KMFJD
Lifer
- Aug 11, 2005
- 33,764
- 54,283
- 136
Last edited:
JSt0rm
Lifer
- Sep 5, 2000
- 27,399
- 3,948
- 126
and it seems to be getting worse.
BonzaiDuck
Lifer
- Jun 30, 2004
- 16,878
- 2,190
- 126
It's unfortunate. People like Eric Hoffer ("True Believer") were self-educated.
When I was 18, I met a truck driver who painted in oils and read widely. He could hold forth for ten or twenty minutes on his collection of Mahler and Richard Strauss recordings.
About 15 years ago driving through rural Oregon at 1AM, I stopped at a run-down old filling station for gas. The sole attendant had grime on his face, and those overalls would need an industrial and repetitive washing. He quickly proved to have a very detailed understanding of the Johnson administration and the Vietnam War. I didn't fire up and leave until I discovered it was almost 2 AM.
People want to think that if they have an opinion -- if they believe their opinion -- that they are simply right, everyone else is wrong, and there's nothing more to be said in the matter. Such folks will belligerently resist any attempt to educate them in context of the argument. Your facts and logical inference won't matter.
The same folks who say that "Trump broke all the rules and won" in the election game will also say that a majority decision will always be the best and true path forward into the Future. There are plenty of reasons why that isn't a reliable idea, and it is really quite simple. They will continue to deny that mistakes they grudgingly admit had occurred would have been less likely had they previously voted the other way.
It supports the idea of a belief that "my opinion is as good as any, and it is the only opinion because it is mine."
Ask them the title of the last book they read, and how long since they've read that last book. Of course, the internet has destroyed that concept as a rule-of-thumb. And that's another aspect of what has happened.
Somebody point me to the right web-site for "D**k and Jane Take Their Country Back and Defeat the Q----rs and N-----rs." I need to enlighten myself.
When I was 18, I met a truck driver who painted in oils and read widely. He could hold forth for ten or twenty minutes on his collection of Mahler and Richard Strauss recordings.
About 15 years ago driving through rural Oregon at 1AM, I stopped at a run-down old filling station for gas. The sole attendant had grime on his face, and those overalls would need an industrial and repetitive washing. He quickly proved to have a very detailed understanding of the Johnson administration and the Vietnam War. I didn't fire up and leave until I discovered it was almost 2 AM.
People want to think that if they have an opinion -- if they believe their opinion -- that they are simply right, everyone else is wrong, and there's nothing more to be said in the matter. Such folks will belligerently resist any attempt to educate them in context of the argument. Your facts and logical inference won't matter.
The same folks who say that "Trump broke all the rules and won" in the election game will also say that a majority decision will always be the best and true path forward into the Future. There are plenty of reasons why that isn't a reliable idea, and it is really quite simple. They will continue to deny that mistakes they grudgingly admit had occurred would have been less likely had they previously voted the other way.
It supports the idea of a belief that "my opinion is as good as any, and it is the only opinion because it is mine."
Ask them the title of the last book they read, and how long since they've read that last book. Of course, the internet has destroyed that concept as a rule-of-thumb. And that's another aspect of what has happened.
Somebody point me to the right web-site for "D**k and Jane Take Their Country Back and Defeat the Q----rs and N-----rs." I need to enlighten myself.
Vic
Elite Member
- Jun 12, 2001
- 50,422
- 14,337
- 136
A term that I don't like using, as much because it is pejorative as it is misused, is 'sheeple.' But I think it appropriate here. Like the sheep in Orwell's Animal Farm, the Trumpsters can always be depended upon to loudly distract the rest of the country from any genuine policy discussion. President-elect Troll feeds them their nonsensical talking points, and off they go, shouting down anything resembling legitimate political discourse.
Vic
Elite Member
- Jun 12, 2001
- 50,422
- 14,337
- 136
I wasn't trying to say that one side is necessarily different from the other in this regard, except that the nonsense from the idiot right is now (or on 1/20/17) being orchestrated from the White House. Which, like it or not, does change the dynamic considerably. It's one thing when some random idiot, or even some media talking head, fuels some hysteria, and quite another when it's coming from the President himself.
Trump makes yuge bogus voter fraud claim. Supporters commence howling at the boogeyman & raving about evil libruhls.
Trump lies. About everything. Some of us figured that out before the election. Some are still held in a trance like state of delusion & denial. It's what con men do, and Trump is one of the greats.
Trump lies. About everything. Some of us figured that out before the election. Some are still held in a trance like state of delusion & denial. It's what con men do, and Trump is one of the greats.
Zorba
Lifer
- Oct 22, 1999
- 15,613
- 11,256
- 136
It is interesting to me that there are millions of non-illegals in this country that aren't allowed to vote. I.e. H1B visa holders, green card holders, ex-cons, etc. But the right never mentions them, only illegal immigrants because they are the current boogie man.
BonzaiDuck
Lifer
- Jun 30, 2004
- 16,878
- 2,190
- 126
Worse. Check today's LA Times story about a married couple with two Twitter accounts. The wife thought Trump was "repulsive," and said so in her Twitter to Trump.
Trump blocked her.
Obama White House had been accused once-- Once! -- for blocking access to a Trumper-tweeter. White House had denied ever blocking any twitter tweets.
The fact that only one person would make that accusation makes it look less than reliable.
