Accord and Camry SUCK--No ABS standard??!?

[chrisjor]

cjchaps,

dead on, if you hit a pot hole or bump as you stop at an intersection (wet or dry) you just keep moving!!!

 

[Evadman]

I also have the ABS deactivated in my truck. ABS IMHO is for people who can not drive. I almost wrecked my mothers Astro Van because of the ABS.

 

[ThisIsMatt]

<< i like ABS. my high school car was 1993 special edition accord that did have ABS. i noticed when it kicked in on rainy days. when i got my college car, a 2000 accord LX, it did not have ABS. some models did have it but i bought the last one on the lot so i did not have the choice to choose one at the time. recently, i had to brake super hard for some a-holes that cut me off and i know my brakes locked because i can smell the burning rubber from the tires. this was in dry pavement so ABS wasnt really needed. however it rained a couple days ago and i found myself braking alot earlier than normal coz i know i dont have ABS, which leaves me with almost an uncertain feeling when driving in wet weather. i wouldnt stop as quick as in dry pavement and with the brakes and tires locking up, physics would kick in and it would take longer to stop as if ABS were present.

so basically, in dry weather, no-ABS gets you quicker stops (usually), and in wet weather, ABS gets you quicker stops. i'd personally rather have the wet weather comfort since i know southern cali ppl cant drive in wet weather. >>

Wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong. ABS does not stop you faster. ABS is only there to allow you to steer somewhat while braking (if you're skidding, you can't steer).

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

I can't see any legitimate basis for controversy about ABS, except in very poorly-implemented systems. I learned to drive in the winter in Minnesota without it, so I am more than competent to pump my brakes, and have never been in an accident. That said, ABS clearly seems to be an improvement, except on totally dry roads with perfect traction. The car stops much straighter and the ABS optimizes the amount of braking power per conditions on less-than-perfect roads. I have only had my ABS kick in on a handful of occasions, so for me it is not a must-have item, but I think it is clearly better than not having ABS, and on any modern car I feel it definitely improves the safety and security of the car.

 

[dionx]

<< Wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong. ABS does not stop you faster. ABS is only there to allow you to steer somewhat while braking (if you're skidding, you can't steer). >>



YES IT DOES. ask any physicist.

"Stopping a car with ordinary brakes may result in wheel lock; that is, the wheels lock in position and are not able to rotate. When this happens, the tires skid and the coefficient of kinetic friction determines the braking distance. "

"Cars equipped with an antilock braking system (ABS) have a sensor that releases the brake pads the instant the wheel locks up. After a brief pause the brakes are then quickly re-engaged. If they don't lock up again all is well. If they do, the ABS releases the brake pads again. This processes can repeat many times a second. In any case, the tires are not allowed to lock for more than a few milliseconds. The car is then stopped using the force of static friction alone."

basically static friction is easier to stop a car then kinetic friction.

 

[dionx]

<< ABS is only there to allow you to steer somewhat while braking (if you're skidding, you can't steer). >>



if you are skidding, you can steer and are suppossed to steer, especially if about to spin out. there are varying degrees on the ability to steer depending on the skid and speed.

for rear wheel drive cars, steer in the direction of the skid.
for front wheel drive cars, steer in the direction you want to head.

 

[ThisIsMatt]

<<

<< Wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong. ABS does not stop you faster. ABS is only there to allow you to steer somewhat while braking (if you're skidding, you can't steer). >>



YES IT DOES. ask any physicist.

"Stopping a car with ordinary brakes may result in wheel lock; that is, the wheels lock in position and are not able to rotate. When this happens, the tires skid and the coefficient of kinetic friction determines the braking distance. "

"Cars equipped with an antilock braking system (ABS) have a sensor that releases the brake pads the instant the wheel locks up. After a brief pause the brakes are then quickly re-engaged. If they don't lock up again all is well. If they do, the ABS releases the brake pads again. This processes can repeat many times a second. In any case, the tires are not allowed to lock for more than a few milliseconds. The car is then stopped using the force of static friction alone."

basically static friction is easier to stop a car then kinetic friction. >>

Talk to my last quarter university physics prof. I'll give you wet conditions, but not dry. Even what you just quoted doesn't make sense by your explanation. In that case, your brake rotors are slipping (hey, kinetic friction!) 🙂

Here's a mind bender - which stops you in a more straight path, locked up front wheels or locked up rear wheels?

