3950X about to Redefine/Restructure the meaning of HEDT

[fleshconsumed]

I'd say 3950x is still mainstream.
a) it's on AM4 socket
b) it's still limited to dual channel RAM
c) it's still only 24 PCIe lanes which is not enough for HEDT

Yes, it's priced high as a halo desktop CPU, but that doesn't make it HEDT just like $500 price tag doesn't make nVidia 2070 Super high end GPU.

 

[beginner99]

Yeah the upcoming thread rippers will be amazing. The new design should fix some of the issues the previous gen ones had, so the sheer amount of processing power these things should have is amazing. I would love to get one but even my upcoming 3900x is overkill for my needs.

Agree. I will try to convince boss at work to get us such a rig and we could actually use it albeit I'm diggng my own hole with it. No more coffee break to wait for calculation to finish.

 

[Arkaign]

You whippersnappers and your thinking this is expensive.

2005 saw battling $1000 CPUs : Athlon 64 FX and Emergency Edition Pentium 4/D CPUs. AMD didn't offer a dual core under ~$300 at all, leaving Intel bizarrely with the price/performance king with OC 805Ds.

That was in 2005 dollars, so basically $1400+ in 2019 smackeroos.

The 3950 is a relative bargain!

Don't get me started with the 80s/90s. We live in an age where 99% of the world's PC users would see no improvement past a $150 CPU, $30 8GB of ram, and a small $30 nVME SSD. Add in a $50 case w/430W PSU, $15 CDKeys W10 license. Entire and competent PC for sub $300. I've spent more than double that on a single NEC SCSI slot-loading 2X CDRW that took an hour to burn a CD for a road trip.

 

[BigDaveX]

The 3900X is already in HEDT performance territory, but extrapolating the SMT performance of the 3950X using the 3900X, this beast will outperform the 9980XE and get this, the 3950X is a main stream CPU

To be honest, I think it's only now we're getting an idea of exactly how much of a failure Skylake-X has been in any situation not using AVX-512. It was able to get away with having its performance drop all the way back to Ivy Bridge levels in certain cases thanks to higher core counts versus Broadwell-E, and Threadripper being slowed down by its NUMA design. Zen 2, both in desktop and HEDT form, is going to absolutely murder it.

Heck, if Intel comes out with a 10-core Coffee Lake, that will easily defeat the 9900X, and possibly even the 9920X.

 

[Atari2600]

Agree. I will try to convince boss at work to get us such a rig and we could actually use it albeit I'm diggng my own hole with it. No more coffee break to wait for calculation to finish.

Ah, but you need a break to ponder what to do depending on what result you get...

Can't rush into these things.

 

[amrnuke]

You whippersnappers and your thinking this is expensive.

2005 saw battling $1000 CPUs : Athlon 64 FX and Emergency Edition Pentium 4/D CPUs. AMD didn't offer a dual core under ~$300 at all, leaving Intel bizarrely with the price/performance king with OC 805Ds.

That was in 2005 dollars, so basically $1400+ in 2019 smackeroos.

The 3950 is a relative bargain!

Don't get me started with the 80s/90s. We live in an age where 99% of the world's PC users would see no improvement past a $150 CPU, $30 8GB of ram, and a small $30 nVME SSD. Add in a $50 case w/430W PSU, $15 CDKeys W10 license. Entire and competent PC for sub $300. I've spent more than double that on a single NEC SCSI slot-loading 2X CDRW that took an hour to burn a CD for a road trip.

But according to all the Debbie Downers, CPU progress has stagnated!

 

[B-Riz]

Am betting ThreadRipper 3 starts at 24 core, 4 X 6 setup. $799 - $850.

Would be nice to see a lower price 16 / 32 ThreadRipper 3 vs the AM4 model, but I doubt it will happen right away.

Really want to get a ThreadRipper 3, but I don't neeeed one

 

[Ajay]

I think with the new 12 & upcoming 16 core processors, that allot of work that people used to do on HEDT systems, can now be handled by these high end mainstream systems (still a fair bit of money for a top line mobo and CPU). HEDT still has a place, it's just been moved up to those who need even more cores/ram or PCIe lanes.

