Ford, GM, Rivian, Volvo/Polestar, and MB customers gain access to Tesla Supercharger network. Stellantis and Hyundai also in talks with Telsa

[bbhaag]

Mercedes-Benz just followed suit starting in 2025. They are the first German manufacturer to do so.

Mercedes-Benz picks Tesla's charging standard for North America EVs from 2025

German automaker Mercedes-Benz said on Friday its electric vehicles in North America will adopt the Tesla-developed charging technology from 2025 and also get access to more than 12,000 of its Superchargers from next year.

www.reuters.com

 

[bigi]

bp boosts EV charging network with $100 million order of Tesla ultra-fast chargers

text

from last point:
As early as 2024, Tesla chargers will be installed across the bp pulse network, including at key bp, Amoco, ampm; and Thorntons-branded sites, TravelCenters of America locations and at bp pulse’s large-scale Gigahub™ charging sites, near airports and in major metropolitan areas across the US.

 

[sdifox]

bp boosts EV charging network with $100 million order of Tesla ultra-fast chargers

text

from last point:
As early as 2024, Tesla chargers will be installed across the bp pulse network, including at key bp, Amoco, ampm; and Thorntons-branded sites, TravelCenters of America locations and at bp pulse’s large-scale Gigahub™ charging sites, near airports and in major metropolitan areas across the US.

I thought you didn't believe press releases?

 

[Kaido]

Lucid just adopted NACS:

Lucid Motors adopts Tesla's NACS, leaving only Volkswagen and Stellantis

Lucid Motors has officially announced plans to adopt Tesla's NACS charging hardward, leaving only VW and Stellantis as holdouts.

www.teslarati.com

This means there are only 2 manufacturers left who aren't using Tesla's standard:

1. VW
2. Stellantis (aka FCA, including Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep, Ram, etc.)

Props to Musk for the long-term vision! Easy revenue to be the largest electric gas station in the world!

 

[Zorba]

Lucid just adopted NACS:

Lucid Motors adopts Tesla's NACS, leaving only Volkswagen and Stellantis

Lucid Motors has officially announced plans to adopt Tesla's NACS charging hardward, leaving only VW and Stellantis as holdouts.

www.teslarati.com

This means there are only 2 manufacturers left who aren't using Tesla's standard:

1. VW
2. Stellantis (aka FCA, including Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep, Ram, etc.)

Props to Musk for the long-term vision! Easy revenue to be the largest electric gas station in the world!

Really I think this makes it easier for others to compete with the super charger network.

 

[Brovane]

Really I think this makes it easier for others to compete with the super charger network.

Why does it make it easier for others to compete with the Supercharger network?

 

[Zorba]

Why does it make it easier for others to compete with the Supercharger network?

Because now the alternatives only need one connector, and can now charge the biggest share of EVs. So they've more than doubled their customer base, while reducing the amount of infrastructure they need.

Tesla Superchargers have expanded their market, but not as much (so far at least) but their chargers have issues reaching many cars.

I also hope/assume there is about to be a lot of diversification in the charging market where it'll look more like gas stations, which will naturally eat super charger market share

 

[Brovane]

Because now the alternatives only need one connector, and can now charge the biggest share of EVs. So they've more than doubled their customer base, while reducing the amount of infrastructure they need.

Tesla Superchargers have expanded their market, but not as much (so far at least) but their chargers have issues reaching many cars.

I also hope/assume there is about to be a lot of diversification in the charging market where it'll look more like gas stations, which will naturally eat super charger market share

The CCS connector will be around for a long time. It isn't that hard to have a 2nd cable. Tesla was able to figure out a way to do both CCS and NACS from the same cable with the magic dock.

The reason that Tesla currently dominates the EV charging space is because they build their own chargers and they pre-fab the entire charging station. This results in Tesla Superchargers being about 1/3 to about 1/5 the cost of other companies charging stations. This also means that Tesla has easy access to spare parts when something breaks at a charging station. (I am looking at you Electrify America) They also build their own stationary storage which when deployed at a charging station helps mitigate peak demand.

https://insideevs.com/news/657795/tesla-shows-how-prefabricated-supercharger-units-save-time-costs/

https://electrek.co/2022/04/15/tesla-cost-deploy-superchargers-revealed-one-fifth-competition/

 

[bigi]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1722030348471562308

2,000,000 Tesla cars per year

No plug wars needed.

