2-5-07 User fees proposed by Bush for air traffic services

[dmcowen674]

Only the airlines and super rich will be able to fly in the U.S.

Why am I not surprised.

Another right taken away by Bushco.

2-5-2007 User fees proposed by Bush for air traffic services

The Bush administration proposed on Monday that airlines pay billions in user fees to replace ticket and other taxes that currently underwrite much of the nation's air traffic control system.

Business jet owners and other private fliers would likely pay higher fuel taxes as part of the new formula, industry officials said.

Private plane owners, who like the airlines have a powerful lobby in Washington, fiercely oppose the plan. "This is real and it's just as bad as we thought it was going to be," said Phil Boyer, president of the Aircraft Owners and Pilots Association, the leading general aviation trade group

 

[yllus]

Yes, let's keep costs down for the middle class who just happen to own jets.

 

[jrenz]

Don't worry Dave, they're talking about planes, not yatchs, so you don't have to worry yet.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: yllus
Yes, let's keep costs down for the middle class who just happen to own jets.

Uh yeah, I'm not sure I get the point here. I think that owning your own jet plane is pretty much the definition of "super rich".

 

[Zorba]

This would affect all pilots, most of which are not rich and can already barely afford to fly. Av-gas is already over $4 a gallon at most airports, pushing rentals on a 172 to almost 100 bucks an hour for a POS.

User fees get proposed every year it seems, how the collect that fee seems to always change though. There are already huge taxes on Av-gas to pay for air traffic control, but the airlines don't like that because they use a lot more fuel than the guy in a 172. I guess it isn't fair that the people that use air traffic control from gate to gate pay the majority of the bill.

 

[ntdz]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Only the airlines and super rich will be able to fly in the U.S.

Why am I not surprised.

Another right taken away by Bushco.

2-5-2007 User fees proposed by Bush for air traffic services

The Bush administration proposed on Monday that airlines pay billions in user fees to replace ticket and other taxes that currently underwrite much of the nation's air traffic control system.

Business jet owners and other private fliers would likely pay higher fuel taxes as part of the new formula, industry officials said.

Private plane owners, who like the airlines have a powerful lobby in Washington, fiercely oppose the plan. "This is real and it's just as bad as we thought it was going to be," said Phil Boyer, president of the Aircraft Owners and Pilots Association, the leading general aviation trade group

How many middle class people do you know that own a plane? Besides, aren't you 100% for taxing rich people?

 

[Czar]

Is it only jets or propellar planes as well?

 

[imported_Shivetya]

So why shouldn't the people who use the services PAY for the services?


Or are pilots now entitled to free air traffic control services? Maybe they should be entitled to free airports too, then we can give them Earned Gas Tax Credits or such tripe?

 

[kedlav]

Doesn't sound too unreasonable to me. Pay for what you use, less free handouts to the rich/big business...

 

[palehorse]

Ok Dave, which is it? Are you FOR more taxing of the wealthy, or against it?

This entire point does not match up with your previously declared ideologies...

/confused

ps: do you own a plane AND a yacht?

 

[Schadenfroh]

Doesnt the bulk of airline revenue come from the middle class

 

[imported_Shivetya]

Originally posted by: Schadenfroh
Doesnt the bulk of airline revenue come from the middle class

We have a winner.

What we have is a more obvious example of "Embedded" taxes. The one thing most people don't understand, and politicians and friends don't want these people to do so, is that corporations merely COLLECT taxes for the government. The corporation doesn't pay any tax, ever. It embeds that tax into its goods and services which you pay for and then gripe about the evil corporation bilking you when in fact the government is possibly making a higher percentage that the corporation.

What the biggest example of fleecing Americans while misdirecting the blame? Exxon. Exxon reported 9% profit, the government made more per gallon of gasoline that Exxon ever could. It just isn't the gasoline product that Exxon sells that government taxes, they have their hand in every product including heating oil.


So, maybe the class warfare twits here will understand who the real enemy is.

 

[Specop 007]

This is the problem with the Democrats.

They've forgotten what a "right" is. Flying is not a "right". Amazingly, neither is driving. These are both "privileges".

