3700 Clawhammer idles at 50c, load 65c

[dreddfunk]

I am using the stock HSF, which seemed to seat perfectly. The cabling is pretty neat and uncluttered, with nothing restricting airflow through the case. Yet the CPU idles at 51-52c and tops out at 65c after being at 100% for about an hour (using both Speedfan and MBM to capture temperatures).

Would a good first step be to remount the HSF using Artic Silver 5? Or is there anything else I should check before then?

This is my first build, so any suggestions--no matter how basic--are welcome!

 

[CalvinHobbes]

Aftermarket HSF would be a good place to start.

 

[letdown427]

BIOS update maybe? 50 idle, that's, for want of a comparable white geek phrase, 'hella high'.

Check C n' Q is enabled too.

 

[crazylegs]

Can personally recommend the Arctic Cooling Freezer series... for you it would be the AC Freezer64! awesome performance & value for money, plus easy to install

i.e. dont have to remove M'board... can just plug it onto CPU

GL

 

[RallyMaster]

1. Update BIOS and see if gets down to a proper temp (idle shouldn't be higher than 35 and load not greater than 50)
2. Get a new cooler if problem is still there. I would also recommend the Arctic Cooling Freezer 64 Pro. Easy 5 minute install.
3. How's the case cooling? Maybe you need to add some more cooling to the case.

 

[dBTelos]

"3. How's the case cooling? Maybe you need to add some more cooling to the case."

or Ambient temps.

 

[dreddfunk]

Thanks for the suggestions. I will see if there is a BIOS update. I'll try to give a little more detail, as well.

The ambient case temperatures stay around 40c according to Speedfan and MBM, which again seems awfully high. I'm using an Antec Super Lanboy case, with 120mm fans front and rear. The PSU is an Antec TruePowerII 430w, which also draws air through the case. I wish I could post a picture of the cabling, because it really shouldn't be a factor with the way I've run them. Ostensibly, it seems like airflow would be good but something is clearly amiss.

So the consensus is that there isn't much point in trying to reseat the stock HSF with Arctic 5?

-----------------------
AMD Athlon64 3700+ Clawhammer (Stock HSF)
Shuttle AN-51R nForce3
ATI Radeon 9700Pro
1GB Patriot PC3200 2-3-2-5
2xMaxtor 60GB ATA133 Raid 0
Antec TruePower II 430w
Antec Super Lanboy with 2x120mm Fans

 

[RallyMaster]

No, unless you screwed up badly. Mounting default K8 is pretty much foolproof though so that's ruled out. Case temps are a bit high at 40C. What's the room temp?
Get a new cooler only if a BIOS update does not change temps. We'll recommend you one when that time actually comes.

 

[dreddfunk]

Thanks all--The BIOS update helped quite a bit. The readings are still warm--CPU 44c, case 38/36c--but not nearly as ridiculous. Are these more in line with the 130nm Athlon64s?

Frankly, the only reason I hadn't alread updated my BIOS was that the version listed on Shuttle's support website dated from July, 2004--more than a year prior to my purchase. I just couldn't imagine that a board would be shipped with a BIOS more than a year old. Short story, chalk that mistake up to being a relative noob and not understanding just how long some of these boards are laying around in warehouses. ;-)

At some point I'll look at another HSF. Eventually I'll want to timidly dip my toes into the waters of overclocking (not that the 3700+ Clawhammer is a particularly good place to start).

Again, many thanks RallyM--and others--for the help. It's one thing to know in principle the things that could be going wrong; it's quite another for the inexperienced builder to rate their relative likelihood.

 

[RallyMaster]

hmm...44C is still pretty high. I've not seen my load go above 45C with my fans on (even when using stock CPU cooling). I think it would be wise to invest in a CPU cooler right about now. 130 nm should be a degree or two hotter than the 90nm cores...which should make your CPU about 33C or so at idle.

 

[dreddfunk]

RallyM - Is the ambient temperature a concern? Or should the CPU be lower than the ambient in the case? I'm just trying to figure out if I have an airflow/case-cooling issue or a CPU-cooling issue.

Thoughts?

btw...as a noob I really can't thank you enough for the information.

 

[RallyMaster]

Ambient temp does affect the CPU quite a bit. The air that goes into your computer is very important for cooling. CPU temp for me is usually a few degrees above room temp at idle (my room temp is same as case temp due to double 120 mm intake fans). As for your case, it's a pretty small case and considering that you have double Maxtor 60GBs in RAID, they do produce quite a bit of heat (I have two Maxtor 80GBs myself). I only decided to use up 3 5.25" drive bays for a 120 mm fan because my CPU temp raised 4C at idle when I was only using one 120 mm fan (bottom front) for intake ( http://img390.imageshack.us/img390/9696/pcpic26fq.jpg two 120 mm intakes...my computer).

As for your situation, it could be a combination of both minimal airflow in case as well as CPU cooling. For stock cooling, it would be good to have a fan duct on the window give air to the CPU fan. However, this is not true for your Super Lanboy. The other problem is that you also do not have space for a 120 mm in your drive bays. There are only 3 bays total for you and only a 80mm will fit (which is not enough cooling). You could try a new CPU cooler but I'm doubting how much that would help because it does not obtain enough cool air to work as well as it can.

