Abortion: Just the Data

[zendari]

Originally posted by: bthorny

Originally posted by: zendari
A question for the libs: Why should we all have to pay for abortions, contraception, and birth control, subsidizing someone else's sexual activity?

I think someone might be a little worried that some of us might be having a little to much fun.....

Are you a 60 years or what?


The sexual activity is what it is really about..

Then pay for it yourself. Six flags is fun, but I dont get in for free.

People are going to have sex, youre too young to know but its actually enjoyable. Also if it wasnt subsidized there would be FAR more unwanted births. Since dumbya and the right are pushing abstinance only/contraceptives are evil agendas its absolutely necessary to keep unwanted births down

As I mentioned before, I disagree with the administrations ideas on contraception and abstinence. Contraception should be readily available for sale in drugstores and elsewhere.

 

[Kerouactivist]

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: bthorny

Originally posted by: zendari
A question for the libs: Why should we all have to pay for abortions, contraception, and birth control, subsidizing someone else's sexual activity?

I think someone might be a little worried that some of us might be having a little to much fun.....

Are you a 60 years or what?


The sexual activity is what it is really about..

Then pay for it yourself. Six flags is fun, but I dont get in for free.

So you think abortion, birth control contraceptives should be legal for everybody as long as they pay for it...

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: homercles337

Originally posted by: zendari
A question for the libs: Why should we all have to pay for abortions, contraception, and birth control, subsidizing someone else's sexual activity?

People are going to have sex, youre too young to know but its actually enjoyable. Also if it wasnt subsidized there would be FAR more unwanted births. Since dumbya and the right are pushing abstinance only/contraceptives are evil agendas its absolutely necessary to keep unwanted births down.

What are you talking about? Contraception is available everywhere. You can buy condoms at your local convenience store. Can't afford them? Planned Parenthood and a dozen other orgs like them will give you contraception for free. The problem isn't availability, it's use.

Sure, people are going to have sex. But where is the responsibility that comes with the fun? Equasions must be balanced. You can't have one without the other. My personal view on abortion is this: You're making someone else (who has no say in the decision) pay for your mistake. And if the abortion is state funded then where exactly does responsibility play in? It doesn't. And if there is no personal responsibility expected of anyone, why would anyone excercise personal responsibility? And that turns into an issue much bigger than abortion real fast.

 

[Kadarin]

What is clearly needed here is more faith-based abstinence-only religious indoctrination. The people must be made to understand that unwanted children are God's punishment for such immoral sexual behavior.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy
What are you talking about? Contraception is available everywhere. You can buy condoms at your local convenience store. Can't afford them? Planned Parenthood and a dozen other orgs like them will give you contraception for free. The problem isn't availability, it's use.

Sure, people are going to have sex. But where is the responsibility that comes with the fun? Equasions must be balanced. You can't have one without the other. My personal view on abortion is this: You're making someone else (who has no say in the decision) pay for your mistake. And if the abortion is state funded then where exactly does responsibility play in? It doesn't. And if there is no personal responsibility expected of anyone, why would anyone excercise personal responsibility? And that turns into an issue much bigger than abortion real fast.

Is it safe to assume you're for teaching proper sex education in the schools?

 

[MonkeyK]

Yeah, and stay out of the sun if you can't afford to treat yourself for skin cancer!

Darned sponging sun worshipers!

 

[zendari]

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy
What are you talking about? Contraception is available everywhere. You can buy condoms at your local convenience store. Can't afford them? Planned Parenthood and a dozen other orgs like them will give you contraception for free. The problem isn't availability, it's use.

Sure, people are going to have sex. But where is the responsibility that comes with the fun? Equasions must be balanced. You can't have one without the other. My personal view on abortion is this: You're making someone else (who has no say in the decision) pay for your mistake. And if the abortion is state funded then where exactly does responsibility play in? It doesn't. And if there is no personal responsibility expected of anyone, why would anyone excercise personal responsibility? And that turns into an issue much bigger than abortion real fast.