 

[Markfw]

I think with the new 12 & upcoming 16 core processors, that allot of work that people used to do on HEDT systems, can now be handled by these high end mainstream systems (still a fair bit of money for a top line mobo and CPU). HEDT still has a place, it's just been moved up to those who need even more cores/ram or PCIe lanes.

You can now buy a 1950x 16 core+motherboard for less than an x570+3900x. And the 3900x beats it a lot of the time. I am waiting on the new threadrippers to replace all my old 1950x workhorses.

 

[Yeroon]

The far higher pcie lane count and the quad channel ram are what I consider HEDT, and for that reason, the 3900x and 3950x still count as mainstream in my view. Sure, the high core count now has some overlap, but thats only part of what HEDT platform has offered.

I would be OK with a 16 core Zen 2 chip on TR4 socket. PCIe lanes would make it worthwhile for me. On the other hand, I might be in a very small minority.

I hope they do, allowing for the quad channel ram and 64 lanes for those whom 16c is plenty, but need the bandwidth or expansion that the x570 platform cant offer.

Maybe even 2 versions or the 16 core - dual ccd and quad ccd, with the latter having higher clocks and possibly double l3 since its 4 chiplets, with a higher price to go with it.

 

[Topweasel]

The far higher pcie lane count and the quad channel ram are what I consider HEDT, and for that reason, the 3900x and 3950x still count as mainstream in my view. Sure, the high core count now has some overlap, but thats only part of what HEDT platform has offered.



I hope they do, allowing for the quad channel ram and 64 lanes for those whom 16c is plenty, but need the bandwidth or expansion that the x570 platform cant offer.

Maybe even 2 versions or the 16 core - dual ccd and quad ccd, with the latter having higher clocks and possibly double l3 since its 4 chiplets, with a higher price to go with it.

They won't do 2. Limited reason for it and the configuration is already built for less chiplets. 4 is already a small enough. 2 would be too unbalanced.

 

[ozzy702]

Any ideas on how 3000 series threadripper setups will game?

 

[jpiniero]

Any ideas on how 3000 series threadripper setups will game?

Shouldn't be any better or worse than Matisse.

 

[Zucker2k]

Shouldn't be any better or worse than Matisse.

128MB "game cache" should help in certain games. Also, shouldn't all those missing 4.6GHz+ capable chiplets go to TR? That should help, too.

 

[ozzy702]

Shouldn't be any better or worse than Matisse.

Well, Threadripper performed significantly worse than Pinnacle Ridge so that's why I ask. I like (don't need) the idea of the TR4 platform but without a compromise in gaming.

 

[beginner99]

Am betting ThreadRipper 3 starts at 24 core, 4 X 6 setup. $799 - $850.

Would be nice to see a lower price 16 / 32 ThreadRipper 3 vs the AM4 model, but I doubt it will happen right away.

3950x releases in September and first rumors hint at an October TR3 release, but maybe just rumours. I wanted to write your prices are BS and they will never be that cheap because 3950x is already $999. But then I rememered that's just the price here and actually msrp is $699

Really want to get a ThreadRipper 3, but I don't neeeed one

Agree on that one but given 3950x pricing here it's too steep money wise simply as a toy. I don't even need a 3900x.

 

[jpiniero]

Well, Threadripper performed significantly worse than Pinnacle Ridge so that's why I ask. I like (don't need) the idea of the TR4 platform but without a compromise in gaming.

That's because of the high cross-die latency and the crappy Windows scheduler. The new IO die method should avoid that, assuming they are using single Epyc IO dies.

 

[B-Riz]

3950x releases in September and first rumors hint at an October TR3 release, but maybe just rumours. I wanted to write your prices are BS and they will never be that cheap because 3950x is already $999. But then I rememered that's just the price here and actually msrp is $699




Agree on that one but given 3950x pricing here it's too steep money wise simply as a toy. I don't even need a 3900x.

Lol, we need country tags so people have a reference when we all talk prices and availability, maybe a tag that lets em know we go to Micro Center too

3900X MSRP in the USA is $499 (plus tax), and no one has jacked the price up except eBay sellers.

3950X MSRP is $749 (plus tax) in the USA.

While the 3900X is the most expensive CPU I have ever bought, it actually feels like it is worth it to me, a true upgrade from the 4790K in all regards.

