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30 pack Fuji CD-R for $1.99 AR at BB (TYs if you're lucky)

modestninja

modestninja

Senior member
I was in BB yesterday picking up a 50pack of Fuji TYs and next to the satck of 50packs was a huge stack of 30packs of made in Japan Fuji CD-rs for:
$12.99 - $5IR - $6MIR = $1.99.

Since the 30 pack Fujis are more likely to be TYs this seemed to be a pretty hot deal for those in need of good quality media. Anyway, hopefully this wasn't a repost (I searched but couldn't find any mention of it). BTW, it looks like this deal started yesterday (flyer in the paper) and runs 'til saturday... i think.
 
All 30 pack Fujis have been inferior. Generally high BLER level compared to 50pack and really high C1 (sometimes even C2) count towards the end of the disc.

But it's possible that I was unlucky since I bought all 5 batches in one time, so it may be that that particular shipment was "bad".
 
Originally posted by: fleshconsumed
All 30 pack Fujis have been inferior. Generally high BLER level compared to 50pack and really high C1 (sometimes even C2) count towards the end of the disc.

But it's possible that I was unlucky since I bought all 5 batches in one time, so it may be that that particular shipment was "bad".
Click to expand...

Interesting. I picked up a couple of 30-spindles, I'll report back once I've opened and burned a few of them.

I had a similar problem with some Maxell CD-Rs. I purchased some 80min ones from Walgreens, and they were absolutely awesome, quality-wise. Then I purchased some 650MB Maxells from Staples, and they were some of the worst discs that I've ever used. They were clearly defective, after about the 43min mark, the number of C1 errors rose unacceptably, and there were usually C2 errors in the last 20min. Complete crap. I've bought some more of the 80min ones from Walgreens, hopefully they will be the "good ones". One thing that I noticed, that I didn't before, is that out of 4 spindles, three have a black plastic base, and one has a grey base. I don't remember what color the spindle base was when I purchased my two prior "good" Maxell spindles, although it is likely they were grey. The one with the grey base had an older-looking price sticker affixed to the packaging.

PS. I find that the "good" Maxell 80-min CD-Rs are actually just as good, if not better, than the Fuji T-Y discs.
 
Originally posted by: fleshconsumed
All 30 pack Fujis have been inferior. Generally high BLER level compared to 50pack and really high C1 (sometimes even C2) count towards the end of the disc.

But it's possible that I was unlucky since I bought all 5 batches in one time, so it may be that that particular shipment was "bad".
Click to expand...

Can you explain how you are gettting reports on these errors? I'd like to find a good way to check the the media I purchase.
 
Originally posted by: gba
Originally posted by: fleshconsumed
All 30 pack Fujis have been inferior. Generally high BLER level compared to 50pack and really high C1 (sometimes even C2) count towards the end of the disc.

But it's possible that I was unlucky since I bought all 5 batches in one time, so it may be that that particular shipment was "bad".
Click to expand...

Can you explain how you are gettting reports on these errors? I'd like to find a good way to check the the media I purchase.
Click to expand...

If you have a lite-on cdrw then you can use CD Doctor (don't know where to get it, google for it).. Otherwise there are many other programs to do it (just don't know the names of any of them, again google for it).

A good burn will have very few C1 errors (TYs usually give me 5-10, cheap media can be in the 200-1000 range) and will have 0 C2 errors. There can be C2 errors on video discs (vcd, svcd, etc..) but still 0 is preferable.
 
Originally posted by: RDMustang1
A good burn will have very few C1 errors (TYs usually give me 5-10, cheap media can be in the 200-1000 range) and will have 0 C2 errors. There can be C2 errors on video discs (vcd, svcd, etc..) but still 0 is preferable.
Click to expand...

I think that you have that slightly backwards. C2 errors are the more severe of the two, and in order to correct those errors in data sectors, some sort of higher-level error-correction scheme has to come into play. Mode1 data sectors have that extra layer of error-correction, Mode2 Form2 and CD-DA audio sectors do not. So in that case, C2 errors present in normal, ISO9660/Joliet data CDs, that use Mode1 data sectors, can be corrected. C2 errors present in Mode2 Form2 CD formats, such as VCD/SVCD discs, cannot be corrected, because there is no higher level of error-correction present on those.

Granted, if there is a data read error present on a VCD disc, the worst that could happen is a few frames worth of garbage on playback. If that were to happen to a .ZIP file, things could be more disastrous. Perhaps that is what you meant initially?

Most console-game CD formats use Mode2 data sectors, so errors in those can definately be a problem when backing them up, and is why it is recommended to use high-quality CDRs for doing console backups. (I'm really sad, since my originally-purchased PSX Tekken3 CD, now has several unrecoverable read errors present on the disc (C2 errors). 🙁 I should have backed up my PSX collection sooner... I worry about my more obscure CD collections such as JagCD. PSX games are still at least largely replaceable at this point in time.)
 
VirtualLarry
Interesting. I picked up a couple of 30-spindles, I'll report back once I've opened and burned a few of them.
Please do, I'd like to see if my batches were simply defective of if all 30PK are that bad.

