8GB VRAM not enough (and 10 / 12)

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BFG10K

BFG10K

Lifer
Aug 14, 2000
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8GB
Horizon Forbidden West 3060 is faster than the 2080 Super despite the former usually competing with the 2070. Also 3060 has a better 1% low than 4060 and 4060Ti 8GB.
pFJi8XrGZfYuvhvk4952je-970-80.png.webp
Resident Evil Village 3060TI/3070 tanks at 4K and is slower than the 3060/6700XT when ray tracing:
RE.jpg
Company Of Heroes 3060 has a higher minimum than the 3070TI:
CH.jpg

10GB / 12GB

Reasons why still shipping 8GB since 2014 isn't NV's fault.
  1. It's the player's fault.
  2. It's the reviewer's fault.
  3. It's the developer's fault.
  4. It's AMD's fault.
  5. It's the game's fault.
  6. It's the driver's fault.
  7. It's a system configuration issue.
  8. Wrong settings were tested.
  9. Wrong area was tested.
  10. Wrong games were tested.
  11. 4K is irrelevant.
  12. Texture quality is irrelevant as long as it matches a console's.
  13. Detail levels are irrelevant as long as they match a console's.
  14. There's no reason a game should use more than 8GB, because a random forum user said so.
  15. It's completely acceptable for the more expensive 3070/3070TI/3080 to turn down settings while the cheaper 3060/6700XT has no issue.
  16. It's an anomaly.
  17. It's a console port.
  18. It's a conspiracy against NV.
  19. 8GB cards aren't meant for 4K / 1440p / 1080p / 720p gaming.
  20. It's completely acceptable to disable ray tracing on NV while AMD has no issue.
  21. Polls, hardware market share, and game title count are evidence 8GB is enough, but are totally ignored when they don't suit the ray tracing agenda.
According to some people here, 8GB is neeeevaaaaah NV's fault and objective evidence "doesn't count" because of reasons(tm). If you have others please let me know and I'll add them to the list. Cheers!
 
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MrTeal

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jpiniero said:
100%. I expect the 5060 Ti to be 8 GB too, although they might offer a 12 GB option when the 3 GB chips come out.
Click to expand...
8GB 5060 Ti would be a joke. Names can be whatever they want, but a card with 4070 like performance or better saddled with only 8GB is absolutely going to be crapping the bed in the next couple years in games it should just blow through.

Nvidia is stingy, but that's almost a step too far.
 
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blckgrffn

blckgrffn

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MrTeal said:
8GB 5060 Ti would be a joke. Names can be whatever they want, but a card with 4070 like performance or better saddled with only 8GB is absolutely going to be crapping the bed in the next couple years in games it should just blow through.

Nvidia is stingy, but that's almost a step too far.
Click to expand...

I don’t disagree, but step into r/pcmr and the copium is sooooo strong. A 8 GB 5060 Ti is so weird - it’s going to validate them! If Nvidia sells it, how can it be wrong?!?

And yeah, just reference the OP for all the arguments being made.

I particularly like the “my 3070 Ti runs all games at ultra settings on 1440p so it’s fine for Nvidia to release new 60 series cards with 8 GB” type justifications 😂

Oh well. I expect Nvidia to profit and for next gen budget cards to age poorly. All according to plan! 💩
 
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jpiniero

Lifer
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MrTeal said:
8GB 5060 Ti would be a joke. Names can be whatever they want, but a card with 4070 like performance or better saddled with only 8GB is absolutely going to be crapping the bed in the next couple years in games it should just blow through.

Nvidia is stingy, but that's almost a step too far.
Click to expand...

128-bit is 128-bit. The only options really would be to wait until 3 GB chips become available; or use GB205 instead, which doesn't make any sense since yields should be so good to not need that deep of a cut.
 
DAPUNISHER

DAPUNISHER

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SteveGrabowski

SteveGrabowski

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MrTeal said:
8GB 5060 Ti would be a joke. Names can be whatever they want, but a card with 4070 like performance or better saddled with only 8GB is absolutely going to be crapping the bed in the next couple years in games it should just blow through.