In fact, many things the Democrats on this board would tell you are your rights are in fact not. Your true rights are very clearly spelled out for you in our nations founding documents. If you review them (Which Dave obviously has not) you will find flying is not listed as a right. Again, neither is driving. Suprisingly neither is healthcare or a high standard of living.

But lets not let facts rain on the parade shall we?

DAMN BUSH! HE'S STEALING OUR RIGHTS!

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Specop 007
This is the problem with the Democrats.

They've forgotten what a "right" is. Flying is not a "right". Amazingly, neither is driving. These are both "privileges".

In fact, many things the Democrats on this board would tell you are your rights are in fact not. Your true rights are very clearly spelled out for you in our nations founding documents. If you review them (Which Dave obviously has not) you will find flying is not listed as a right. Again, neither is driving. Suprisingly neither is healthcare or a high standard of living.

But lets not let facts rain on the parade shall we?

DAMN BUSH! HE'S STEALING OUR RIGHTS!

Ah of course, only the rich can buy priviledges that use America's resources that the lowly peons pay taxes on, what was I thinking?

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Zorba
This would affect all pilots, most of which are not rich and can already barely afford to fly. Av-gas is already over $4 a gallon at most airports, pushing rentals on a 172 to almost 100 bucks an hour for a POS.

User fees get proposed every year it seems, how the collect that fee seems to always change though. There are already huge taxes on Av-gas to pay for air traffic control, but the airlines don't like that because they use a lot more fuel than the guy in a 172. I guess it isn't fair that the people that use air traffic control from gate to gate pay the majority of the bill.

Thank you sir for getting it. :thumbsup:

Hey we're neighbors

 

[Specop 007]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: Specop 007
This is the problem with the Democrats.

They've forgotten what a "right" is. Flying is not a "right". Amazingly, neither is driving. These are both "privileges".

In fact, many things the Democrats on this board would tell you are your rights are in fact not. Your true rights are very clearly spelled out for you in our nations founding documents. If you review them (Which Dave obviously has not) you will find flying is not listed as a right. Again, neither is driving. Suprisingly neither is healthcare or a high standard of living.

But lets not let facts rain on the parade shall we?

DAMN BUSH! HE'S STEALING OUR RIGHTS!

Ah of course, only the rich can buy priviledges that use America's resources that the lowly peons pay taxes on, what was I thinking?

And what about welfare? How about this, the "rich" stop paying taxes to support deadbeats and the "poor" stop paying taxes to support the riches luxurious habits.

We'll see who wins.

See why your entire argument is just silly? Or maybe we shouldnt tax any money given to people under 16. Nor should they be required to pay taxes of any kind. Because hey, they cant drive so why should they pay for the roads right?

You cant just pigeon hole taxes to classes like you would like to. It just doesnt work.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: Specop 007
This is the problem with the Democrats.

They've forgotten what a "right" is. Flying is not a "right". Amazingly, neither is driving. These are both "privileges".

In fact, many things the Democrats on this board would tell you are your rights are in fact not. Your true rights are very clearly spelled out for you in our nations founding documents. If you review them (Which Dave obviously has not) you will find flying is not listed as a right. Again, neither is driving. Suprisingly neither is healthcare or a high standard of living.

But lets not let facts rain on the parade shall we?

DAMN BUSH! HE'S STEALING OUR RIGHTS!

Ah of course, only the rich can buy priviledges that use America's resources that the lowly peons pay taxes on, what was I thinking?

And what about welfare? How about this, the "rich" stop paying taxes to support deadbeats and the "poor" stop paying taxes to support the riches luxurious habits.

We'll see who wins.

See why your entire argument is just silly? Or maybe we shouldnt tax any money given to people under 16. Nor should they be required to pay taxes of any kind. Because hey, they cant drive so why should they pay for the roads right?

You cant just pigeon hole taxes to classes like you would like to. It just doesnt work.

Don't like it? The rich are still free to leave.

 

[Specop 007]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674


Don't like it? The rich are still free to leave.