PS. I find that the "good" Maxell 80-min CD-Rs are actually just as good, if not better, than the Fuji T-Y discs.
The old Maxell Cyanine discs were good, I would disagree that they were better than TY, but they were a lot better than the average, I'd say that quality wise old cyanine Maxells were as good as MCC's. However later Maxell changed from cyanine to phtalocyanine, I have no idea how good are those.

gba
You can measure C2 errors on any drive using Nero CDSpeed, however that doesn't help you very much because there won't be any C2 errors on the disc unless you are using the worst of the worst. C1 errors is what you should be interested in. All drives can read/correct C1 erros, however only two manufacturers make drives that can report them back to the user, it's LiteOn and Plextor with its Premium (that's what I have), so if you want to check the media you use you must have one of those drives.

Also keep in mind that although it all sounds good, home C1/C2 testing and such... testing your CD-Rs at home will not give you the absolute measurement of how good those CD-Rs are. There is a professional equipment for that that costs thousands of dollars, what we have at home is a rather cheap knockoff, it's good for comparing different types of CD-Rs but by no means you should interpret the results as the absolute truth.

RDMustang1
A good burn will have very few C1 errors (TYs usually give me 5-10, cheap media can be in the 200-1000 range) and will have 0 C2 errors.
I have no idea how could you get 5-10 C1 errors, even on a TY disc. The typical value for LiteOn drives (that's what you use, right?) is 150-250 C1 errors, not 5-10.
 
Are these errors the same as"cyclic redundancy errors" you get with crappy media? I recently burned some cds with ~500mb episodes of the west wing on a lite-on 52x writer using Nero 6 on khypermedia cds. They were all unreadable and I got "cyclic redundancy errors" from wndows when I tried to access the files.
Thanks for any info.
 
Originally posted by: DonCrescas
Are these errors the same as"cyclic redundancy errors" you get with crappy media? I recently burned some cds with ~500mb episodes of the west wing on a lite-on 52x writer using Nero 6 on khypermedia cds. They were all unreadable and I got "cyclic redundancy errors" from wndows when I tried to access the files.
Thanks for any info.
Click to expand...

C2 errors could translate into "CRC errors", if the sectors in question were so damaged, that the higher-level EDC/ECC that is present in normal Mode1 data sectors, was not able to correct the errors. So visible "CRC errors" are actually even much worse than a few C2 errors. That must have been really bad media, or a really bad burn. I wouldn't continue to use that combination of media and drive, personally. Consider a drive firmware upgrade, if one is available, they often help with media-compatibility.

Btw, in my Sony/Lite-On drive, I can't burn original Maxell (made in Japan by Hitachi-Maxell) pre-8x-rated media worth squat. They burned fine in my Yamaha 6416S (and still do, in the same drive, at a friends house), but in my new-ish drive, no way. There is no error during the burn, but the discs burn as absolutely unreadable. (So much for "smart-burn".)

The newer Maxells that I was referring to in a prior post, are high-quality Ritek discs, they are not made by Maxell.

Sorry I haven't cracked into the 30-pack T-Ys yet, have been busy. Will try to check them out soon.
 
Originally posted by: fleshconsumed

RDMustang1
A good burn will have very few C1 errors (TYs usually give me 5-10, cheap media can be in the 200-1000 range) and will have 0 C2 errors.
I have no idea how could you get 5-10 C1 errors, even on a TY disc. The typical value for LiteOn drives (that's what you use, right?) is 150-250 C1 errors, not 5-10.
Click to expand...

I think that both of you might be talking about different measurement tools. CDDoctor shows a min and max value, accumulated over the total number of tested sectors, but calculated on a per-sector basis. I think K's Probe shows a true overall total count for the disc. So you could be talking about the same thing. Overall disc C1 error totals don't matter much, it's the per-sector max that determines readability usually. Overall disc C2 error totals are important though, anything other than zero, I consider a bad burn, unless it's un-important data burned in Mode1 format, then I make sure that the files are readable and accurate. If the data is important I would re-burn.

I was looking at some of my saved CDDoctor graphs, for the high-quality Riteks, my CDDoctor C1 error min/max/ave values are 0, 5, and 0.108.

For comparison, for the "evil old cyanine Maxells burned in a Lite-On" (unreadable), the C1 numbers are 0, 2635, 1716.494, and C2 is 0, 144, 5.904.

For CMC 80min media, burned at 32x, I get C1 numbers like 0, 21, 3.854. Not as great as T-Y or HQ Riteks, but still quite acceptable for most uses.
 
Originally posted by: fleshconsumed
All 30 pack Fujis have been inferior. Generally high BLER level compared to 50pack and really high C1 (sometimes even C2) count towards the end of the disc.

But it's possible that I was unlucky since I bought all 5 batches in one time, so it may be that that particular shipment was "bad".
Click to expand...
I agree about the 30 packs. I have a 30 pk of the Fujis with the color swirls on the disks. They are TY, but they are not very good. Much higher C1 error levels than the TYs I have that came from fuji in the 50 pk spindles.
 
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