 

[ThisIsMatt]

<<

<< ABS is only there to allow you to steer somewhat while braking (if you're skidding, you can't steer). >>



if you are skidding, you can steer and are suppossed to steer, especially if about to spin out. there are varying degrees on the ability to steer depending on the skid and speed.

for rear wheel drive cars, steer in the direction of the skid.
for front wheel drive cars, steer in the direction you want to head. >>

That doesn't work if your wheels are locked up, which is what we're talking about. That is if you have lost traction and are no longer slamming on the brakes, which means your wheels can turn.

 

[dionx]

<< Here's a mind bender - which stops you in a straighter path, locked up front wheels or locked up rear wheels? >>



well if i were on a bike, i wouldnt want locked up front wheels. that'll lead to a messed up stoppy, maybe injury too.

but in car, i think locked up rear wheels will stop yuo better. with the front wheels locked up, once again you are increasing kinetic friction for the front of the car, which is having all the momentum transferred to since you are decelerating

 

[ddjkdg]

<<

<<

<< Wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong. ABS does not stop you faster. ABS is only there to allow you to steer somewhat while braking (if you're skidding, you can't steer). >>



YES IT DOES. ask any physicist.

"Stopping a car with ordinary brakes may result in wheel lock; that is, the wheels lock in position and are not able to rotate. When this happens, the tires skid and the coefficient of kinetic friction determines the braking distance. "

"Cars equipped with an antilock braking system (ABS) have a sensor that releases the brake pads the instant the wheel locks up. After a brief pause the brakes are then quickly re-engaged. If they don't lock up again all is well. If they do, the ABS releases the brake pads again. This processes can repeat many times a second. In any case, the tires are not allowed to lock for more than a few milliseconds. The car is then stopped using the force of static friction alone."

basically static friction is easier to stop a car then kinetic friction. >>

Talk to my last quarter university physics prof. I'll give you wet conditions, but not dry. Even what you just quoted doesn't make sense by your explanation. In that case, your brake rotors are slipping (hey, kinetic friction!) 🙂

Here's a mind bender - which stops you in a more straight path, locked up front wheels or locked up rear wheels? >>



ABS only turns on if your wheels lock up. So if you're on a dry (or wet) road with reg brakes and stop without locking up, you should be able to stop in the exact same distance if you had ABS brakes, since the ABS feature never would have activated.

Dionx's example does make sense. Think about it. On ABS brakes your wheels will lock up for fractions of a second and then will be corrected - most of the time the equation will have static friction. But if you just slam on normal brakes and skid until you stop, there will have been a whole lot more kinetic friction.

 

[b0mbrman]

<< HA HA, you nut. You're making your decision on ABS??? lol
ABS is overhyped 😛 >>


Sure is

 

[Freejack2]

I won't buy a car without ABS anymore either.
My last 2 cars have had it and I wish the 95 car had it.
In the 95 I could have save myself over $1000 in damage if it had it.
Last 2 cars have had it and it's saved me a number of times.

Mind you ABS is not a miracle worker. ABS's main thing is it pumps the brakes faster than any human can. If all you need is raw stopping power ABS is going to do nothing at all to help. If however it's a situation where any kind of turning will save your arse, ABS will save the day!

uncJigga, if your going to have to spend extra money to get an Altima 2.5s, why not just get an Accord EX?

 

[ThisIsMatt]

<<

<<

<<

<< Wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong. ABS does not stop you faster. ABS is only there to allow you to steer somewhat while braking (if you're skidding, you can't steer). >>



YES IT DOES. ask any physicist.

