5775c better gaming CPU than 6700k?

[maddogmcgee]

I was watching a Techreport discussion that made me start thinking about this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PpbZmX_dwo&t=53m10s

All of their benchmarks showed the 5775c being faster than a 6700k. Project Cars (which I will refuse to play anyway because of Gameworks ) seems to show a massive increase while other games show slower ones.

http://techreport.com/review/28751/intel-core-i7-6700k-skylake-processor-reviewed/6

http://www.maximumpc.com/intel-broadwell-dt-core-i7-5775c-review/

This seems to be the case when both are overclocked (5775c at lower overclocks manages to beat the Skylake).

So my question, should people be buying the Broadwell rather than the Skylake if they are building a gaming PC?

 

[Soulkeeper]

I suspect 5775c will always be harder to find and more expensive than the 6700k.
I'd personally rather have a 5775c but there are many factors to consider.

 

[CHADBOGA]

Would like to see Skylake with faster DDR4, matched against Broadwell with its large L4.

 

[TechFan1]

It may especially be better if future games make use of the DX12 multiadapter.

 

[LTC8K6]

I was watching a Techreport discussion that made me start thinking about this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PpbZmX_dwo&t=53m10s

All of their benchmarks showed the 5775c being faster than a 6700k. Project Cars (which I will refuse to play anyway because of Gameworks ) seems to show a massive increase while other games show slower ones.

http://techreport.com/review/28751/intel-core-i7-6700k-skylake-processor-reviewed/6

http://www.maximumpc.com/intel-broadwell-dt-core-i7-5775c-review/

This seems to be the case when both are overclocked (5775c at lower overclocks manages to beat the Skylake).

So my question, should people be buying the Broadwell rather than the Skylake if they are building a gaming PC?

Well, the 5775C obviously has a much faster IGP. That's no secret. If you are referencing the IGP, then the 5775C will kill the 6700K. Otherwise, the 6700K will be the faster chip overall.

 

[maddogmcgee]

Well, the 5775C obviously has a much faster IGP. That's no secret. If you are referencing the IGP, then the 5775C will kill the 6700K. Otherwise, the 6700K will be the faster chip overall.

Even though the 5775c is beating it in most gaming benchmarks at the moment?

 

[LTC8K6]

Even though the 5775c is beating it in most gaming benchmarks at the moment?

5775C has the 128mb edram L4 cache, which does help a little in some games using a dgpu. I don't think the difference is significant, though. I doubt I can tell the difference in gaming between any of the higher end intel chips.

If your focus is on gaming, and on keeping your 1150 board, then you should probably consider Broadwell.

Otherwise, the 4790K and 6700K are better overall, imo, than the 5775C.

http://techreport.com/review/28751/intel-core-i7-6700k-skylake-processor-reviewed/10
http://techreport.com/review/28751/intel-core-i7-6700k-skylake-processor-reviewed/11

Price is an individual decision as to value for money.

 

[LTC8K6]

Also pay attention to the memory used by the reviewer with gaming benches. That should be factored in when building a new system.

 

[lehtv]

Also pay attention to the memory used by the reviewer with gaming benches. That should be factored in when building a new system.

This is not representative of any sort of average difference you might find when comparing DDR4 speeds. This is an extreme example. And as far as I know this result has not been duplicated by anyone yet.

 

[LTC8K6]

This is not representative of any sort of average difference you might find when comparing DDR4 speeds. This is an extreme example. And as far as I know this result has not been duplicated by anyone yet.

Check out the Skylake thread.

Skylake seems to do much better with faster ddr4, but we certainly need a review or three focusing on memory speeds.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?p=37614437#post37614437

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=37610721&postcount=2970

 

[ShintaiDK]

6700K will be faster when the computational work is at hand.

While 5775C will be overall better at more memory intense work. Assuming the 6700K isnt paired with very fast DDR4.

But its a very interesting situation. Since the 5775C is also 65W.

Cant wait for the Skylake C model to see how it performs. It may have 2x128MB btw.

Its a bit of the Haswell-E situation that lives on heavily by quad channel and huge 15-20MB caches.

 

[Fjodor2001]

Cant wait for the Skylake C model to see how it performs. It may have 2x128MB btw.

I must have missed that. Just curious, where did you read it may be 2x128 MB?

Also, I wonder why Intel would decide to increase the size of the eDRAM. Here is what Intel said about it when Crystalwell was released:

There’s only a single size of eDRAM offered this generation: 128MB. Since it’s a cache and not a buffer (and a giant one at that), Intel found that hit rate rarely dropped below 95%. It turns out that for current workloads, Intel didn’t see much benefit beyond a 32MB eDRAM however it wanted the design to be future proof. Intel doubled the size to deal with any increases in game complexity, and doubled it again just to be sure.

So even 32 MB would be sufficient, and 128 MB was overkill. Why would they want to increase it to 2x128 MB now? The workloads may have changed, but I doubt it is that much.