Is it safe to assume you're for teaching proper sex education in the schools?

Define proper.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy
What are you talking about? Contraception is available everywhere. You can buy condoms at your local convenience store. Can't afford them? Planned Parenthood and a dozen other orgs like them will give you contraception for free. The problem isn't availability, it's use.

Sure, people are going to have sex. But where is the responsibility that comes with the fun? Equasions must be balanced. You can't have one without the other. My personal view on abortion is this: You're making someone else (who has no say in the decision) pay for your mistake. And if the abortion is state funded then where exactly does responsibility play in? It doesn't. And if there is no personal responsibility expected of anyone, why would anyone excercise personal responsibility? And that turns into an issue much bigger than abortion real fast.

Is it safe to assume you're for teaching proper sex education in the schools?

Define proper.

Remove the stigmas attached to using condoms or going on the pill. Maybe even have parents come in for the opening class so everyone knows what will be covered.

Cover condom types and usage. Also go over non-latex options for those with latex allergies. Cover the various types of feminine contraceptives and their proper use. Also, discuss the costs of using contraception vs. the cost of labor and raising a child.

 

[zendari]

All fine, as long as part of the program includes abstinence as well, as the most effective way of preventing pregnancy and STDs.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: zendari
All fine, as long as part of the program includes abstinence as well, as the most effective way of preventing pregnancy and STDs.

Oh, yeah....of course. But abstinence-only is a BIG mistake.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy
What are you talking about? Contraception is available everywhere. You can buy condoms at your local convenience store. Can't afford them? Planned Parenthood and a dozen other orgs like them will give you contraception for free. The problem isn't availability, it's use.

Sure, people are going to have sex. But where is the responsibility that comes with the fun? Equasions must be balanced. You can't have one without the other. My personal view on abortion is this: You're making someone else (who has no say in the decision) pay for your mistake. And if the abortion is state funded then where exactly does responsibility play in? It doesn't. And if there is no personal responsibility expected of anyone, why would anyone excercise personal responsibility? And that turns into an issue much bigger than abortion real fast.

Is it safe to assume you're for teaching proper sex education in the schools?

Proper is a very subjective term. Personally, I think that school is for reading, history, science and the like, not sex ed and diversity training. That is the responsibility and, ultimately, the legacy of the parent. I wouldn't want anyone teaching my kids (don't have any but if I did) about moral/sexual issues. That is not what school is for. That's my job and I don't want anyone else doing it. The government can barely deliver my mail, why on earth would I let them teach my kids about personal responsibility or how to put on a condom???

 

[zendari]

Because, Whoozyerdaddy, most parents are incompetent fools. Remove your children from those parts of the schooling if you have issue with it.

 

[conjur]

But parents have proven to be rather inept at teaching sex education.

And, you dismiss the gov't rather easily. Quite a lot of good comes out of the beauracracy.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: zendari
Because, Whoozyerdaddy, most parents are incompetent fools. Remove your children from those parts of the schooling if you have issue with it.

Hey now...knock that off. We can't be seen up here agreeing on issues.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: zendari
Because, Whoozyerdaddy, most parents are incompetent fools. Remove your children from those parts of the schooling if you have issue with it.

Hey now...knock that off. We can't be seen up here agreeing on issues.

It's the fourth horseman... RUN!!!

I think it's kind of insulting to say that most parents are incompetent fools. I've come across some idiot parents in my time but I'd have to say that most parents do a fine job.

Maybe it's just the way I was brought up. But there are some things that the schools should just stay out of.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: zendari
Because, Whoozyerdaddy, most parents are incompetent fools. Remove your children from those parts of the schooling if you have issue with it.

Hey now...knock that off. We can't be seen up here agreeing on issues.

It's the fourth horseman... RUN!!!

I think it's kind of insulting to say that most parents are incompetent fools. I've come across some idiot parents in my time but I'd have to say that most parents do a fine job.

Maybe it's just the way I was brought up. But there are some things that the schools should just stay out of.