"Stopping a car with ordinary brakes may result in wheel lock; that is, the wheels lock in position and are not able to rotate. When this happens, the tires skid and the coefficient of kinetic friction determines the braking distance. "

"Cars equipped with an antilock braking system (ABS) have a sensor that releases the brake pads the instant the wheel locks up. After a brief pause the brakes are then quickly re-engaged. If they don't lock up again all is well. If they do, the ABS releases the brake pads again. This processes can repeat many times a second. In any case, the tires are not allowed to lock for more than a few milliseconds. The car is then stopped using the force of static friction alone."

basically static friction is easier to stop a car then kinetic friction. >>

Talk to my last quarter university physics prof. I'll give you wet conditions, but not dry. Even what you just quoted doesn't make sense by your explanation. In that case, your brake rotors are slipping (hey, kinetic friction!) 🙂

Here's a mind bender - which stops you in a more straight path, locked up front wheels or locked up rear wheels? >>



ABS only turns on if your wheels lock up. So if you're on a dry (or wet) road with reg brakes and stop without locking up, you should be able to stop in the exact same distance if you had ABS brakes, since the ABS feature never would have activated.

Dionx's example does make sense. Think about it. On ABS brakes your wheels will lock up for fractions of a second and then will be corrected - most of the time the equation will have static friction. But if you just slam on normal brakes and skid until you stop, there will have been a whole lot more kinetic friction. >>

What I was saying is that it's either your wheels sliding, or your brakes sliding 🙂 You either have static friction at the wheels and kinetic at the brakes, or kinetic friction at the wheels and static friction at the brakes. 😛

 

[Conflict]

haha you don't even get 4-disc brakes, still old-school drums in the back

 

[Jerboy]

<< I don't like ABS, I'd rather control the brakes myself. >>




ABS has four different hydraulic actuators and can control four wheels independently as fast as ten times a second.

No matter how skilled you're, you can't control individual wheels.

 

[helpme]

ABS = Anti Braking System

heh

 

[Thegonagle]

<<

<< I don't like ABS, I'd rather control the brakes myself. >>




ABS has four different hydraulic actuators and can control four wheels independently as fast as ten times a second.

No matter how skilled you're, you can't control individual wheels. >>

I don't care. I know how to drive. I'll take a car either way, with or without, but all ABS is not created equal, so that ABS would be disabled in a hurry on my car if I ever got the feeling that I could do a better job myself. Some are great (many Volvos I've driven) and some are not so good (Nissan Pathfinder).

 

[RalphTheCow]

I think ABS is dangerous because it introduces the possibility of mode error.

For many years all brakes worked the same. Now, there are different implementations of ABS which may work differently from each other, as well as very differently from non-ABS. So if you are used to non-ABS and rent an ABS car, you may be very surprised at the way the brakes work. The worst thing is that you will probably discover this at a very critical moment.

I don't like or trust ABS because it robbed me of brake feel when it kicked in on a slippery road. And also most likely caused me to slide across a busy road, thus coming a lot closer to tragedy than I want.

I have a lot of experience modulating just to the point of lockup and this has always worked well on slippery roads. ABS probably is better for panic stops so you can just mash the pedal without the possibility of going sideways, although good brake balance works well also.

This is purely subjective and speculative, but it felt like the ABS (on a Honda Odyssey) was on/off rather than proportional, which caused an endless cycle of release, slide, release, slide. They used to teach to gently squeeze the brakes which always worked well for me. I don't know how they teach it today, or whether the ABS restores the amout of pressure on the pedal or the complete brake power.

I would be more upset at Honda for cheaping out with drum brakes than for non offering ABS.

 

[toant103]

abs is cool

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

ABS 101

ABS can INCREASE the distance to stop by a small amount. You say AhHA! See! ABS doesn't do what it was intended! <buzzer sounds> Wrong! It did just what it was intended to do. It sacrificed some braking distance for control. Remember that not everyone lives in So. Cal.

Tires that do not turn do not steer. Non moving tread is not directional. Read- into the ditch or another car. ABS allows for limited wheel movement under hard braking and poor traction conditions. Your chanced of staying in a straight line until you can safely stop increases. That is what ABS is for. Can some people brake better with ABS off? Sure. How about the Boston soccer mom distracted by the cell phone? Probably not. Around here there are more of that type than NASCAR drivers. I have tested my Passat ABS in an empty section of a lot under slippery conditions, and found it benificial. Perhaps others should try that exercise in order to anticipate what will happen to them under similar conditions.