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A rant about road construction speed

DesiPower

DesiPower

Lifer
So there is this stretch of 1.5 miles of road that was single lane, about 2 years ago they started working on making it, making it 4 lanes with median and turning lane and all that good stuff. As of now it looks like its still atleast 6 month to a year away. I mean seriously? 2 - 2.5 years to widen a 1.5 miles of road??? I don't believe that can be the normal working speed, there was another road near my community that was about 2.5 - 3 miles long, took them approximately 2.5 years to complete.

When I bought my house, the new community (huge, about 2500 houses) was already about a year old, It had a 2 miles, wide road, almost as wide as a four lane, it as fully complete and ready when I first was it 6 month into when they started building the community. It's been about 7 years now and the road is in immaculate condition, no damage, great construction IMO. I don't believe they would have bulldozed the trees and started building the road 2 years before that... point is, when its a private work, run by private companies its done so much quicker and better, the amount of waste that takes place in terms of time and money on these govt projects is outrageous.
 
Welcome to the wonderful world of government, cronyism, and unions.

It has taken California 10 years (was scheduled to open in 2007 will now open in 2013.....maybe) to replace 1/2 a bridge and the entire original bridge took 3 years to complete.
 
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So there is this stretch of 1.5 miles of road that was single lane, about 2 years ago they started working on making it, making it 4 lanes with median and turning lane and all that good stuff.
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I thought it was pretty common knowledge that it takes longer to expand an existing road then to build a brand new one? Especially if the existing road is heavily traveled.

I don't believe they would have bulldozed the trees and started building the road 2 years before that... point is, when its a private work, run by private companies its done so much quicker and better, the amount of waste that takes place in terms of time and money on these govt projects is outrageous.
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Also, at least with the roads here in NC, the work is farmed out to private companies. They all send in bids and they pick the lowballer. So it is private companies doing the work.
 
Can't say about that specific case since I don't live there, but comparing a subdivision road to a highway is like comparing a modular house to a commercial factory. The only similarity is something sticks up above ground. I don't know how they do things in Texas, but around here contracts are bid for road work. The only things the county/state does is small time patch operations.
 
Call your road agency and ask if they found a dead body (archaeological feature!) or if any of the nearby businesses sued for some stupid reason to stop the construction.

Otherwise, someone effed up on the design, they found something they didn't expect, money ran out, etc.


By the way, all roadwork in my "state" is done by private contractors. Ya, guberment pays the contractors, and are ocassionally forced to reuse shitty contractors whom do shitty work because you have to pre-qualify to bid on stuff. And because it's gubment, you "have" to give it to the lowest bid, or someone's going to start crying.
 
DesiPower said:
So there is this stretch of 1.5 miles of road that was single lane, about 2 years ago they started working on making it, making it 4 lanes with median and turning lane and all that good stuff. As of now it looks like its still atleast 6 month to a year away. I mean seriously? 2 - 2.5 years to widen a 1.5 miles of road??? I don't believe that can be the normal working speed, there was another road near my community that was about 2.5 - 3 miles long, took them approximately 2.5 years to complete.
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Here's the thing with highway/public works projects most people don't know: when they're approved they're usually "fully-funded" in the sense that the gov't knows where the money is coming from but they're not "fully-funded" in the sense that the gov't actually has the money in the bank. In many cases the construction project is partially funded by Federal grant or matching funds and/or certain tax or bond revenues. If the expected revenue isn't realized then the gov't can't pay for the work, so the contractor stops working. The contractor then comes on site and continues work only as the revenue to pay for the work comes in. This (lack of adequate funding) is probably the #1 reason for road construction delay.

When I bought my house, the new community (huge, about 2500 houses) was already about a year old, It had a 2 miles, wide road, almost as wide as a four lane, it as fully complete and ready when I first was it 6 month into when they started building the community. It's been about 7 years now and the road is in immaculate condition, no damage, great construction IMO. I don't believe they would have bulldozed the trees and started building the road 2 years before that... point is, when its a private work, run by private companies its done so much quicker and better, the amount of waste that takes place in terms of time and money on these govt projects is outrageous.
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There's a huge difference. When a subdivision or "planned community" goes in the developer has to secure funding for all of the improvements (roads, sidewalks, monumentation, underground, etc) and provide a bond guaranteeing construction prior to the municipality granting the necessary construction permits. The roads and whatnot are put in by the developer and then (often) turned over to the municipality for upkeep (though some communities opt to retain ownership).

So you see, you can't compare the two types of projects because even though they're both "road work" projects they're held to different financing standards.
 
it doesn't actually take a lot of time. bureaucracy and people milking the job or some bs environmental reason.
 
welcome to the world of public bid projects. Yeah, it's slow because the whole bid process for public projects is a money grab. Half the time is the engineering firm and the contractor arguing about engineering work. The document says this, but that drawings say that. In the end, it's a project that was forced to stop because of "problems" found in the field. This lead to change orders that the engineering firm spends a few weeks defending and trying to get out of paying it. It's a huge flaw in the bid process because the construction firm will look over the project and bid low on purpose because they know what they can get a change order on.