And I was / am excited about X570 / PCIE4 too , I splurged on a fancy board this time, Aorus Master X570, never gotten a board more than ~$200 before.

But, I still love my 1700 / B350 "budget" 8/16 setup.

I really wanted an inexpensive TR3 because I picked up a 1900X and X399 Taichi on an eBay 20% coupon blitz last year, but, will abstain for a while since Zen2 AM4 is such a dang beast, lol.

 

[BigDaveX]

Well, Threadripper performed significantly worse than Pinnacle Ridge so that's why I ask. I like (don't need) the idea of the TR4 platform but without a compromise in gaming.

It was only really the quad-die Threadrippers that had their gaming performance completely tank. The dual-die Threadrippers lost a bit of performance in some games, but for the most part gaming performance actually held up better against its mainstream counterpart than Skylake-X did against Coffee Lake in that regard.

 

[DrMrLordX]

I've spent more than double that on a single NEC SCSI slot-loading 2X CDRW that took an hour to burn a CD for a road trip.

You are almost making me miss my AHA2940UW, 4(!!!) GB Western Digital HDD and 12x Toshiba CDR. Almost.

 

[nicalandia]

Also, shouldn't all those missing 4.6GHz+ capable chiplets go to TR? That should help, too.

TR will always get the absolute best binned CCX, I bet that with the new CCX OC tool we could see CCX quads doing 4.7 and with that Boss of a IO Chiplet making those beast UMA, These TR3 will absolutely murk any Intel HEDT in Gaming and it's going to be a holocaust in anything that requires more than 16 threads.

 

[IEC]

Considering I've seen some silicon lottery winners hit 4.50-4.55GHz on best CCX at <1.325V, particularly on the R7 3800X, the top 5% of chiplets could potentially do around 4.50-4.60 at reasonable vCore at the current maturity level of the 7nm process. You will need some major custom cooling to do anywhere near that on a Threadripper-level chip, however. 7nm heat density is no joke.

Give it another 6-12 months and I think 4.5GHz would be rather common. I can hit 4.5GHz on any single core on my R9 3900X but to do it all-core requires more voltage than I am comfortable with for daily operation. 4.7GHz+ is probably out of easy reach until Zen 3 (if then).

 

[Arkaign]

You are almost making me miss my AHA2940UW, 4(!!!) GB Western Digital HDD and 12x Toshiba CDR. Almost.

68-pin ribbon is so satisfying to connect lol. I didn't even mind watching the extra Adaptec option rom slowly find everything and report after POST.

 

[jpiniero]

These TR3 will absolutely murk any Intel HEDT in Gaming and it's going to be a holocaust in anything that requires more than 16 threads.

Skylake-X Refresh isn't that bad in gaming. It's faster than the 2700X in general... beating Matisse is another story, but what the gap would be is hard to tell since so few reviewers included it, and the one I looked at (Computerbase) gave the 9900X and 9800X 2400 Mhz memory for some reason.

 

[B-Riz]

You whippersnappers and your thinking this is expensive.

2005 saw battling $1000 CPUs : Athlon 64 FX and Emergency Edition Pentium 4/D CPUs. AMD didn't offer a dual core under ~$300 at all, leaving Intel bizarrely with the price/performance king with OC 805Ds.

That was in 2005 dollars, so basically $1400+ in 2019 smackeroos.

The 3950 is a relative bargain!

Don't get me started with the 80s/90s. We live in an age where 99% of the world's PC users would see no improvement past a $150 CPU, $30 8GB of ram, and a small $30 nVME SSD. Add in a $50 case w/430W PSU, $15 CDKeys W10 license. Entire and competent PC for sub $300. I've spent more than double that on a single NEC SCSI slot-loading 2X CDRW that took an hour to burn a CD for a road trip.

Lol, I remember reading this https://www.anandtech.com/show/1986 during the run up to this https://www.anandtech.com/show/2045 and almost buying a Pentium D 805.

I waited, and waited, trying to get an inexpensive 939 X2 chip, didn't happen, so I bought a C2D E6300 and AsRock 775Dual-VSTA to re-use DDR memory and the AGP card, what a great economical upgrade.

Board is still running right now with a Q6600 in it.