 

[know of fence]

[deleted]

 

[ShintaiDK]

So even 32 MB would be sufficient, and 128 MB was overkill. Why would they want to increase it to 2x128 MB now? The workloads may have changed, but I doubt it is that much.

Who says its about size? Is twice the size the only benefit of using 2xDIMMs vs 1xDIMM of equal size?

But even then, IGP is one thing. CPU is another as seen with the C models and Xeons. Unless you somehow believe IGP usage became big thing in the single socket Xeon line.

 

[Fjodor2001]

Who says its about size? Is twice the size the only benefit of using 2xDIMMs vs 1xDIMM of equal size?

If that was the case they could just as well make it 2x64MB instead of 1x128MB. No need to step up to 2x128 MB if the size does not improve performance much anyway.

But even then, IGP is one thing. CPU is another as seen with the C models and Xeons. Unless you somehow believe IGP usage became big thing in the single socket Xeon line.

Intel's calculations are for both iGPU and CPU usage as I understand it. So not specific to iGPU usage.

Finally, did you have any source for the 2x128 MB eDRAM in Skylake C? Or were you just guessing?

 

[ShintaiDK]

If that was the case they could just as well make it 2x64MB instead of 1x128MB. No need to step up to 2x128 MB if the size does not improve performance much anyway.

Intel's calculations are for both iGPU and CPU usage as I understand it. So not specific to iGPU usage.

Finally, did you have any source for the 2x128 MB eDRAM in Skylake C? Or were you just guessing?

When you only make 128MB modules....
Also size will improve the CPU part. And no, intel only gave data for the IGP part.

Yes, Kaby Lake rumours for H models that comes next year. Same time as the new C models.

 

[Fjodor2001]

When you only make 128MB modules....

Not set in stone. They could just as well change to only making 64 MB modules, and have 2x64MB instead of 1x128MB. No big deal really. And that would be cheaper, if the added size of 2x128MB is just waste anyway since it doesn't improve performance.

Also size will improve the CPU part. And no, intel only gave data for the IGP part.

What in the article leads you to believe that? From what I can tell it's a general memory bandwidth benchmark. The eDRAM actually works as a memory cache...

Yes, Kaby Lake rumours for H models that comes next year. Same time as the new C models.

You mean this? Doesn't say anything about that the C model will get 2x128 MB though, only H model. So the part that the C model will get it is only speculation from your side then?

 

[ShintaiDK]

Funny you talk about others speculating, when all you do yourself is to speculate.

And unreleased products will always be speculation.

CPU worksets are not like graphics worksets....

 

[Fjodor2001]

Funny you talk about others speculating, when all you do yourself is to speculate.

The difference is that when I don't have a source for something, I write "I think" or similar to indicate that. But you just always state everything as facts, regardless if you have a source for it or if you are speculating. That's kind of bad practice actually, since when reading your comments one never knows how much faith to put in it.

And unreleased products will always be speculation.

Sure, but as I understand it in this case we don't even have a leak indicating that Skylake C will have 2x128 MB eDRAM. It's just pure guessing by you.

CPU worksets are not like graphics worksets....

Of course, but where did the article say Intel only used graphic worksets when performing the testing?

 

[ShintaiDK]

Where did I state it as fact? I wrote it may have.

Again, this is pointless with you since you already got a fixed agenda.

If you want to keep this a personal issue and hunt outside your hate to Intel. Take it to a PM with me and I will answer you there so this thread doesnt get derailed further.

 

[Fjodor2001]

Where did I state it as fact? I wrote it may have.

Yes, but that sounds like it at least comes from a leak which it doesn't, so therefore it's misleading.

If some website writes an article with the title "Broadwell C may have 10 GHz frequency and be on 3 nm" without having any source or leak for that claim, don't you think it's kind of deceiving?

 

[TeknoBug]

The i5 5675C looks tempting but it costs $400 in Canada, I can get an i7 4770 for that.

 

[know of fence]

Here's a game that AT and TR have tested, and there is also a hint of an explanation.

Skylake DDR3 is ahead of Broadwell ahead of Sklylake DDR4, even not considering the 500 MHz difference. Perhaps the lower timings of DDR3 offer some kind of edge, how does the old RAM timings vs frequency debate go, does it need to be dredged up again.
Generally video encode and winrar benefit from frequency, while USB copying is faster with lower timings.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7364/memory-scaling-on-haswell/3
Games on the other hand are all over the place.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7364/memory-scaling-on-haswell/7

There is just too much variation and too little causation. If anything filling pages with bars that show a .5 FPS difference is a waste of everyone's time. Single runs FPS avg. likely vary anywhere between 5 and 10 FPS.
At least the Techreport found a single game where there is a big difference.

Even so, in AT's tests we see the 5775C ahead half the time(!) and trading blows, wow.
None of it makes any sense what so ever.

 

[Burpo]

The i5 5675C looks tempting but it costs $400 in Canada, I can get an i7 4770 for that.

But why would you?

 

[dark zero]

For this year Broadwell is still useful, but since DX12 is here, Skylake is the future... However we might to start to see that edRAM is changing the game against Amd and Nvidia.