2012 M5 Will be Automatic Only

[JulesMaximus]

Not sure about expensive cars, but for cheap cars this is almost never true. On page 1 of this thread I linked to an article that compared gas mileage for automatic vs manual, but part of the article also compared 0-60. For every single car tested, the manual was faster.

Depends on the car. Of course, someone with limited experience driving a manual will probably be slower than the same guy in an automatic just mashing the throttle.

 

[Arkaign]

Depends on the car. Of course, someone with limited experience driving a manual will probably be slower than the same guy in an automatic just mashing the throttle.

It totally does depend on the car. I think it was Porsche who first came out with an auto that was notably quicker than the manual version, seems like it was the late 90s 911 Turbo or so.

 

[secretanchitman]

fine by me. the E60 M5 i thought was better suited for SMG anyway, but the E39 M5 - holy hell its either manual or no go. the manual in the E60 M5 feels like an afterthought.

 

[Throckmorton]

The new DCT "automatics" are anything but. And, they're more efficient than their manual counterparts to boot.

That may be true but a manual is much more fun. If efficiency and performance numbers are all you care about, just wait a few years for self driving cars.

 

[Throckmorton]

You and Throckmorton should have a baby that grows up to be a Mustang designer who implements auto+live axle (again).

So you support auto only in a performance sedan too? Let me guess, because most drivers don't care? I swear, you'll defend any anti-enthusiast compromise.

 

[Throckmorton]

Agreed...but for me, the thrill of a manual has a lot to do with how much control I have using the clutch. I can be as smooth or as abrupt as I want. The problem with an automated manual like the SMG in the M3/M5 is that it just doesn't have that "human touch" and makes you feel like you have less control. For me, the love of the manual is because I feel like I'm connected to the car and completely in control (even if it is not true). As you start subtracting inputs (clutch, gearshift), that feeling of control diminishes.

Exactly... bench racers don't get this. All they see is performance numbers.

 

[Pantoot]

Exactly... bench racers don't get this. All they see is performance numbers.

What SMG or DCT have you driven that was "much less fun" than a manual?

 

[punjabiplaya]

What SMG or DCT have you driven that was "much less fun" than a manual?

Can't do this in a DCT or SMG

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7GmuYbRypg&feature=player_embedded

 

[Throckmorton]

What SMG or DCT have you driven that was "much less fun" than a manual?

I haven't driven one of those fancy auto clutch transmissions, and I don't see what would make it as fun as a real manual. Pushing the clutch in, rev matching, and shifting the lever into the gear you want, then letting out the clutch precisely how you want to is fun. Pressing a button isn't fun.


If you could steer a car by pressing a button and having the car automatically use GPS to steer around a corner, would you want to do that? You know, you could get some great lap times in a robocar preprogrammed for the track...

 

[Doppel]

Having owned manuals my entire life the last vehicle I bought was an automatic and now there are two in my garage. It was hard at first, I thought I'd always own one, but the options are getting limited fast. And you know I'm ok with it now. It took a while, and it will for some of you who have to get rid of your manual for an automatic. But you'll be ok, and life will go on. It's sad to see an era go, but the era of manuals is going and we can march forward and prosper.

 

[Pantoot]

Pushing the clutch in, rev matching, and shifting the lever into the gear you want, then letting out the clutch precisely how you want to is fun. Pressing a button isn't fun.

Just like winding a window down by hand was more fun, or hand cranking the starter, or the precise control you get with a hand operated throttle rather than using your foot of all things.

You can't make fun of bench racers and then say you don't understand how an SMG could be fun. Try it. It is.

 

[3chordcharlie]

Just like winding a window down by hand was more fun, or hand cranking the starter, or the precise control you get with a hand operated throttle rather than using your foot of all things.

You can't make fun of bench racers and then say you don't understand how an SMG could be fun. Try it. It is.

It all depends how deep you want to go, and what gets you off.

I think the most relatively-legal fun you can have on public roads is in a little RWD sports car, preferably a little underpowered, without power steering, and with a manual transmission.

If you want to 'compete', or impress the guy holding the stopwatch, then you take all the technology you can within the rules.

 

[jteef]

i wonder if it will still let you do donuts / burnouts

 

[Throckmorton]

Just like winding a window down by hand was more fun, or hand cranking the starter, or the precise control you get with a hand operated throttle rather than using your foot of all things.

You can't make fun of bench racers and then say you don't understand how an SMG could be fun. Try it. It is.

Have you ever owned a manual RWD sports car? If you had I don't think you'd be comparing a manual transmission to manual windows.


I don't care what the flappy paddles are controlling-- pushing a button isn't the same.

 

[GoatMonkey]

Not sure about expensive cars, but for cheap cars this is almost never true. On page 1 of this thread I linked to an article that compared gas mileage for automatic vs manual, but part of the article also compared 0-60. For every single car tested, the manual was faster.

It's becoming more common than you would think. The most surprising one to me was the Nissan 370z. It now has a 7 speed slushbox automatic that is faster in a straight line than the 6 speed manual. The automatic does some computer controlled throttle tricks on downshifting that seem to make it pretty good around a track too. Most other instances are turbocharged cars that like the constant throttle when accelerating in a straight line, or exotic automated manuals like those from Ferrari and Lamborghini. Then there are some very fast instances where there is no manual option, so you don't know what the difference would be, like the Nissan GT-R and Lexus IS-F.

I was sold on the idea of the automated manual when I first drove a VW GTI with a DSG. It is really fun to drive, and the only thing you are really missing is the ability to skip gears. I have to also admit that most of my current top dream cars I would get with automated manuals even if a real manual was an option, Ferrari 458, McLaren MP4-12C, Lamborghini Gallardo/Murcielago/Aventador, Porsche 911 Turbo S, etc..

Sorry, I've sold out. Maybe I'm just old and have spent too much time driving in traffic. I remember being in high school and wanting a manual transmission above all. That's over now.