Other than "build a wall," you wonder if the Faithful are "OK" with the misstep regarding Taiwan. Or if they actually have any idea of a feasible policy about everything, except termination of EPA, Education, ACA, thaw with Cuba, and a litany of other things.
Hardly more I can say about this. I could pray that the Electoral College would flip and deny the Trumpers their votes, since Clinton won the overall popular vote anyway. Possible, but not likely -- unless the bizarre behavior quickly turns into an outright threat to national security, or the man actually shoots someone on 5th Avenue.
Maybe if someone pushes his buttons enough. But you got your Boris Epshteyn and Kellyann Conway with their hands on his shoulders, attempting to moderate his behavior.
BonzaiDuck
Lifer
- Jun 30, 2004
- 16,878
- 2,190
- 126
In a psychological profile substantiated with actual behavior, it is only one valid comparison among some others -- which still coincide with the Fuhrer's problem. I'm speaking here as a "recovering" narcissist no longer in denial. You brush this stuff off with "There you go again, with the Hitler comparison."
Nice way of dismissing what is generally otherwise agreed.
If I said the campaign had lowered the bar to make politics like the WWWF Smackdowns or other outrageous reality-TV nonsense, you will argue that it's "high culture." You'll also say "Trump broke all the rules." True. And a lot more of them than you'll acknowledge.
- Jan 14, 2013
- 26,519
- 24,726
- 136
it's always 3 million illegal votes cast. So where are the official calls for a recount to find all them? Being such a large number of fraudulent votes this should be relatively easy to prove, especially if it's focused in one state as some righties seem to be pointing to?
BonzaiDuck
Lifer
- Jun 30, 2004
- 16,878
- 2,190
- 126
It could be done just as a test with random sampling -- even better with stratification or inter-penetrating replication of two independently drawn random samples.
But read my earlier post of a letter-to-editor I got published yesterday. With 168,000 precincts or the precincts distributed among 58 CA counties, there would be some indication by now that it happened. There would even be reports of isolated individual attempts that were discovered.
If there is no evidence to even raise the suspicion of it given the safeguards that are in place, the plurality of responsible jurisdictions and volunteers, then it didn't occur.
By the way. "The Jews are trying to take our precious bodily fluids and screw everybody else."
People will continue to stay within their bubble of ignorance and paranoia. Maybe if you added some new mood drug to the fluoridation of public water in Trump country. That would just make it all worse.
Maybe Trumpers have been watching too many sequels of "Ocean's Eleven."
"Mission Accomplished?" The Sci-Fi channel? Who the hell knows. But it's getting to this point for me. If my car-mechanic or other regular business contact was clueless enough to vote for Asshole, I could still trust that he knows automobiles. But then again, would I trust him just to work on my car, even if I assume that he's good at it?
Just another example of how easy it is to manipulate people. This isn't about Republicans or Democrats.
Most people don't want to think for themselves so they are looking for leaders like Trump (or Hillary).
We humans are in a sad state. When will we ever wake up just a little bit from this sleep we're in?
Most people don't want to think for themselves so they are looking for leaders like Trump (or Hillary).
We humans are in a sad state. When will we ever wake up just a little bit from this sleep we're in?
buckshot24
Diamond Member
- Nov 3, 2009
- 9,916
- 85
- 91
I think this is a secret narrative to start trouble in this country. People have already been pretty angry here after Obama was selected President. For the past 8 years, the media has been playing the race issue over and over again. Now, we have Trump who is supposed to be the hero of the anti-Obama crowd. Well, he has been promoted and sold by the media as the patriotic anti-illegal warrior. It's all a game. They are playing with us - the masses.
Now, we have Trump and his people once again starting race baiting tactics. See any patterns?
I think what the politicians and the media want is unrest and poor race relations. If that's not the case, they sure aren't making it seem that way.
All these tribal tactics are working well. The pro Trump people are eating up this stuff. The anti-Trump people's feelings are being constantly reaffirmed. So both sides are being given ammunition.
What a world.
- Jan 14, 2013
- 26,519
- 24,726
- 136
so they feel there are at the very least 3 million illegal votes and it's not for the good of the country to find out and learn how to fix the problem?
that's amazing
buckshot24
Diamond Member
- Nov 3, 2009
- 9,916
- 85
- 91
buckshot24
Diamond Member
- Nov 3, 2009
- 9,916
- 85
- 91
Who says "at the very least"? Also who says we shouldn't fix the problem? Recounts aren't going to reveal illegals voting.
- Jan 14, 2013
- 26,519
- 24,726
- 136
your orange muppet hero says millions and a lot of Trumpists have echoed the same thing. Some say 3 million and some say millions. Either way it's multiple millions. Recount, fraud investigation - however you want to word it - it should be done. For the sake of the nation. If they believe it and keep saying it.
buckshot24
Diamond Member
- Nov 3, 2009
- 9,916
- 85
- 91
Puffnstuff
Lifer
- Mar 9, 2005
- 16,256
- 4,930
- 136
JSt0rm
Lifer
- Sep 5, 2000
- 27,399
- 3,948
- 126
buckshot24
Diamond Member
- Nov 3, 2009
- 9,916
- 85
- 91
Like I said, recounts probably isn't the correct way to find illegal voters.No need for accountability in GSA contracts either, right?
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