5th Circuit Upholds Texas Abortion Regulations

[Mursilis]

Admitting that the justices are liars; that this has nothing to do with women's health but is an unconstitutional promotion of religion.

"Lying for Jesus." It's the conservative way.

Nothing says "I'm intellectually dishonest!" like insisting abortion is only a religious issue.

 

[TerryMathews]

Yep! But then again, I'm not a sheep and I'm capable of thinking for myself and I don't fall for propaganda. So your world and frame of mind is foreign to me.

I just don't understand stupid, where as you on the other hand, not only understand it, you live and breath it!

So yeah! I guess we do agree on something!

Aww, looks like I touched a nerve sweetheart.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Based to what some lawyers were saying on the local news I don't foresee this law being overturned by the SCOTUS. The lawyers explained that Texas has the right to regulate all medical facilities in the state including requiring abortion clinics to adhere to the same standards required for ambulatory facilities.

 

[fskimospy]

Based to what some lawyers were saying on the local news I don't foresee this law being overturned by the SCOTUS. The lawyers explained that Texas has the right to regulate all medical facilities in the state including requiring abortion clinics to adhere to the same standards required for ambulatory facilities.

I wonder. At some point these laws become so restrictive that they become de facto bans on abortion. A de facto ban on abortion is obviously unconstitutional, even if it takes place as part of a larger regulation on medical facilities. I guess it all depends on where SCOTUS decides to say enough is enough.

 

[thraashman]

Just a reminder as to why Texas is on the list of states I will not set foot in nor intentionally allow my money to go to. Arizona, Texas, Kansas, and Tennessee with Florida edging closer to being put on the list every month.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

I wonder. At some point these laws become so restrictive that they become de facto bans on abortion. A de facto ban on abortion is obviously unconstitutional, even if it takes place as part of a larger regulation on medical facilities. I guess it all depends on where SCOTUS decides to say enough is enough.

Most of the abortion clinics in Texas met/meets the standards. Several in Houston are still open.

 

[Retro Rob]

No one is debating that. What we are debating is that an embryo is not a child and that an embryo has no rights. If the rights of an embryo outweighed the rights of the parents, involuntary miscarriages would be tried as manslaughter.

You're a male, which means your opinion on whether or not a woman's unborn has rights is immaterial.

Ask your mother how she would have felt if some guy told her you had no rights and are nothing more than a "clump of cells", subject to incineration just as much as last week's leftover spaghetti.

 

[fskimospy]

Most of the abortion clinics in Texas met/meets the standards. Several in Houston are still open.

From what Reuters says there will be exactly six clinics that can meet the standard for the entire state of Texas, and none outside of the large cities.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/03/27/us-usa-abortion-texas-idUSBREA2Q1AA20140327

The good news is that at least Planned Parenthood is moving in to add more surgical centers so that we can open more abortion clinics.

It's interesting to watch the supporters of this law argue that they are doing it to protect the health of women. I know why they say that from a legal standpoint as they open the law to great danger if they say their actual reasoning, but we all know the reason for enacting that provision is to limit access to abortion. I find it odd that the people who claim to be acting on the side of morality are acting so deceitfully.

 

[fskimospy]

You're a male, which means your opinion on whether or not a woman's unborn has rights is immaterial.

Ask your mother how she would have felt if some guy told her you had no rights and are nothing more than a "clump of cells", subject to incineration just as much as last week's leftover spaghetti.

Nobody actually views an embryo to be the same as a child. Anyone who says that is either lying to you or lying to themselves. It's a transparently silly position to hold.

 

[Retro Rob]

Nobody actually views an embryo to be the same as a child. Anyone who says that is either lying to you or lying to themselves. It's a transparently silly position to hold.

An embryo to a child is as a seed is to a tree. One directly leads to the other. Killing one would assuredly kill the other. That's just how I see it.

 

[fskimospy]

An embryo to a child is as a seed is to a tree. One directly leads to the other. Killing one would assuredly kill the other. That's just how I see it.

And we both know a seed and a tree aren't the same thing. So I assume you agree that an embryo is not human life the same as a child.

 

[Retro Rob]

And we both know a seed and a tree aren't the same thing. So I assume you agree that an embryo is not human life the same as a child.

I didn't say an embryo is the same as child, but you're still terminating a growing human.

For example, I look at it as deliberately cutting off my food source (embryo) which directly leads to my death (child). Not exactly the same thing, but I suspect you get my point.

 

[fskimospy]

I didn't say an embryo is the same as child, but you're still terminating a growing human.

For example, I look at it as deliberately cutting off my food source (embryo) which directly leads to my death (child). Not exactly the same thing, but I suspect you get my point.

That's all well and good, my point is that embryos don't have the same rights as children because they aren't children.

 

[glenn1]

Based to what some lawyers were saying on the local news I don't foresee this law being overturned by the SCOTUS. The lawyers explained that Texas has the right to regulate all medical facilities in the state including requiring abortion clinics to adhere to the same standards required for ambulatory facilities.

