Originally posted by: Atreus21
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Atreus21
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Atreus21
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbW64215HA8
I thought this was pretty cool. By a black guy, nonetheless. Even a liberal has to admit it's pretty well choreagraphed.
That's about all we have to admit, if that. The actual dialogue is filled with straw men and false claims and misleading statements.
Not in my opinion.
Rather than my cherry picking weak links, you are invited to post a couple of the points from the dialogue you think are the strongest, and I'll respond.
Well, for starters, I whole-heartedly agree with his statement on minimum wage.
It'd help if you quoted it so there's no bickering about what he said, but as I recall his argument, it was that while Democrats 'keep raising' it, it's not designed to be a livalble wage, and people should learn more skills if they want to make enough for taking care of their family.
Well, there are a number of problems with the position IMO.
One is mis-framing the issue as about the wage being about taking care of a family. That's far from the only definition of what the minimum wage should be, but it's all he offers.
The minimum wage deserves its own discussion what it's about, and that might be more where the differences lie.
Liberals are aware that in the power balance between the company and the worker, there's a history showing that the worker unprotected by government can have to settle as low as barely enough to eat. Do you want that? 'Conservatives' never that I see will discuss that issue much, they simply take advantage of the measures liberals have put in place to assume that the workers won't be in that situation. If you go back a century, the average wage, as I've read, was $10,000, *adjusted for inflation* of course. That should give you an idea of why, following the laissez-faire approach, there was a national movement calling for 'progressive' reforms.
The definition of what the minimum wage should be is debatable and we probably won't agree - but perhaps we can at least use its historic level as a measure for comparison.
In recent years, if I've read accurate info, it's been at or near historic lows - and the Republicans did nothing. Whatever definition you use for what it should be set to, the fact is that itt has not kept up with inflation at all, so we can say that Republicans need not only to throw out a phrase about enough to raise a family, but defend why they are not keeping up with inflation and changing the historic level it's been at.
The video doesn't make the arguments, but the right frequently makes all kinds of falalcious and false claims about the wage. Since we're discussing the video, I'll leave it at that.
Another problem with the video is that it doesn't mention how the minimum wage has an effect of raising low wages above the minimum as well, for millions of workers.
The bottom line is that liberals are in favor of a system which works for everyone - by analogy, you might pay the janitor $1, the skilled worker $5, the executive $25 and the CEO $100. Liberals are interested in the balance ensuring that the middle class opportunity is accessible to people, that poverty is kept to a minimum, and that the rewards are not too low or too high for the better off, so that the system is productive (the 'rising tide that lifts all boats'). The minimum wage is part of doing that.
The right only seems to have informal phrases to toss out - no actual defense for their neglect of the minimum wage, which is based on really nothing more than the fact that the poor getting poorer makes them cheaper labor and increases the profits the wealthy make; and that their 'base' has drunk the kool-aid to not like the minimum wage, so it's politically expedient to let it decline.
That's not much of an argument.
I think that whatever the definition, the humanitarian and common sense views support a strong minimum wage. It works. It helps the economy, IMO.
So many of these 'issues' are little more than the right defending sort-sighted policies that enrich the rich and leave the poor poorer, while the liberals are for the 'middle class'.
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