 

[bigi]

I thought you didn't believe press releases?

Why would you say that? b/c routers? Well, sorry I need to explain, routers "articles" are not press releases. That company has already signed the contract which is $$$.

Think of it as "USB moment" for Tesla. All will use it. Who does not, will die along with their customers.

 

[sdifox]

Why would you say that? b/c routers? Well, sorry I need to explain, routers "articles" are not press releases. That company has already signed the contract which is $$$.

Think of it as "USB moment" for Tesla. All will use it. Who does not, will die along with their customers.

Again, the press release was from the automaker consortium, Reuters just reported it, it's what news agencies do... No different than BP's news release, so why do you believe BP but not the automaker consortium

 

[Zorba]

The CCS connector will be around for a long time. It isn't that hard to have a 2nd cable. Tesla was able to figure out a way to do both CCS and NACS from the same cable with the magic dock.

The reason that Tesla currently dominates the EV charging space is because they build their own chargers and they pre-fab the entire charging station. This results in Tesla Superchargers being about 1/3 to about 1/5 the cost of other companies charging stations. This also means that Tesla has easy access to spare parts when something breaks at a charging station. (I am looking at you Electrify America) They also build their own stationary storage which when deployed at a charging station helps mitigate peak demand.

https://insideevs.com/news/657795/tesla-shows-how-prefabricated-supercharger-units-save-time-costs/

https://electrek.co/2022/04/15/tesla-cost-deploy-superchargers-revealed-one-fifth-competition/

So you don't think unifying the demand while allowing more competition will result in more/better competition for Tesla?

At the end of the day, the market will be big enough I'm sure Tesla will still grow, but I think they'll lose market share.

 

[Brovane]

So you don't think unifying the demand while allowing more competition will result in more/better competition for Tesla?

At the end of the day, the market will be big enough I'm sure Tesla will still grow, but I think they'll lose market share.

The problem for these charging companies is it is hard to make money on charging alone. Tesla doesn't have this problem because charging is just one of Tesla's many product lines. Tesla has a lot more capital to pull on and they have the ability to vertically integrate and scale which brings down costs of deploying charging stations for Tesla. Tesla also is a large manufacture, which probably gives them a lot better supply chain pricing than other charging networks that outsource production of their charging stations to a 3rd party.

I am glad to see more of this occurring with EVGO going to pre-fabricated sites. I hope we see more of this in the future.

https://www.evgo.com/press-release/...-cut-installation-timelines-by-50-on-average/

I think Tesla will have more competition outside of the US because other governments like the EU took steps to unify under one charging standard (CCS) and are taking more active steps to encourage EV charging stations. I think in the US, Tesla will dominate on the charging side for a while unless the government steps in to forcibly diversify the market.

 

[Zorba]

The problem for these charging companies is it is hard to make money on charging alone. Tesla doesn't have this problem because charging is just one of Tesla's many product lines. Tesla has a lot more capital to pull on and they have the ability to vertically integrate and scale which brings down costs of deploying charging stations for Tesla. Tesla also is a large manufacture, which probably gives them a lot better supply chain pricing than other charging networks that outsource production of their charging stations to a 3rd party.

I am glad to see more of this occurring with EVGO going to pre-fabricated sites. I hope we see more of this in the future.

https://www.evgo.com/press-release/...-cut-installation-timelines-by-50-on-average/

I think Tesla will have more competition outside of the US because other governments like the EU took steps to unify under one charging standard (CCS) and are taking more active steps to encourage EV charging stations. I think in the US, Tesla will dominate on the charging side for a while unless the government steps in to forcibly diversify the market.

I really foresee the current chargers in the back of a Walmart parking lot philosophy dying and being replaced with the current gas convenience store model. Already Buc-cee's have added EV charging at most of their locations. Which will help with the profitability issues.

 

[Brovane]

I really foresee the current chargers in the back of a Walmart parking lot philosophy dying and being replaced with the current gas convenience store model. Already Buc-cee's have added EV charging at most of their locations. Which will help with the profitability issues.

