430w not enough for little boost on 3570k?

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andrewvoreakos

Junior Member
Aug 5, 2012
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hello, i have a corsair builder series 430w v2 psu. recently i upgraded to an i5 3570k together with a 7850.

Trying to overclock my cpu a bit using an asus p8z77-m (4,1GHz with auto tuner) and my gpu (950MHz and a memory bump on stock Voltage) i ran some random restarts and black screen freezes on my pc while playing some WoW and Civ5. Since the temps were fine (~60c on cpu the most and ~50c on gpu) i assumed that the PSU is reaching its limits. I already know that 430w isn't the sweet spot for my build but it was already available.

Now I'm thinking on upgrading a bit. I'll prop stick on the Corsairs due to the availability in my country and the good things i read all over. Im almost ready to pull the trigger on a HX650 or AX650. My first thought was about a TX550 but since the difference is 20 euros between it and the HX650 i dont think its worth it. I dont plan to CF soon since the 7850 cover my needs for gaming but even if i do, the 650w would be enough for another 7850 i guess.

The main question is if overclocking does have an impact to my current psu and if i really sound consider upgrading or something else is wrong.
Any suggestions about the wattage i need or the selection are welcome. Also does anyone knows if HX650 is also seasonic made like the AX650?
 
OILFIELDTRASH

OILFIELDTRASH

Lifer
May 13, 2009
12,333
612
126
Anandtech review of the 7850 has it consuming 289 Watts total system load while playing Metro 2033 with a i7-3960X at 4.3GHz. I doubt you're consuming more power than that with a quad core ivy bridge vs their 6 core sandy.
You more than likely have an unstable overclock and my guess is your GPU. The asus software will easily give you a 4.1 oc.
 
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andrewvoreakos

Junior Member
Aug 5, 2012
12
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still would a crash from gpu restart the pc? from the little experience i have a pc is randomly shutting down and restart with no bsod either because the psu is stuck with tons of dust (not my case) or PSU is not able to keep up. Propably not the only reasons but its the first thing that comes to my mind atleast.

Also forgot to mention that the M/B is 4 phases. must be ok for that range of overclock i guess but who knows. Seeking of some expertise tbh.
 
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andrewvoreakos

Junior Member
Aug 5, 2012
12
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Yes, both prime95 (not for long time) and intelburntest for the cpu, have a corsair h60 cooler on it, everything normal. Furmark for gpu also. Also is there a possibility using a single dimm instead of dual channel have an effect on the overclock? i currently have a single 8gb dimm which i bought with plans on making it dual channel soon if needed.
 
O

OCNewbie

Diamond Member
Jul 18, 2000
7,596
24
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Did you run Memtest?

Question for others... what is the preferred program used these days, Memtest86 or Memtest86+ or other?

Also, Andrew... why not try lowering the OC to 4 GHZ, or maybe 3.9 GHz, play WoW, or whatever else was causing you issues before, and see if you can reproduce the problem.
 
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Phil L

Member
Jun 12, 2011
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I have similar setup, 3570k with MSI 7850 TwinFrozr. I do have a Seasonic 520w, but this sytem should not even use 300w. Anyway, as for OC, my CPU is 4.2 (stock voltage with -0.015 offset), while GPU is at 1050/1450. However, at first I had issue with GPU OC also, it would often crash during games, and it did restart once. But now I'm running Catalyst 12.3 without CCC, iGPU disabled, and it runs fine. I am not sure if it's the Catalyst 12.8 or CCC, but it might be worth a try switching drivers. Just a thought.
 
W

Wizlem

Member
Jun 2, 2010
94
0
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A decent power supply like the CX430 will turn itself off when you draw too much current from one of the rails. I believe it will stay off. You don't always get blue screens when a computer crashes from unstable overclocks. All sorts of things can happen, restarting wouldn't be an uncommon one and black screen freezes would be extremely common. A new psu might not hurt but it probably isn't necessary.
 
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OCNewbie

Diamond Member
Jul 18, 2000
7,596
24
81
If you could acquire a higher wattage PSU just for testing purposes, that'd probably be worth doing. Run it just as rough as you had before, and see if you have any hiccups.
 
2

2is

Diamond Member
Apr 8, 2012
4,281
131
106
I have a CX430 powering a 2500k @ 4.4GHz and a lightly overclocked 5870, both of which consume more power than your 3570 and 7850 respectively, so I doubt your issue is with the PSU.
 
