7970x2 v 680x2

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BrightCandle

BrightCandle

Diamond Member
Mar 15, 2007
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On January 6th I bought a pair of 7970's to replace my aging 5970. After lots of problems today I finally got up and running with a pair of 680 GTXs that are watercooled.

1) Windows experience - basic Aero
7970
=====
- I would get Windows lag of 300ms or so
- Windows tearing as they were moved
- Tearing on the Display port monitor most of the time
- Windows transparency on was unusable slow
- Poor frame rate in general in Windows (sub 20)

680
====
Run flawless out of the box. Power saving is working nicely.

2) 3 monitor setup
7970
====
- Requires e two profiles, the separate monitor one so that windows is usable (maximise to a single monitor) and an eyefinity mode for games.

680
====
- Come with a surround mode that seems to work much better in Windows with maximising to a single window.
- So far has allowed games to either run on the centre monitor or across all 3 simply with the correct setting of the resolution.

2) Benchmarks
Heaven
7970
====
- Microstutters really badly, its bad enough to induce a feeling of motion sickness within seconds.
- While the frame rate is showing excellent the visual effect is unplayable.

680
===
- Hiccup early on in the benchmark
- Smooth as silk in all other circumstances, no microsttuter.
The 680's run smooth as silk and at higher frame rates

3D mark 11
7970
====
- Noticeable but not severe microstutter almost continuously for the under water tests and noticeable in Aztec as well.

680
====
- No microstutter.

I am moving on to testing games but so far the 680's are a massive improvement. Windows 2D mode working is a huge gain but I am noticing that even relatively low frame rates (30ish) are more than playable in SLI where in Crossfire the 7970's with anything less than 60 was unplayable and vsync was essential. The 680's just work.

I am horrified that the reviewers haven't made more noise about the incredible difference between the two technologies, SLI is worlds ahead in terms of playable consistent frame times.
 
T_Yamamoto

T_Yamamoto

Lifer
Jul 6, 2011
15,007
795
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blackened23 said:
You should start a blog or something, every time I see a post from you its an overly dramatic wall of text. Its like you enjoy hearing yourself talk (or type in this case)
Click to expand...
his information is helpful and indepth. which is nice
 
F

Ferzerp

Diamond Member
Oct 12, 1999
6,438
107
106
That seems to be in line with what most of the reviewers found comparing multi-gpu setups. Even when the 680s lost in measured FPS, the 7970s had more microstutter issues making the 680s more preferable.
 
Plimogz

Plimogz

Senior member
Oct 3, 2009
678
0
71
@Blackened23

A person posts a detailed and informative post about their personal experience with two very high-end GPU setups in the Video Cards and Graphics section. And you manage to find fault with that?

Maybe you're the one who should confine their opinion to a blog.
 
B

blackened23

Diamond Member
Jul 26, 2011
8,548
2
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Nah there's no fault with it, I feel like i've seen it 50 times now though all in wall of text format.
 
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Via

Diamond Member
Jan 14, 2009
4,670
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What I still don't get is why he spent so much money on two 7970s after having such a miserable experience with his 5970.

If I hated a card as much as he hated his 5970 I would never buy from that manufacturer again.
 
B

boxleitnerb

Platinum Member
Nov 1, 2011
2,605
6
81
Interesting, this gives more credibility to the findings of other sites regarding microstutter. If it's not too much work (with opening your loop and whatnot), please test some games. Especially very demanding ones, that don't runt at 60-100+fps.
 
Jacky60

Jacky60

Golden Member
Jan 3, 2010
1,123
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0
Thanks for that OP very interesting. :thumbsup: Please test Arma 2 in eyefinity and surround as I want to go 3 monitor very soon and will be upgrading GPU's in the near future.
 
BD231

BD231

Lifer
Feb 26, 2001
10,568
138
106
Cross-Fire is a broken technology and AMD clearly has no idea how to fix it. Its a shame they're allowed to market it as useable.
 
F

Final8ty

Golden Member
Jun 13, 2007
1,172
13
81
BD231 said:
Cross-Fire is a broken technology and AMD clearly has no idea how to fix it. Its a shame they're allowed to market it as useable.
Click to expand...

2x1900xt CF
2x3870CF 3x3870CF 4x3870CF
2x5970.

If it was constantly broken then i would have not of kept using it, it works most of the time just fine for me.

As far as the 7xxx it clearly still needs work on the drivers + Eyefinity scaling with CF.
 
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BrightCandle

BrightCandle

Diamond Member
Mar 15, 2007
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76
Jacky60 said:
Thanks for that OP very interesting. :thumbsup: Please test Arma 2 in eyefinity and surround as I want to go 3 monitor very soon and will be upgrading GPU's in the near future.
Click to expand...