This goes into the "extremely stupid but constitutional law" category for me, just like many of the features of Obamacare. Just because you're able to pass a law like this to meet your ideological preferences doesn't mean you should. A lot of the time it seems like the intent is more to troll the political opposition than because the drafters truly think it's a good idea.

 

[TerryMathews]

From what Reuters says there will be exactly six clinics that can meet the standard for the entire state of Texas, and none outside of the large cities.

Don't you mean choose to meet? 100% could meet the higher standard.

While we are on the subject though, since you so strongly believe this do you also believe that California's microstamping law should also be unconstitutional? After all it is a impediment to lawful gun ownership.

 

[Retro Rob]

That's all well and good, my point is that embryos don't have the same rights as children because they aren't children.

Since we can't even agree on what a life is, a man doesn't have the right to tell me what is/isn't a life, if I am a woman.

 

[fskimospy]

Don't you mean choose to meet? 100% could meet the higher standard.

While we are on the subject though, since you so strongly believe this do you also believe that California's microstamping law should also be unconstitutional? After all it is a impediment to lawful gun ownership.

Can you explain how 100% of Texas abortion clinics could meet the higher standard?

No gun tangents.

 

[fskimospy]

Since we can't even agree on what a life is, a man doesn't have the right to tell me what is/isn't a life, if I am a woman.

You are welcome to call whatever you want a life.

It doesn't change the fact that embryos are not children and will not be treated the same as children under the law, including what rights they are afforded.

 

[Retro Rob]

You are welcome to call whatever you want a life.

It doesn't change the fact that embryos are not children and will not be treated the same as children under the law, including what rights they are afforded.

Both libs and conservatards need to stop trying to fucking regulate what a woman defines as a life.

My wife wants children, and she'd be dammed if some legislators tell her what she can assign rights to life to as far as her pregnancy goes.

Stay out of women's decisions. 🙄

 

[glenn1]

Can you explain how 100% of Texas abortion clinics could meet the higher standard?

No gun tangents.

Construction to retrofit the facilities and gain admitting privileges to a hospital seems like how.

Besides, progressives don't have a leg to stand on complaining about regulation since your bread and butter for years has been regulating the shit out of businesses you don't like without any heed to expense or difficulty involved.

 

[fskimospy]

Both libs and conservatards need to stop trying to fucking regulate what a woman defines as a life.

My wife wants children, and she'd be dammed if some legislators tell her what she can assign rights to life to as far as her pregnancy goes.

Stay out of women's decisions. 🙄

No one is trying to regulate what your wife defines as life. We are trying to regulate what we all define as life collectively because it has major legal implications for society as a whole. Your wife is free to accept or reject those definitions personally, but she clearly has no right or power to make us accept her definition.

An embryo doesn't gain or lose rights based on what each individual mom of that embryo decides for it. That would be transparently insane.

 

[fskimospy]

Construction to retrofit the facilities and gain admitting privileges to a hospital seems like how.

Every clinic has to be within 30 miles of a hospital, which is forcing the closure of several in rural areas. If you are suggesting that they can comply by simply closing the current clinic and opening one closer to a hospital you missed the point.

Besides, progressives don't have a leg to stand on complaining about regulation since your bread and butter for years has been regulating the shit out of businesses you don't like without any heed to expense or difficulty involved.

Of course we can complain about those regulations, don't be silly. There are good regulations and bad regulations.

 

[TerryMathews]

Can you explain how 100% of Texas abortion clinics could meet the higher standard?

No gun tangents.

Simple. They require the appropriate personnel in their employ to meet the requirements of the law or they replace them with staff members who will.

No different than new regulations in any other field.

And we both know why you won't follow that analogy: it exposes your usual intellectual dishonesty and hypocrisy.

 

[fskimospy]

Simple. They require the appropriate personnel in their employ to meet the requirements of the law or they replace them with staff members who will.

No different than new regulations in any other field.

Interesting. Can you explain to me what staff changes they can employ that will teleport their clinic to within 30 miles of a hospital? Do they just have to hire someone really fat so that their girth extends close enough to make them within 30 miles of a hospital?

Let me guess, you had no idea what these regulations actually said.

And we both know why you won't follow that analogy: it exposes your usual intellectual dishonesty and hypocrisy.

Of course not. You were trying to create a straw man by saying that any regulations on an activity were impermissible, which was ridiculous. I'm sorry to hear that you have such a low opinion of my intellectual credentials though, Mr. Hannity.

 

[Retro Rob]

No one is trying to regulate what your wife defines as life. We are trying to regulate what we all define as life collectively because it has major legal implications for society as a whole. Your wife is free to accept or reject those definitions personally, but she clearly has no right or power to make us accept her definition.

An embryo doesn't gain or lose rights based on what each individual mom of that embryo decides for it. That would be transparently insane.

Sorry about the F-bomb, but good God, it sure in heck pisses me off when we start telling people what's legally OK for them to do with their own bodies as far as abortion is concerned, and fwiw, I am not pro-choice...I am pro-"allowing people to do as they wish with their bodies without my interference".

Heck, as far as my personal religious beliefs are concerned, while I believe God opposes abortion, he isn't forcing you to keep your unborn.

No way should a legal system determine that for you if God isn't doing it.