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6800 VPE fiasco covered by Maximum PC

carage

Senior member
I don't know how to start this, it seems the third thread is also locked now.
Let's make one thing clear, I have no intention of starting another thread full of flames and hatred or whatever is going on between some users.
If you feel you are unaffected or couldn't care less about the issue, please spend your time elsewhere and stop insulting those who do. This thread is intended for those who DO care about the issue and anything that might contribute to a desirable outcome.
Let's be frank, the Maximum PC article is kind of old because they printed the stuff at least a month ago, and doesn't really offer anything we don't know or has been proven false by new statements or experiment. However, getting media coverage is still a step in the right direction.

The article can be found on Maximum PC January 2005, P.26~27 Watch Dog
I will type the following article verbatim, and no, I didn't write to the magazine.
So kudos to the man who did.

[Is My 6800 Only Good For Gaming?

Dear Dog: There seems to be quite a bit of noise on various message boards claiming that the video features on the nVidia 6800 GPUs don't work. To quote nVidia's website: "Another important factor is is that the GeForce 6 series GPU are completely programmable and can handle formats such as WMV9 and MPEG-4. The nVidia motion compensation engine can provide decompression acceleration for a variety of video formats including WMV9, MPEG-4, H.264, and DivX. As with motion compensation with MPEG-2, the nVidia video engine can perform most of the computation intensive work, leaving the easiest work for the CPU."

This testimony was a major factor in my decision to buy a 6800-series card. But now everyone is saying the card cannot do what the company said it could. Am I, along with many others, stuck with just a great gaming card? If anyone can get to the bottom of this, it must be you. Thank you in advance.
--Jonathan Hayton

The Dog Responds: The Dog contacted an nVidia spokesman who cleared up the confusion over this issue. He said the 6800 does indeed include the advanced video support that's touted on the web site, but consumers must download a newer set of drivers that was made available at the end of November.

According to the spokesman: "nVidia is also working with application vendors to take advantage of the programmable encode features of of the GeForce 6800 and 6600. Just like programmable pixel shaders when they were first introduced, this requires additional collaboration with application vendors. The first application to support its GPU encode capabilities is Windows Media Center Edition 2005."

"You only need nVidia's decoder if you want the advanced post-processing features (i.e. motion adaptive de-interlacing and inverse 3:2 pulldown), in addition to hardware MPEG-2 decode."

"For MPEG-2 decode only, any application built on DirectShow can take advantage of the hardware decode in the 6800 and 6600 as long as they access the hardware through DirectX Video Acceleration. WinDVD, for example, can take advantage of nVidia's hardware decode."

There is one difference on between the 6800 and the newer 6600 core, though; and that's how the two cards handle Windows Media Video 9 hardware acceleration. nVidia says the 6600 does more offloading when playing WMV9 content than the 6800 is capable of, but the 6800 does do some acceleration. ]
 
Also it would be helpful if we start working together to compile a FAQ list like some suggested, starting with what we already know, what we might know, and what we don't know.
Although with some of the contradicting information it would be pretty hard to even start answering some of the basic questions like Does it work?
Besides, sometimes it is the questions we don't know that we don't know that are tripping us up.
Care to think of any?

 
That means that Nvidia didn't flat out LIE did they? They said that it "does do some acceleration". They just made it sound like it would to full acceleration, when it obviously dosn't.
So we know that:
1. The video processor DOES work
2. It does half-assed WM9 acceleration
 
Let's see how far this goes, as long as everyone is staying calm.
The problem is what is "some acceleration"?
It would be more helpful and tell us exactly which features of WMV9 it does not support rather than using ambiguous lanaguage. It is was in a chart form comparing it with 6600 and 6200 series, it would be even more helpful.

 
Let's keep it clean this time guys.
I personally am waiting for the touted WMP update and a free nV decoder. Slap those on there along with the "PureVideo" enabled drivers and we'll have a comprehensive test of how much nV screwed up.
 
Can someone explain to me why reviewers don't just test it and tell us about it?

Or, direct me to where a reviewer has done this?

I think it's past time to be relying on Nvidia to give us info.
 
Theres a rumor that 71.25 is purevideo enabled...can anyone confirm this? i'm going to see if i still have the SiL trailer around here anywhere and give it a shot...

edit: i just checked, that was 67.66 that was supposed to enable purevideo. not sure on 71.25
edit: no go on 71.25, 100% cpu usage and slideshow...that is in WMP though, didn't try it with anything else.
 
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
Can someone explain to me why reviewers don't just test it and tell us about it?

Or, direct me to where a reviewer has done this?

I think it's past time to be relying on Nvidia to give us info.

Oh I agree. We can't believe that wacky chart on nVidia's website where they admit some of the features don't work on 6800s! It was much to their advantage to post that and anger everyone who cares about this issue.

We need to find info from sources like "The Dog" because they know much better than nVidia how nVidia's products and drivers work.
 
