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24" LCD: why pay DOUBLE?

M

mamamia

Junior Member
I'm a graphic designer. I do desktop publishing, ads, logo design, brochures... B/W and color design too... a 1/3 of my time I do Photoshop work -- manipulation, retouching, grayscale and color corrections...

I need to decide between two 24" LCD displays, especially if it's worth the significant extra cost on the more expensive one...

1. Samsung SyncMaster 244T which is about $700.

2. NEC MultiSync LCD2490XUXi which is double priced, $1,400.

Is the NEC REALLY that much better than the Samsung?

Yes, I know Apple 23" is a great choice (btw, how would you compare it's color accuracy to the above two?), but I want the extra 1" real-estate...

Also, what's the best way to CALIBRATE them?

I talked to a pre-press guy at one of the printers I work with, and he said all their attempts to use calibration software/hardware (on their CRTs, no LCD's yet) FAILED, and they did the adjustment manually, by comparing printed photos to the way they look on their screens...

Thanks for your honest opinion!
 
Thanks, clandren.

Yes, this is a good thing to read...

I was still hoping to get a comparison between the 2 options and mostly an advice from those who use a 24" monitor for SIMILAR USE like me, needing sharpness and accurate colors too......
 
If you are doing professional work the NEC with the S-IPS panel will be better in terms of accurate colours and I would go with it. $700 isn't much on something that the quality of your work depends on and you will use for many years. Also factor in the after tax cost since I'm assuming you are claiming it for business purposes.

Don't bother with the Apple it's outdated and uses the same panel as either the Dell or Samsung (I forget which) and SUCKS for use on a PC.
 
Well, it isn't $700, it's an EXTRA $700 for the NEC 2490.... I just hope it's WORTH the extra $700...

But it's still much cheaper than 2-3 years ago, and probably BETTER...

...Anybody knows about NEW 24" monitors coming out this month? Somebody mentioned something about it in one of those forums....
 
the nec has a 12 bit lookup table and dual dvi.

i wouldn't pay $700 more for it. IPS is also better than MVA for color, but $700 is a lot more money (and I have an nec 20wmgx2 which is like nearly twice as much as most MVA panels as well).

i suppose if you want to get the 24" NEC< y ou might as well get the 26" one as it has some sort of better ntsc color reproduction or something from what i've read/.
 
Now I'm a bit confused, hans007...

You say that the NEC is better in several aspects compared to the other, lower cost monitors, but not worth the extra $700...

Yet you have it (and you paid nearly double) and you offer me an even better, yet MORE expensive product, the 26"...

I'd say the conclusion from your post is -- spend the extra $700 or even more, and buy the best... No?...
 
Originally posted by: mamamia
Now I'm a bit confused, hans007...

You say that the NEC is better in several aspects compared to the other, lower cost monitors, but not worth the extra $700...

Yet you have it (and you paid nearly double) and you offer me an even better, yet MORE expensive product, the 26"...

I'd say the conclusion from your post is -- spend the extra $700 or even more, and buy the best... No?...
Click to expand...

I'll interpret hans007's post for you.

Samsung -> Nec doubles the price ~($700 -> $1400)

He has a 20WMGX2, which is double the price of standard MVA LCDs ~($275 -> $550)

Though he spent twice as much for his monitor compared to other 20" monitors, he only paid $275 more. You would have to pay $700 more. If you're going to go with the NEC over the Samsung, you might as well pay a couple more dollars for the bigger, better 26" NEC.
 
I paid $1400 for my samsung 244t, and it's the most beautiful screen I've seen so far. I don't know how it could be better looking, and it is quite solid with a professional look to it. I'm going to the dell 30" just because I found a good deal and I'm indulging in the size.
 
Great info, thanks so much, clandren.

Now, what does all that mean.... Maybe I SHOULD wait for this new Eizo to appear on the market?....What do you guys say? --- Here is the info:

EIZO Introduces ColorEdge® CG241W for
High-End Still and Moving Image Work

Cypress, CA, June 14 2007 ? Eizo Nanao Technologies Inc.(EIZO) today announced the release of the ColorEdge CG241W for its ColorEdge series of color calibration LCD monitors. Offering both 12-bit hardware calibration and a 6 ms gray-to-gray response time, this 24.1-inch widescreen monitor is designed to display both still and moving images equally well, making it ideal for a wide range of high-end graphics work including pre-press, digital photography, video editing, and post-production.