Nvidia is stingy, but that's almost a step too far.
Click to expand...
Watch it have 3060 Ti performance like the 4060 Ti did :tearsofjoy:
 
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mikeymikec

mikeymikec

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I wondered if the purpose of the 5050 was to be NVIDIA's only low-profile offering, but then I spotted a low-profile 4060 with three fans and an 8-pin connector:

www.cclonline.com

Gigabyte GeForce RTX 4060 8GB OC LP GPU - GV-N4060OC-8GL

Available @ CCL, this Gigabyte GeForce RTX 4060 8GB GDDR6 Overclocked Graphics Card supports Raytracing, is VR Ready and has HDMI and DisplayPort, Mfg Code: GV-N4060OC-8GL
www.cclonline.com www.cclonline.com

I wonder how many SFF PCs that would actually fit in, let alone the power requirement.
 
M

MrTeal

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2003
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mikeymikec said:
I wondered if the purpose of the 5050 was to be NVIDIA's only low-profile offering, but then I spotted a low-profile 4060 with three fans and an 8-pin connector:

www.cclonline.com

Gigabyte GeForce RTX 4060 8GB OC LP GPU - GV-N4060OC-8GL

Available @ CCL, this Gigabyte GeForce RTX 4060 8GB GDDR6 Overclocked Graphics Card supports Raytracing, is VR Ready and has HDMI and DisplayPort, Mfg Code: GV-N4060OC-8GL
www.cclonline.com www.cclonline.com

I wonder how many SFF PCs that would actually fit in, let alone the power requirement.
Click to expand...
Probably most of them, if you own a soldering iron and a dremel.

jpiniero said:
128-bit is 128-bit. The only options really would be to wait until 3 GB chips become available; or use GB205 instead, which doesn't make any sense since yields should be so good to not need that deep of a cut.
Click to expand...
Most speculation I've seen has the 5060 using the full 4608 core GB206 or close to it, and it should already be faster than a 4060 Ti. The 5060 Ti would have to slot in somewhere between that and the 6400 core 5070 and be based on GB205/192bit.

If 5060 Ti is 4608 core GB206 128bit and the 5060 is a cut version of that, there's not point in reviewing anything from Nvidia below the $500 price point.
 
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jpiniero

Lifer
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MrTeal said:
Most speculation I've seen has the 5060 using the full 4608 core GB206 or close to it, and it should already be faster than a 4060 Ti. The 5060 Ti would have to slot in somewhere between that and the 6400 core 5070 and be based on GB205/192bit.
Click to expand...

Yields are so good at TSMC that it shouldn't be necessary to go that deep even on GB205 (which should be decently smaller than AD104). Mobile parts would be more than enough to handle what would be needed.

You could argue that they should just wait until 3 GB chips arrive to release the 5060 Ti to offer both 8 and 12 (so they can do the same thing they did with 4060 Ti, and people mostly bought the 8 GB model anyway)
 
blckgrffn

blckgrffn

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jpiniero said:
Yields are so good at TSMC that it shouldn't be necessary to go that deep even on GB205 (which should be decently smaller than AD104). Mobile parts would be more than enough to handle what would be needed.

You could argue that they should just wait until 3 GB chips arrive to release the 5060 Ti to offer both 8 and 12 (so they can do the same thing they did with 4060 Ti, and people mostly bought the 8 GB model anyway)
Click to expand...

Ha, or that the 5060Ti should have always been 192 bit from the jump, even with essentially no other die changes. But distinct lack of market pressure means - why? Anyone wanting that can buy a 5070 at launch.
 
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jpiniero

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The FF7 Rebirth specs say "12 GB recommended if a 4K monitor is used" even for 1080p minimum which doesn't make sense so perhaps a typo.

Does also specifically say that DX12U is required so no GTX/RX 5000 series.
 
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blckgrffn

blckgrffn

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jpiniero said:
The FF7 Rebirth specs say "12 GB recommended if a 4K monitor is used" even for 1080p minimum which doesn't make sense so perhaps a typo.

Does also specifically say that DX12U is required so no GTX/RX 5000 series.
Click to expand...
That’s more interesting to me than the Indiana Jones situation as this is a critical bridge title to a third installment whose sales performance is a really big deal.

Additionally, this also “underperformed” on the PS5 so you’d think the PC sales numbers would be really important.

On the flip side I can see this as Square not wanting to majorly compromise their artistic vision and/or overspend on making it work on the lowest common denominator.