 

[dreddfunk]

I wonder if I should check on replacing the supplied 120mm antec fans with ones that move more air. That may be the best first step. Thanks again.

 

[dreddfunk]

Just checking antec's website, the two 120mm fans are rated:

Fan Specs:
- RPM: 1200
- CFM: 38.94
-dB(A): 24.85

Low noise, but that's not a lot of air. It looks like I'll be investing in a couple of new 120mm fans, perhaps: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16811998127.

Nearly double the cfm. It will make more noise but I've got to upgrade my 9700pro to something that will run Oblivion well (read, a leaf-blower) so the extra noise may not matter much in the end.

 

[RallyMaster]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16835186005 try that one. regarding your choice: 78 cfm is overkill for just one fan and it'll be loud at 35dBA. most of us have switched to quieter fans that still push a decent amount of air. if you absolutely have to have a LED fan, I recommend Cooler Master Silent LED fans.

 

[letdown427]

You won't really cool anything cooler than ambient using air cooling, that's just not how it works.

Ambient temp is very important, and 36 is toasty. Do you have access to anything else that measures temperatures? Might be worth testing inside the case yourself.

Another thing, take the side panels off, does that drop ambient temps?

With side panel off, put a desk fan blowing into it, that should definately drop your temps, a lot. See what they go to, might be able to give you an idea of whether the sensors are reading too high (which they seem likely to be doing?)

 

[dreddfunk]

RallyM - I'd come to the same conclusion myself. I just couldn't decide whether or not to spend the $15 on this Scythe: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16835185006 (63.7cfm/28dba). I'm glad you pointed out a more reasonable alternative.

Hi Letdown, thanks for the input.
Yeah, I grasp the principle of heat dissipation--though my question above probably didn't make that clear. When I posted the temps after the BIOS update, RallyM replied that they were still warm and that I should possibly start looking for an after-market cooler, since he thought my CPU should probably be idling at somewhere around 33-34c. His statement sent up a warning flag since my ambient case temperatures weren't nearly that low (and it made no sense to me that CPUs could be cooled lower than ambient temperatures on air). I just posted the question because, being new to this, I didn't know what assumptions I was making about the laws of physics that just didn't apply for some strange reason or another. In short, while the case ambient is 36/38c, the outside air is definitely cooler (although I couldn't quantify just how much). Given this, I'm looking into getting a new case fan rated to move more air. The one RallyM suggested seems reasonable.

And I'm certainly not married to using an LED fan, RallyM. That was actually not a selling point for me with regard to the lanboy case. I don't know if I should replace both the front and back fans, or just the back. Any thoughts?

 

[letdown427]

Hi dreddfunk

Sorry if I sounded patronising or anything, I didn't mean to sound offensive about the air cooling thing

I'd guess your room temps are probably like 25 tops? I don't know, maybe hop onto Google, find out tomorrows temperature and leave your window open tomorrow. THen you'll hav a better idea of your room temps maybe? Just a (silly) thought.

I agree with your warning flag that investing in a new CPU cooler whilst those ambient temps are still so high could prove to be a wasted investment if they stay that high. Hopefully we can figure out what is causing those high temps!

 

[RallyMaster]

When I replaced my fans, I replaced all of them. Not a single stock fan is left except the drive bay 120 mm...which was the original exhaust for this case. I find that it is a bit too loud for my tastes and will look into replacing it with another Cooler Master Silent LED soon (yeah, I'm married to blue LEDs). Open up the case like letdown said and see if the temps drop dramatically. If it does, then you need yourself a case with better cooling.

 

[letdown427]

Aren't Blue LEDs sexy? hehe

I've found the aerocool turbines quiet, blue, and reasonable airflow for me. managed to hang a 140mm as my intake.

Anyway, yes, do as RallyM says

 

[64ninjas]

I have a clawhammer 3700+ and it runs somewhat hot also..

mine idles @ 40C with an aftermarket cooler, case temp of 25C
under load it tops out at ~ 55C

 

[dreddfunk]

Hey letdown, I wasn't feeling patronized at all...no worries! I really can understand how my question was misleading.

Well, in the ultimate strangeness of the universe, things have changed. We did have the ambient temps drop a bit (a small cool front moved through) but nothing major--maybe the indoor temps dropped 5-10f (tops).

So I boot up my rig this morning: CPU temp reads 24c, while case reads 39c. How on earth do I explain this? The ambient temps are about right--at least consistent with previous readings...but how does a day change my cpu temp by 20c?

I'm at a loss...really.

RallyM - I'd try the opening the case trick now but...well...my cpu reads 24c so I'm not sure just how much of a test it would be.

Weird.

 

[dreddfunk]

I forgot to mention thanks to 64--it's good to hear other reports for the 3700+ Clawhammer.

 

[IdaGno]

Originally posted by: letdown427
You won't really cool anything cooler than ambient using air cooling, that's just not how it works.

Ditto water cooling. Temp's below ambient = phase change of one sort or another.

 

[RallyMaster]

dreddfunk: you have me beat in terms of temps there. my CPU is at 28C.