The ColorEdge CG241W has a native resolution of 1920 × 1200 (16:10 aspect ratio), so it can also display images in 1920 × 1080 (16:9 aspect ratio) full high-definition with thin black borders at the top and bottom of the screen. The maximum brightness is 300 cd/m², contrast ratio is 850:1, and horizontal and vertical viewing angles are 178°. The wide gamut LCD panel reproduces 92% of NTSC and 96% of the Adobe RGB color space so it can display most colors in a photograph taken in Adobe RGB mode.

Since the CG241W offers hardware calibration, the monitor itself is calibrated rather than the computer?s graphics board as is the case with software calibration. This ensures no color tones are lost in the calibration process and results in more accurate on-screen color.

EIZO?s ColorNavigator CE calibration software is bundled with the CG241W and allows for setting the target values for brightness, white point, and gamma. ColorNavigator CE works with a measurement device to directly utilize the monitor?s 12-bit look-up table for accurate calibration in less than five minutes. When calibration is complete the settings can be saved as an ICC profile. The software also offers black level settings (digital signal only) and a paper white measuring function1 for color matching between the image on the monitor and the image on the printouts. Supported calibration devices for ColorNavigator CE include Eye-One, DTP94, DTP94B, and MonacoOPTIX from X-Rite, and ColorVision?s Spyder2. ColorNavigator CE for the CG241W will be upgraded to full version of ColorNavigator free of charge later this year.

The ColorEdge CG241W comes equipped with EIZO?s latest ASIC (Application Specific Integrated Circuit). The ASIC has a 12-bit look-up table with a palette of 4,081 colors for each R, G, and B from which the most appropriate 256 colors are selected. The ASIC also features 16-bit internal processing for smooth display of grayscale tones, which brings out details, especially in dark areas of an image.

To ensure optimum colors straight out of the box, EIZO calibrates each unit of the ColorEdge CG241W at its factory in Japan. EIZO measures every tone from 0 ? 255 to produce a gamma curve of 2.2 and includes an adjustment certificate in the packaging to verify the results. Furthermore, EIZO corrects the brightness and chroma uniformity errors that are characteristic of LCD panels with its Digital Uniformity Equalizer (DUE) function. With DUE, brightness and chroma appear uniform for each tone no matter where on the screen it is displayed.
DVI-I inputs which support both digital and analog signals from computers, and a USB 2.0 hub with one upstream and two downstream ports are included. Support for high bandwidth digital content protection (HDCP) with a digital signal allows for viewing of content from HDCP-equipped devices.

Additional Features
· 82 mm height adjustment, 40° tilt, 70° swivel, and 90° pivot for portrait display.
· Sensor on front panel reads ambient light and adjusts the screen brightness to the ideal level. Perfect for text-based tasks, this function is automatically disabled in calibration mode.
· Simulates two types of color vision deficiency ? protanopia and deuteranopia ? for verification of how color schemes appear to those with color blindness2. All simulation is done in real time for both still and moving images, making it a practical alternative to software-based tools.
· Compliance with TCO?03 and TÜV Rheinland/Ergonomics.
· Monitor hood to shield the screen from ambient light and screen cleaner kit are bundled.
· Five-year warranty3.

Availability
The ColorEdge CG241W is now manufacturing and availability for shipping will be mid to late July in the United States.
 
850:1 seems like an really small contrast ratio, unless i compleatly missunderstand what it means, which is possiable,

however my 2 LGs have a 3000:1 contrast ratio 😕
 
Originally posted by: Anubis
850:1 seems like an really small contrast ratio, unless i compleatly missunderstand what it means, which is possiable,

however my 2 LGs have a 3000:1 contrast ratio 😕
Click to expand...


my guess would by 'dynamic' contrast ratio for yours.

but really, manufacturers can make up any number the feel like. theres no one, universal method to measure contrast
 
I was wondering about the CONTRAST issue too. The more expensive, professional LCD have a LOWER contrast ratio than the less expensive ones (800:1 vs. 1,000:1)... So there probably must be a good reason for it...

Also, I learned that HIGHER BRIGHTNESS (400-500) -- is really meaningless, since for accurate colors you really want to LOWER the brightness (to about 120), and most LCD owners have been claiming that, out of the box, their monitors were extremely bright to a point of annoyance.
 