Finally, I loved this game but paused it because it’s soooo much game. Then I thought I’d get a PS5 pro to enjoy it the best possible way and then Sony priced me out of that for now. By the time I get back to it I’ll have forgotten everything 😂
 
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SteveGrabowski

SteveGrabowski

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jpiniero said:
The FF7 Rebirth specs say "12 GB recommended if a 4K monitor is used" even for 1080p minimum which doesn't make sense so perhaps a typo.
Click to expand...
Maybe needed for using FSR/DLSS/XeSS to upscale 1080p to 4k instead of rendering straight 1080p and letting the monitor do the upscale? For example I was surprised at how much worse TLOU Part I ran on my 6700 XT using FSR from 1440p to 4k while it ran great just rendering 1440p and letting the monitor upscale to 4k. FSR usually runs a lot better for me. Maybe the upscaling isn't very optimized here either?
 
DAPUNISHER

DAPUNISHER

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ROFLwaffles there is no way it is going to be playable on a i3 8100. Windows update alone kneecaps that old quad core. And it's suppose to handle all of the game logic, bloated windows, and stream assets from the required SSD? Good luck with that.
 
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blckgrffn

blckgrffn

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SteveGrabowski said:
Ouch 1080p medium the recommended for my 6700 XT. Guess this won't be much better than playing it on my PS5 Scrub Version Console.
Click to expand...
The amount of graphics muscle is almost the same, close enough for hand grenades anyway.

It says it uses Shader Model 6.6 as a baseline, I don't know what that means exactly but it might also be the, oh I forget, the Primitive/Mesh Shaders bit too.

I think the 1400 and the 8100 are both ill equipped for the job, but it appears that's all they'll put there name on to run it. I mean, if an 8100 why not a i5 6570? :D Just for those that enjoy suffering :D
 
SteveGrabowski

SteveGrabowski

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blckgrffn said:
The amount of graphics muscle is almost the same, close enough for hand grenades anyway.

It says it uses Shader Model 6.6 as a baseline, I don't know what that means exactly but it might also be the, oh I forget, the Primitive/Mesh Shaders bit too.
Click to expand...
Ugh I just read FFVII Rebirth uses nearest neighbor upscaling in performance mode on base PS5 JFC. Between the RX 6700 XT being 15% faster than the RX 6700 that closely matches the PS5 gpu, me being willing to target a 17% lower framerate (50 fps) on PC thanks to FreeSync, and forcing RSR upscaling maybe there is hope of it being better on PC? Can't believe they're just using nearest neighbor. Guessing there will be no FSR since they never put it in the base PS5 version. Of course I say this as someone who bought the game at launch on PS5 and still has it sitting on the system, installed and never played. :tearsofjoy:
 
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DAPUNISHER

DAPUNISHER

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blckgrffn said:
I think the 1400 and the 8100 are both ill equipped for the job, but it appears that's all they'll put there name on to run it. I mean, if an 8100 why not a i5 6570? :D Just for those that enjoy suffering :D
Click to expand...
Sometimes extra threads are more important than better single thread performance. Testing an FX 8350 and Ryzen 3200 in Witcher 3 Novigrad during a busy time of day around the market and docks, the FX provided smooth frame pacing when the 3200 had notable drops in a few spots. 1400 has SMT which might make the 30fps a playable 30 as opposed to a quad core. Nit picking aside: Fully agree no one should be playing on either, and you can find faster Ryzens for pocket change to replace that OG 4/8.
 
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SteveGrabowski

SteveGrabowski

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DAPUNISHER said:
Sometimes extra threads are more important than better single thread performance. Testing an FX 8350 and Ryzen 3200 in Witcher 3 Novigrad during a busy time of day around the market and docks, the FX provided smooth frame pacing when the 3200 had notable drops in a few spots. 1400 has SMT which might make the 30fps a playable 30 as opposed to a quad core. Nit picking aside: Fully agree no one should be playing on either, and you can find faster Ryzens for pocket change to replace that OG 4/8.
Click to expand...
The extra threads on my 4C/8T Xeon E3-1231v3 really came through in the clutch last half of last console gen where I saw people with 4C/4T i5-4690k OC'ed balls to the wall complaining about not hitting 60 fps in games that ran great for me. Figured they would since parallelizing across 8 threads was critical last gen with how weak the IPC of the (effectively) octacore Jaguar cores in the consoles was.
 
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