Meghan54

Meghan54

Lifer
Oct 18, 2009
11,684
5,225
136
I'd try a small bump in the voltage fed the gpu first. Easiest way to eliminate that from being an issue, since you're OC'ing the gpu and its memory and haven't touched the voltage at all.
 
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andrewvoreakos

Junior Member
Aug 5, 2012
12
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just ordered a hx650 for 100euros.. good price for a 7 year warranty. will test at night.

The screen i got 2 times was black with gray stripes if that helpso_O
and the sound from ingame was keep coming.

Also got a crash running intelburntest yesterday at 4.1 so i guess its the cpu overclock (haven't touched the gpu - new format on windows). Temps on realtemp wasn't over 70c (ambient was like 30-32c).

Will run memtest tonight. Also between realtemp and aida64 or asus utility which one to trust more?

About the graphics card. The other day i ran furmark on 1050 core 1450 mem on stock voltage for 10+ mins and everything was running fine. max temps was 71c the most (on 30c ambient i think that is a good number). Can't imagine WoW being more demanding than furmark tbh and since i got the crashes in like 2-3 mins ingame i think i can rule out the gpu.
 
skillyho

skillyho

Golden Member
Nov 6, 2005
1,337
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76
Like everyone else has said, it's an OC stability problem - very, very unlikely to be PSU related. If you have several people telling you this you should probably investigate it further instead of purchasing a new PSU right away.

You need to run Prime for at least an hour or two to properly stress your rig and test your overclocks. Folks that rely on their machines often run Prime for up to 24 hrs to ensure stability.

Lastly, don't change multiple things at once. Get your CPU stable, then RAM, then GPU. There are too many variables with the variety of changes you've made.
 
Zap

Zap

Elite Member
Oct 13, 1999
22,377
7
81
skillyho said:
Lastly, don't change multiple things at once. Get your CPU stable, then RAM, then GPU. There are too many variables with the variety of changes you've made.
Click to expand...

:thumbsup: Very good advice.

Also, don't run it at the edge of stability because any small change (such as ambient temperatures going up, heatsinks getting dusty) can cause failures.
 
MoInSTL

MoInSTL

Senior member
Jan 2, 2012
392
0
76
How old is your PSU? I had an Antec 500w PSU. That wattage was the recommended minimum but my 560Ti FPB took it out. PSU's lose power output at 2-4% a year. My Antec was over 6 years old. That's 18% to 24%. Power degradation refers to losing maximum power output. It can also cause ripple. It may have enough power to power it on, but under load it's not enough. PSUs with Japanese capacitors last the longest.
 
philipma1957

philipma1957

Golden Member
Jan 8, 2012
1,714
0
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zon2020 said:
Do you have some reliable source you can link for this assertion?
Click to expand...

capacitors age and lose their ability to charge. same concept as rechargeable batteries. don't know the percentages but they do degenerate over time.

here is a link;
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/304617-28-electrolytic-capacitor-aging

i have a white paper link from www.emersonNetworkPower.com



http://www.emersonnetworkpower.com/en-US/Brands/Liebert/Documents/White Papers/SL-24630.pdf


note to mods not sure if this link auto downloads the 16 page pdf file
 
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philipma1957

philipma1957

Golden Member
Jan 8, 2012
1,714
0
76
MoInSTL said:
How old is your PSU? I had an Antec 500w PSU. That wattage was the recommended minimum but my 560Ti FPB took it out. PSU's lose power output at 2-4% a year. My Antec was over 6 years old. That's 18% to 24%. Power degradation refers to losing maximum power output. It can also cause ripple. It may have enough power to power it on, but under load it's not enough. PSUs with Japanese capacitors last the longest.
Click to expand...

You are correct that they lose power. Your Math for 2% to 4% loss is wrong.

at 2% 6 years = .98 x. 98 x .98 x .98 x .98 x .98 = .8858 or an 11.42

percent loss not 18%

at 4% .96 to the sixth power is .78275 or a 21.72 percent loss not 24%.



my guess is 1 to 2 percent is more likely then 2 to 4 percent so after 6 years you may be at a 5.8 percent loss to 11.4 percent loss.

of course really pushing the gear will kill it quicker
 
MoInSTL

MoInSTL

Senior member
Jan 2, 2012
392
0
76
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