I don't think that it's really that much better. But the Samsung 244t calibrates poorly for some reason, so I would get the BenQ FP241W which is in the same price range and offers great contrast and color accuracy, particularly after calibration.

The NEC has a wider viewing angle, and it has a slightly lower contrast due to its panel technology (S-IPS), but also perhaps a more accurate rating. Contrast isn't that important for photo editing or prepress. Generally, too much contrast is frowned upon in that area, so NEC is trying to hit the sweet spot (and I believe that they have). The NEC, without a colorimeter, is better than the BenQ. But, the BenQ with a colorimeter (~$225) is good enough that the NEC really isn't worth that much more money.

The Apple 23" may exceed the BenQ with regards to color accuracy, but I'm just going off the panel type more than anything else. I know on some of Apple's monitors you can't even adjust the settings, so without calibration it probably isn't as good as the BenQ w/ a colorimeter. The Eizo is just a BenQ with some fancy marketing terms and a high price. If you were to step up, you would get the NEC.

The most the 12-bit LUT will do for you is eliminate possibly invisible color kinks in the grayscale reproduction. Other than that, it's basically pointless. The human eye simply can't see the differences that the 12-bit LUT would be uncovering. The wide gamut of the Eizo is going to make everything look way over vibrant. It's really only suitable if you do Adobe RGB stuff. For most, the BenQ with a colorimeter is still a better option both economically and even technically in some aspects.

Print matching will indeed be difficult. Personally I don't think we'll ever really get there until laser monitors come out. A colorimeter (e.g. Eye One Display 2 or Optix XR) is your indispensable tool in this battle.

If it doesn't have to be 24", you should really be considering the NEC LCD2190Uxi. It'd probably be the best overall. It's a little more economical than the huge 24" NEC and it's great for photo editing, but still probably not worth it in terms of size/value over the BenQ anyway.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16824002139

For value: BenQ + colorimeter, unquestionably
For best: NEC LCD2490WUXi + colorimeter

Worth it? Who knows...I doubt that after calibration, whatever the NEC has is going to make print matching any easier...
 
I personally wouldn't pay an extra $700 for the same size. The NEC is probably $1400 just because they never drop prices on their products to stay competitive.
 
Originally posted by: xtknightThe Eizo is just a BenQ with some fancy marketing terms and a high price.
Click to expand...

care to give some proof to back that up? i'm curious how you might think this.


 
The new Eizo CG241W doesn't say what kind of panel technology it uses, is it S-IPS, as the NEC?.... I think that should be a major considration when deciding between the two... Or am I wrong...

I read what you, xtknight, say about your choice of BenQ with a colorimeter, and I'm not in a position to dispute it, but I wish I could support that with what other professionals are saying, 'cause it could be an EXCELLENT solution for me... Especially since I don't really feel like spending a $1,400 for the NEC 2940 PLUS ANOTHER $250 for getting a calibration system, that would be used ONCE....

And I'm also a bit surprised to read the claim that "The Eizo is just a BenQ with some fancy marketing terms and a high price." That doesn't sound right to me...

And, NO, I don't want a 21" monitor (too small for my needs) nor am I interested in a 30" one (for the same price, large size is nice, but less quality is not nice)...
 
well as far as i know, most (if not all) 24inch lcd panels are of p-mva type. apple 23in is s-ips i believe..

one thing about the apple one. from what i remember, if you use it with a pc, you wont be able to make any adjustments to it.

hmm actually i just found LG L245WP - the first S-IPS 24"

heres a few others i found along the way:

NEC LCD2690

BenQ FP241W

and BenQ FP241WZ (didnt read any of it - so no idea what the difference is between the two is.

 
Originally posted by: clandren
well as far as i know, most (if not all) 24inch lcd panels are of p-mva type. apple 23in is s-ips i believe..

one thing about the apple one. from what i remember, if you use it with a pc, you wont be able to make any adjustments to it.

hmm actually i just found LG L245WP - the first S-IPS 24"

heres a few others i found along the way:

NEC LCD2690

BenQ FP241W

and BenQ FP241WZ (didnt read any of it - so no idea what the difference is between the two is.
Click to expand...

http://www.flatpanels.dk/panels.php

Then type LG L245WP in the box.

It says the LG L245WP has a 24 inch 8 ms (g2g) P-MVA panel?
 
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