and committing
violence against them is different. I think that's where a hate crime differentiates itself, for example in this
case if the guy weren't amish would he have gotten something thrown at him ?

 

[bradruth]

Originally posted by: BullsOnParade
well committing violence against the guy who's cheating with your wife is sort of a motivated crime.
Targeting some specific group 'senselessly' (of course this is some what handwaving) and committing
violence against them is different. I think that's where a hate crime differentiates itself, for example in this
case if the guy weren't amish would he have gotten something thrown at him ?

But why are you committing violence against the guy who's cheating with your wife? Is it just because of the act itself, or because you hate the person because of what they've done? Specifying hate crimes based on traits is just bringing into the forefront the differences in people and again making them a central issue. This is my main opposition to affirmative action, as well. Rather than treating everyone equally, you're bringing attention to minorities and just reversing the discrimination.

 

[Gooberlx2]

I hope karma does its deed.

 

[Gooberlx2]

Originally posted by: bradruth

Originally posted by: BullsOnParade
well committing violence against the guy who's cheating with your wife is sort of a motivated crime.
Targeting some specific group 'senselessly' (of course this is some what handwaving) and committing
violence against them is different. I think that's where a hate crime differentiates itself, for example in this
case if the guy weren't amish would he have gotten something thrown at him ?

But why are you committing violence against the guy who's cheating with your wife? Is it just because of the act itself, or because you hate the person because of what they've done? Specifying hate crimes based on traits is just bringing into the forefront the differences in people and again making them a central issue. This is my main opposition to affirmative action, as well. Rather than treating everyone equally, you're bringing attention to minorities and just reversing the discrimination.

I agree with you on affirmative action....I don't think it works.

But I agree with BullsOnParade with his view of violent crime vs hate crime.

I think of it as obvious and unprovoked hate. A black man simply walking down the street who gets bashed in the head by a skinhead driving by....I would call that a hate crime. The motivations are obvious and unprovoked.

A black man who gets bashed in the head because he had just insulted another man is different. In this case it's provoked. The man "hates" the black man because of what the black man did or said. In the other case, the black man didn't do or say anything....and so deserved no hate. Of course, it doesn't make it right......but it's a totally different thing from a hate crime, imo.

 

[BullsOnParade]

Perhaps in some cases this preferential bias gets abused, however I do think there is some pathos
inherent in hate crimes that justify stiffer sentences. They go beyond unthinking unfeeling violence to
a level of self maintained ignorance and intolerance that deserves punishment in addition to the act of
violence. Its almost a punative punishment for being an evil person, its to show that that type of thinking
along with the violence is unacceptable.

When the argument turns into affirmative action I'm lost as to what motivations the two share or if they have
anything much to do with each other. For example lets say a gay man is robbed at gun point and killed, versus
a gay man is dragged from a bar beaten and tied to a fence to die.

The second instance is a hate crime and the first may be proven so even though it doesn't appear so.

 

[jtusa]

Originally posted by: bradruth

Originally posted by: Zanix
Seriously speaking, could this be a hate crime?

Any crime of violence is a "hate crime" in my opinion. I say up the penalties for all violent crime and don't make race, color, creed, etc. an issue.

Yeah, South Park even did an episode on it.

 

[PCTweaker5]

Lotta those amish types around here in VA,DC,MD but thats so fuggin sad that someone would do that shit. The guy who did this will get what he deserves!!!

 

[T2T III]

Originally posted by: Gooberlx2
I hope karma does its deed.

Me too. Hopefully, it's soon, too.

 

[MaxDSP]

That's terrible

 

[bradruth]

Originally posted by: jtusa4

Originally posted by: bradruth

Originally posted by: Zanix
Seriously speaking, could this be a hate crime?

Any crime of violence is a "hate crime" in my opinion. I say up the penalties for all violent crime and don't make race, color, creed, etc. an issue.

Yeah, South Park even did an episode on it.

Romper Stomper!

 

[acemcmac]

Originally posted by: PCTweaker5
Lotta those amish types around here in VA,DC,MD but thats so fuggin sad that someone would do that shit. The guy who did this will get what he deserves!!!

PA too...

 

[PCTweaker5]

Yeah theres a name for them. I think it starts with an M or something.

 

[Kaervak]

Humanity needs to self-destruct faster.

 

[PCTweaker5]

Originally posted by: Kaervak
Humanity needs to self-destruct faster.

Dont worry, give it about 5-7 years.

 

[VTBigBear]

alright baltimore....

uhg.. i hate going there... except the inner harbor.. i like the inner harbor