What's even worse is that in public bid projects, you have little control over what the contractor will buy, while on private projects, all you have to do is tell the contractor to buy XYZ and be done with it. On public projects, you have to submit specifications and "suggest" what the contractor can buy. However, you cannot outright tell them what to buy and they can substitute for a different item provided it is "equal". So, there is this whole submittal phase, that takes a month or two, where the engineer has to approve of everything that goes into the project. If they find something that is not "equal", good luck. It's about another month of arguing with the contractor. Change order? Yup, another round of submittals.

It's amazing...for a public bid project, your job goes from engineer to simply delegating work and being a PM. However, for private projects, you can't leave a stone unturned. You actually have to do engineering! And they finish work before you realize it.
 
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All road construction rants are weak in light of my commute between Ventura Blvd./Sepulveda Blvd./405/101 and Wilshire Blvd.

MotionMan
 
Thought this was about the speed limit. In my town there were three projects where the contracters just up and left. I know that there is a reason why but its funny that the city just left the mess and "opened" the roads back up.
 
Sixguns said:
Thought this was about the speed limit. In my town there were three projects where the contracters just up and left. I know that there is a reason why but its funny that the city just left the mess and "opened" the roads back up.
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A friend's family is in the construction business (private company). When they work on roads, at the end of every day they have to cover all the holes with plates and/or, even worse, refill holes, just to have to uncover and/or re-dig the holes the next day.

However, when the work is being done by a government crew, they just set up some cones and signs and call it a day.

MotionMan
 
MotionMan said:
A friend's family is in the construction business (private company). When they work on roads, at the end of every day they have to cover all the holes with plates and/or, even worse, refill holes, just to have to uncover and/or re-dig the holes the next day.

However, when the work is being done by a government crew, they just set up some cones and signs and call it a day.

MotionMan
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All three of roads were being done by the same company. The worst one, and is also the one that was worked on the longest, has one lane paved and the other lane is just gravel. I am glad I dont live on that side of town to worry about driving down that mess of a "road".
 
Lowest bidder.

They've been widening a section of the Interstate near me since I moved into this house in 2009. Still going. And, I have to to be honest, I don't see much in the way of progress.
 
It had a 2 miles, wide road, almost as wide as a four lane, it as fully complete and ready when I first was it 6 month into when they started building the community.
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This is quite possibly one of the most horribly constructed sentences I have read in awhile.
 
My county has a town that really needs jobs. A nearby port has decided to install and repair the existing railroad , extending it all the way to the port and bringing back jobs to the area. It could possibly add several thousand jobs to an area with 20% unemployment. All of the funding is approved, everything is ready to go and it will be completed, in 15 years ! The excuses, need to do an environmental study for 7years, need to repair and construct a new bridge for 5 years, and the remaining years are construction time.

Environmental study for train tracks that have been there already for 50+ years they are just adding another set of tracks beside the existing ones making it 2 way, Sometimes I hate the EPA.
 
NFS4 said:
Also, at least with the roads here in NC, the work is farmed out to private companies. They all send in bids and they pick the lowballer. So it is private companies doing the work.
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That explains the 4 guys standing around the hole in the road while 1 guy was digging. I guess that one hole took a lot of supervising because when I came back hours later, the same guy was still digging and the 4 other guys were now sitting on coolers beside the road.
 
Once it's paved, the work has only begun.

They'll dig it up again the year after and do the actual plumbing. Your tax dollars at work.
 
Its BS when a road that was perfectly fine for years is ripped apart and hastily patched up. The new road easily crumbles and yearly repairs have to be done or they just lay steel plates over it.

It doesn't make a bit of sense unless you consider the corruption angle behind it.
 
I get the feeling that many people here wouldn't complain as much about the work being done slowly, lazy/inefficient workers or contractors, or corruption if they actually had some experience with what goes in to construction projects.

It's easy to gripe about something that you don't have experience doing.
 
Bignate603 said:
I get the feeling that many people here wouldn't complain as much about the work being done slowly, lazy/inefficient workers or contractors, or corruption if they actually had some experience with what goes in to construction projects.

It's easy to gripe about something that you don't have experience doing.
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So I can since Ive done this stuff. My father in law got me a job with him a couple years ago after high school.
 
Bignate603 said:
I get the feeling that many people here wouldn't complain as much about the work being done slowly, lazy/inefficient workers or contractors, or corruption if they actually had some experience with what goes in to construction projects.

It's easy to gripe about something that you don't have experience doing.
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My grippe is not about the workers themselves, but the politics behind it. After working in server support and being a (different type) worker, I have a better understanding of how things normally go. You may be the one doing the work, but only if "the suits" (management) say to do it. I'm guessing it's very similar with construction. In fact it's probably worse because the suits are sitting in huge gold lined offices 2000 miles away from the actual site. When the workers sitting doing nothing it's most likely because they are not allowed to go on until some permit is approved or something like that, or they ran into a snag and the solution to overcome it has to be approved etc... all red tape.

While some workers can be lazy, I don't think all of them are. The real delay is because of all the political BS that happens in the background. I'm sure there's other factors too, as I'm only comparing it with my experience in IT which is not really the same as construction.

One thing for sure, you could not pay me enough money to work in construction outside. Probably not that bad in winter, but in summer, screw that. If you are not getting drenched in rain, you are getting drenched in your own sweat.
 
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