Sigh...I smell sarcasm here. There it goes again.
It is certainly unlikely that any outsider will know better about some product than the producers of the product, however when the company believes it is more advantageous to perform a cover up, consumers may require knowledgable and reputable third parties with the resources to help uncover the underlying truth.
 
Good luck trying to keep this topic unlocked. The Nvidia fans will soon verbally attack anybody who posts anything negative about Nvidia in an attempt to turn it into nothing but a flamefest, at which point the Mods will lock it.


Why the Mods don't do anything about the thread-crappers before it gets to that point is beyond me. This is obviously a topic of interest in the Video Forums and could actually be useful if not for the overly vocal minority.
 
Rollo, we already know good and well that you don't care about this issue.

What is your point?

What is wrong with wanting a comparison of cards from ATI and NV to see who does what best regarding this video decoding stuff? How else can we make an informed decision if reviewers don't make comparisons?

How is this any different from comparing cards in all the other ways they are compared?

NV might be embarrassed on the high end, but they might shine with the mid and low end cards, and most people buy the latter two.
 
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
Rollo, we already know good and well that you don't care about this issue.

What is your point?

What is wrong with wanting a comparison of cards from ATI and NV to see who does what best regarding this video decoding stuff? How else can we make an informed decision if reviewers don't make comparisons?

How is this any different from comparing cards in all the other ways they are compared?

NV might be embarrassed on the high end, but they might shine with the mid and low end cards, and most people buy the latter two.

I would rather keep ATi out of this as it complicates the issue with the potential of diving into more fanboy flames.
I see the problems focusing on this whole NV40 deficiency would be better limited to discussing:
1. What do we expect or want nVidia to do?
2. What has nVidia done up to this point?
3. What we should do if there is such a large discrepancy between what we expect and what we get in respond?
 
LTC8K6, I agree. I'm pretty ill informed on all the new features so I'd like to see some detailed reviews. I'd like to see just what impact the hardware acceleration has in comparison to unaccelerated performance. From there I'll see if the feature set is worth giving a crap about in my buying decision.
 
Yeah Rollo is the problem

Thats why they've banned Rollo, instead of lock the threads.

Morons.

You will never give up will you guys.

There is nothing to see here, PVP doesnt work. Move on with your lives, or email Nvidia.

Get on their forums, waste THEIR bandwidth, not Anands.

What a bunch of jerks.
 
Originally posted by: carage
Sigh...I smell sarcasm here. There it goes again.
It is certainly unlikely that any outsider will know better about some product than the producers of the product, however when the company believes it is more advantageous to perform a cover up, consumers may require knowledgable and reputable third parties with the resources to help uncover the underlying truth.

That's the whole point Carage- it wasn't advantageous for nVidia to post those features don't work. You don't have much reason to lie if you gain nothing, so why do we need the third parties again?
 
Originally posted by: housecat
Yeah Rollo is the problem

Thats why they've banned Rollo, instead of lock the threads.

Morons.

You will never give up will you guys.

There is nothing to see here, PVP doesnt work. Move on with your lives, or email Nvidia.

Get on their forums, waste THEIR bandwidth, not Anands.

What a bunch of jerks.

They banned Rollo??!!! Nooooooooooooooooo!

😉
 
Originally posted by: Rollo
Originally posted by: housecat
Yeah Rollo is the problem

Thats why they've banned Rollo, instead of lock the threads.

Morons.

You will never give up will you guys.

There is nothing to see here, PVP doesnt work. Move on with your lives, or email Nvidia.

Get on their forums, waste THEIR bandwidth, not Anands.

What a bunch of jerks.

They banned Rollo??!!! Nooooooooooooooooo!

😉

lol

I really hope people aren't expecting any kind of reimbursement because its not going to happen.
And, I may be behind here...but how do people know weather ANY card supports WM9 acceleration if MS hasn't even updated the DLL for it to work yet!?!
 
Originally posted by: LTC8K6
Rollo, we already know good and well that you don't care about this issue.

What is your point?

The point of my initial response to you was that I thought your suggestion to rely on 3rd party info over what nVidia has posted on this subject doesn't make sense to me. As I think we can all agree nVidia had nothing gain by posting some the video features don't work on some of their cards, why would we need to
I think it's past time to be relying on Nvidia to give us info.
? Do you think nVidia has posted false information about their products to keep you from using these features and anger you? When someone tells you something you don't want to hear, that they gain nothing from, it's usually the truth?


What is wrong with wanting a comparison of cards from ATI and NV to see who does what best regarding this video decoding stuff? How else can we make an informed decision if reviewers don't make comparisons?

Nothing is wrong with that at all.

How is this any different from comparing cards in all the other ways they are compared?
It's not?

NV might be embarrassed on the high end, but they might shine with the mid and low end cards, and most people buy the latter two.
I don't think nVidia will be embarassed by their high end, I think you'll just see it offers similar functionality for the video features as ATIs high end, and that nVidia's low - middle range has more features.

I could be wrong on this, but would love to see a comparison. As a X800 XT PE owner, a 6800NU owner, and a person just starting out on the whole video area, I welcome all info.

 
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