Your dad taught you about condoms and how to put one on? Taught you about the various types? Taught you about women's periods and fertility? Taught you about female contraceptives like diaphrams, the sponge, the pill, etc.?

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: zendari
Because, Whoozyerdaddy, most parents are incompetent fools. Remove your children from those parts of the schooling if you have issue with it.

Hey now...knock that off. We can't be seen up here agreeing on issues.

It's the fourth horseman... RUN!!!

I think it's kind of insulting to say that most parents are incompetent fools. I've come across some idiot parents in my time but I'd have to say that most parents do a fine job.

Maybe it's just the way I was brought up. But there are some things that the schools should just stay out of.

Your dad taught you about condoms and how to put one on? Taught you about the various types? Taught you about women's periods and fertility? Taught you about female contraceptives like diaphrams, the sponge, the pill, etc.?

Actually it was mom...

<----- Lotsa sex / no kids (and confirmed by MD there is nothing wrong with my swimmers)

Edit: And younger brother... 32... Lotsa sex / no kids

 

[catnap1972]

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: zendari
Because, Whoozyerdaddy, most parents are incompetent fools. Remove your children from those parts of the schooling if you have issue with it.

Hey now...knock that off. We can't be seen up here agreeing on issues.

Something I agree with zendari about? WTF is going on? :Q

 

[zendari]

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: zendari
Because, Whoozyerdaddy, most parents are incompetent fools. Remove your children from those parts of the schooling if you have issue with it.

Hey now...knock that off. We can't be seen up here agreeing on issues.

I am very much a moderate TYVM.

 

[Kerouactivist]

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: zendari
Because, Whoozyerdaddy, most parents are incompetent fools. Remove your children from those parts of the schooling if you have issue with it.

Hey now...knock that off. We can't be seen up here agreeing on issues.

I am very much a moderate TYVM.

So do you believe that people should be able to have abortions and use contraceptives as long as they pay for it?

 

[zendari]

Originally posted by: bthorny

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: zendari
Because, Whoozyerdaddy, most parents are incompetent fools. Remove your children from those parts of the schooling if you have issue with it.

Hey now...knock that off. We can't be seen up here agreeing on issues.

I am very much a moderate TYVM.

So do you believe that people should be able to have abortions and use contraceptives as long as they pay for it?

I would be willing to accept first trim. abortions under the following conditions:

You pay for it.
Parental consent for minors.
Spousal consent for married people.
Remove all the double standards surrounding fetuses, such as murders of pregnant women.
I might be missing a couple others, but I think thats the gist of it.

 

[homercles337]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: homercles337

Originally posted by: zendari
A question for the libs: Why should we all have to pay for abortions, contraception, and birth control, subsidizing someone else's sexual activity?

People are going to have sex, youre too young to know but its actually enjoyable. Also if it wasnt subsidized there would be FAR more unwanted births. Since dumbya and the right are pushing abstinance only/contraceptives are evil agendas its absolutely necessary to keep unwanted births down.

What are you talking about? Contraception is available everywhere. You can buy condoms at your local convenience store. Can't afford them? Planned Parenthood and a dozen other orgs like them will give you contraception for free. The problem isn't availability, it's use.

Sure, people are going to have sex. But where is the responsibility that comes with the fun? Equasions must be balanced. You can't have one without the other. My personal view on abortion is this: You're making someone else (who has no say in the decision) pay for your mistake. And if the abortion is state funded then where exactly does responsibility play in? It doesn't. And if there is no personal responsibility expected of anyone, why would anyone excercise personal responsibility? And that turns into an issue much bigger than abortion real fast.

You miss the point, once a again, stupid kid. Did you see how FEW abortions are subsidized? Do you totally miss the fact that there would be more unwanted briths without abortion? I said NOTHING about responsibility. Its our responsilbity to take care of those that are irresponsible. If you disagree, you are not worthy of considering yourself part of society.

 

[conjur]

WTF???

http://wwwc.house.gov/smbiz/press/asp_d..._press_releases.asp?pressReleaseId=101

http://prochoiceaction.org/campaign/house_alpha_072605/bb587u405e6b6j?