I tested Arma 2 last night in surround 5760x1200. I think the game is mostly CPU limited so I wasn't expecting a big change.

7970
====
- Was always happy down to about 45 fps, below that it did stutter but not like other games.
- Used to see 30-50% GPU load, so in theory the second card wasn't helping. In practice that second card makes a world of difference and GPU load on single cards was also lower than 100%.

680
===
- Ran the game initially on the same settings (mostly high) and saw a very consistent 57 fps, which was lower than the 7970's 70 ish.
- It was smoother, like a normal FPS with quick movement. I always felt that the A2 engine was a bit sluggish and the world moved a bit slower, it doesn't it was the 7970's.
- Happy down to about 45 FPS again.
- Can maintain much higher settings than with the 7970's without impacting frame rate at all.
- AA still too much of a hit in any form (FXAA, MLAA, MSAA or SSAA).
- The right mouse zoom in doesn't judder at all which is a massive improvement. I see no frame rate drop on zoom in.

All in all 680 is vastly better in Arma 2, despite the average frame rate initially appearing to be lower. The game is very heavy on the system and I am now more or less on the very highest settings, something I could never achieve on the 7970's smoothly.
 
BrightCandle

BrightCandle

Diamond Member
Mar 15, 2007
4,762
0
76
Via said:
What I still don't get is why he spent so much money on two 7970s after having such a miserable experience with his 5970.

If I hated a card as much as he hated his 5970 I would never buy from that manufacturer again.
Click to expand...

Alas I look at the same reviews as you do and determined that a pair of 7970's would be vastly faster than the 5970. I assumed my problem with the 5970 was a lack of performance due to the 1GB of VRAM and not something fundamentally broken in their technology.

In hindsight the problem was always crossfire microstutter not a lack of VRAM as I and many others advised me it was. It started at some point in the 4870X2 time period, it was present sometimes on the 5970 initially but then it got worse over time. I switched to the 7970's and it didn't improve with the extra performance on offer which is when I noticed there was a genuine AMD problem. I changed card because of the Aero problems, that was just unacceptable. The difference in games was unexpected but greatly appreciated!

I think crossfire can be fixed, because its introduction seems to be driver related. The 7970's might be broken at a hardware level, I have never seen them run well, but at least initially the 4870X2 and 5970 worked.

Few reviewers have made it really clear that the AMD solution is that bad in comparison, its night and day different. Having seen these 680s in action now I want to tell every crossfire user to sell their cards and get NVidia instead because honestly they aren't competing in the same league.
 
B

boxleitnerb

Platinum Member
Nov 1, 2011
2,605
6
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Final8ty said:
I Vsync all my games and CPU limited.
Click to expand...

Do you have some games where you drop below 60? In Eyefinity, perhaps? In my experience, VSync only reduces microstutter at 60fps or above. And even then, the result might not be completely even. I've heard of people complaining that even 100fps with CF don't feel "right". And if you're CPU limited, there is no microstutter anyway.
 
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Final8ty

Golden Member
Jun 13, 2007
1,172
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boxleitnerb said:
Do you have some games where you drop below 60? In Eyefinity, perhaps? In my experience, VSync only reduces microstutter at 60fps or above. And even then, the result might not be completely even. I've heard of people complaining that even 100fps with CF don't feel "right". And if you're CPU limited, there is no microstutter anyway.
Click to expand...

I don't run Eyefinity.
 
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Final8ty

Golden Member
Jun 13, 2007
1,172
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I have tested BF3 without Vsync when it first came out and there was allot of Micro stuttering, but there has been allot of driver updates since then plus patching and in game RenderDevice.ForceRenderAheadLimit 0
RenderDevice.TripleBufferingEnable 0 , haven't played it in ages, i think it was just before back to karkand when i last played.

I have experienced over the years micro stuttering in CODMW 2x3870 early drivers ,BFBC2 5970 early drivers, no quadfire and Vsync not working.
 
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Final8ty

Golden Member
Jun 13, 2007
1,172
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81
BrightCandle said:
I tried these so called magic drivers before changing cards. Didn't notice any particular difference myself. Certainly Aero wasn't fixed and Diablo 3 was still stuttering despite decent frame rates.
Click to expand...

Well everyone's setup is different.

I just googled "Diablo 3 stuttering" seems to be an issue for both NV and AMD depending on the individual setup.
 
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boxleitnerb

Platinum Member
Nov 1, 2011
2,605
6
81
No, frametimes in SLI are significantly better. Both are not perfect because both are AFR, but from what I read and hear from my friend who had several SLI and CF setups, SLI is clearly superior in terms of perceived smoothness.
 
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