I have no problems with it.
In fact....As I recall it was YOU who had a problem with it.
Pot meet kettle. The worthless are still free to leave. In fact, please do!

So lets review. First you complain when a "right" was taken when it wasnt. Then you complain because, and correct me if I'm wrong on this, the "rich" are unfairly using the "poor" tax money by flying.
THEN you tell me the rich are free to leave.

Do I have a good grasp on this? Because from where I sit your doing nothing more then throwing out the usual trash supporting Democrat.
"They took our rights!"
"Its not fair!"
"Kick out the rich!"

Again correct me if I'm wrong here.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: dmcowen674


Don't like it? The rich are still free to leave.

I have no problems with it.
In fact....As I recall it was YOU who had a problem with it.
Pot meet kettle. The worthless are still free to leave. In fact, please do!

So lets review. First you complain when a "right" was taken when it wasnt. Then you complain because, and correct me if I'm wrong on this, the "rich" are unfairly using the "poor" tax money by flying.
THEN you tell me the rich are free to leave.

Do I have a good grasp on this? Because from where I sit your doing nothing more then throwing out the usual trash supporting Democrat.
"They took our rights!"
"Its not fair!"
"Kick out the rich!"

Again correct me if I'm wrong here.

Nope, I see a lot of whining by the rich and they are in fact leaving.

Good, that will leave real Americans to re-build this Country. :thumbsup:

 

[blackangst1]

um

oh nevermind.

 

[KlokWyze]

Just another tax. Me thinks we will see more of these.... no?

Don't fly if you don't want to pay it. Same goes for income, gas & "personal property". It is ridiculous(normal government behavior) that nowadays the state considers driving a privilege. How many people reading this can really get to work without a car? We are raised from birth to embrace materialism, taught that owning a car is pretty much a necessity and told it is a privilege.

funny

 

[Specop 007]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: dmcowen674


Don't like it? The rich are still free to leave.

I have no problems with it.
In fact....As I recall it was YOU who had a problem with it.
Pot meet kettle. The worthless are still free to leave. In fact, please do!

So lets review. First you complain when a "right" was taken when it wasnt. Then you complain because, and correct me if I'm wrong on this, the "rich" are unfairly using the "poor" tax money by flying.
THEN you tell me the rich are free to leave.

Do I have a good grasp on this? Because from where I sit your doing nothing more then throwing out the usual trash supporting Democrat.
"They took our rights!"
"Its not fair!"
"Kick out the rich!"

Again correct me if I'm wrong here.

Nope, I see a lot of whining by the rich and they are in fact leaving.

Good, that will leave real Americans to re-build this Country. :thumbsup:

Whos whining?
Lets review who created this post shall we

As for rebuilding....What you WANT us to end up like Mexico? We can all be broke, live in little huts and eat cornbread. Yay!

You think these "real" Americans you refer to will get off their ass and build a damn thing? Look at Detroit. Oh yeah, a beacon of hope and opportunity there. How about Atlanta. Those "real" Americans you refer to are complaing because their tax paying base is trying to split!

Oh yes, I see a fantastic country coming from letting the "real" Americans rebuild it!

 

[JD50]

Haha, another thread where Dave can't decide if he agrees with the OP that he posted or not, classic Dave.

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

I must admit. I'm a touch bemused that Bushistas have raised EVERY fee they can find but claim to be the patron saint for protection against taxes.:roll:

 

[CPA]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: Specop 007
This is the problem with the Democrats.

They've forgotten what a "right" is. Flying is not a "right". Amazingly, neither is driving. These are both "privileges".

In fact, many things the Democrats on this board would tell you are your rights are in fact not. Your true rights are very clearly spelled out for you in our nations founding documents. If you review them (Which Dave obviously has not) you will find flying is not listed as a right. Again, neither is driving. Suprisingly neither is healthcare or a high standard of living.

But lets not let facts rain on the parade shall we?

DAMN BUSH! HE'S STEALING OUR RIGHTS!

Ah of course, only the rich can buy priviledges that use America's resources that the lowly peons pay taxes on, what was I thinking?

You only pay taxes if you use that privilege - peon or not.