On July 25, a U.S. House of Representatives committee held a hearing on whether pharmacies should be allowed to refuse to fill women?s prescriptions. Anti-choice Rep. Steve King (R-IA) told a witness, who had been denied birth control and emergency contraception by her pharmacist, that she had no ?right? to her prescriptions - she only believed she did. Anti-choice Rep. Marilyn Musgrave (R-CO) told a witness whose prescription had also been rejected by a hostile pharmacist, that her ?minor inconvenience? ? that is, risking an unintended pregnancy ? was nothing compared to the ?conscience? of a pharmacist.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/25/asb.01.html

BROWN: Do you think there's a right to privacy in the Constitution?

SANTORUM: No -- well, not the right to privacy as created under Roe v. Wade and all...

BROWN: Do you think there's a right to privacy in the Constitution?

SANTORUM: I think there's a right to unreasonable -- to unreasonable search and seizure...

BROWN: For example, if you'd been a Supreme Court judge in Griswold versus Connecticut, the famous birth control case came up, which centered around whether there was a right to privacy. Do you believe that was correctly decided?

SANTORUM: No, I don't. I write about it in the book. I don't.

BROWN: The state of Connecticut had the right to ban birth control for a married couple.

SANTORUM: I think they were wrong. It was a bad law.

BROWN: But they had the right.

SANTORUM: They had the right. They had the right...

BROWN: Why would a conservative argue that government should interfere with that most personal decision?

SANTORUM: I didn't. I said it was a bad law. And...

BROWN: But they had the right to make.

SANTORUM: They had the right to make it. Look, legislatures have the right to make mistakes and do really stupid things...

And, the kicker. This was apparently from a NARAL email alert:

It's official: Americans can no longer take prescription birth control for granted. Yesterday, Monday, July 25, anti-choice representatives in the U.S. House made it clear that they support pharmacies that refuse to fill birth-control prescriptions - and that women have no right to birth control.

The radical right's campaign to stop birth control


The House Small Business Committee held a hearing on whether pharmacies should be allowed to refuse to fill women's prescriptions. Anti-choice Rep. Steve King (R-IA) told a witness, who had been denied birth control and emergency contraception by her pharmacist, that she had no "right" to her prescriptions - she only believed she did. Anti-choice Rep. Marilyn Musgrave (R-CO) told a witness whose prescription had also been rejected by a hostile pharmacist, that her "minor inconvenience" - that is, risking an unintended pregnancy - was nothing compared to the "conscience" of a pharmacist.

The right's anti-birth control campaign doesn't stop in Washington, DC. Across the country, the radical right has engaged pharmacies in its campaign to block women's access to birth control. Women like Julee Lacey, a 32-year-old married mother of two and first-grade teacher from Texas, are being turned away by vigilante pharmacists who think it's their job to dispense morals instead of medicine.

Now, as many as 20 states officially protect pharmacists like Karen Brauer, president of Pharmacists for Life, who says she'd lecture women customers to get off the pill. Other states are pursuing an even more aggressive strategy. Just last month Wisconsin passed a bill to block state universities from filling birth control prescriptions.

:shocked:

 

[Tab]

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: bthorny

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: zendari
Because, Whoozyerdaddy, most parents are incompetent fools. Remove your children from those parts of the schooling if you have issue with it.

Hey now...knock that off. We can't be seen up here agreeing on issues.

I am very much a moderate TYVM.

So do you believe that people should be able to have abortions and use contraceptives as long as they pay for it?

I would be willing to accept first trim. abortions under the following conditions:

You pay for it.
Parental consent for minors.
Spousal consent for married people.
Remove all the double standards surrounding fetuses, such as murders of pregnant women.
I might be missing a couple others, but I think thats the gist of it.

- You pay for it

-Parental notification

-No abortions after the third trimester unless the fetus threatens the mother's life

That'd be good enough for me...

 

[zendari]

After the 3rd trimester?