I stopped at a Eddie's world earlier this year that was a Tesla Supercharger location. It really is a captive audience I really don't see why more travel plaza's are no doing this. In Baker Tesla is adding more than 56 charging stalls to the current 40 stall location. Right next to a Shell Gas station with a Dairy Queen and Jersey Mikes.

 

[Zorba]

I stopped at a Eddie's world earlier this year that was a Tesla Supercharger location. It really is a captive audience I really don't see why more travel plaza's are no doing this. In Baker Tesla is adding more than 56 charging stalls to the current 40 stall location. Right next to a Shell Gas station with a Dairy Queen and Jersey Mikes.

I think as more cars can charge in the 15-20 minute time frame it'll become the norm. I think gas stations probably didn't really want people hanging out taking up space for an hour. But travel centers seem like a no brainer, usually have extra parking space, plus food, and other stuff that people with 45 minutes to kill can blow money on.

 

[Zorba]

So I am getting a Bolt EUV, supposedly on Friday (dealing with dealers is such a PITA). Do you all think Chevy or third parties will sell and replacement port, or do you think I'll be stuck with an adapter for life?

 

[sdifox]

So I am getting a Bolt EUV, supposedly on Friday (dealing with dealers is such a PITA). Do you all think Chevy or third parties will sell and replacement port, or do you think I'll be stuck with an adapter for life?

err, they cancelled Bolt, why would they make a replacement port?

Wait, it's the Volt that is cancelled. Yeah I don't see them making that part available.

 

[Brovane]

So I am getting a Bolt EUV, supposedly on Friday (dealing with dealers is such a PITA). Do you all think Chevy or third parties will sell and replacement port, or do you think I'll be stuck with an adapter for life?

You will probably need a adapter for life.

 

[Brovane]

I think as more cars can charge in the 15-20 minute time frame it'll become the norm. I think gas stations probably didn't really want people hanging out taking up space for an hour. But travel centers seem like a no brainer, usually have extra parking space, plus food, and other stuff that people with 45 minutes to kill can blow money on.

I think it will be more of a logistical challenge for gas stations in more urban areas that have limited footprints. I think for more Urban areas you will still have the model of Fast chargers in parking lots strips malls etc. Areas with a lot more parking available.

Something like this, large strip mall, ample parking and conveniently located near a Starbucks which is the natural habit for a Tesla driver.

 

[Zorba]

You will probably need a adapter for life.

Yeah, probably not a big deal. I'm guessing it wouldn't be a simple port swap either, since the Tesla port uses the same connectors for AC and DC and the CCS plug doesn't.

 

[Zorba]

I think it will be more of a logistical challenge for gas stations in more urban areas that have limited footprints. I think for more Urban areas you will still have the model of Fast chargers in parking lots strips malls etc. Areas with a lot more parking available.

Something like this, large strip mall, ample parking and conveniently located near a Starbucks which is the natural habit for a Tesla driver.

View attachment 88583

If more cars get to the 15-20 minute charge times, they won't really need much more foot print than gas pumps, especially if less and less people are buying gas. I do see them being wide spread at travel centers/truck stops/major interstate convenience stores first, though.

 

[Zorba]

As I was predicting, more EV chargers going to more interstate gas stations. In this case Mercedes going into 30 Buc-ees. This is interesting to me because the handful of Buc-ee's I ever go to already have Tesla chargers. I think we'll be see more and more of this.

Buc-ee’s and Mercedes-Benz are partnering to add high-speed chargers

The plan is to add them to most Buc-ee's travel centers, with 30 by the end of 2024.

arstechnica.com

ETA: Currently 24 have Tesla, one of those also has non-tesla DC charging.

 

[bbhaag]

Ford announced the news that the Mustang Mach-E and F-150 Lighting now have access to the Tesla Supercharger network.

Press release.

Today, Ford F-150 Lightning and Mustang Mach-E retail customers are the first of any non-Tesla automaker to gain access to Tesla Superchargers across the U.S. and Canada.

According to a Cox Automotive Consumer Sentiment Study, lack of charging stations is the second largest barrier after price when it comes to purchasing an electric vehicle. As EV prices come down, improving access to reliable fast charging is critical to help more customers confidently choose an EV.

The 15,000+ available Tesla Superchargers more than double customer access to reliable DC fast charging on the BlueOval™ Charge Network.

Ford is saying thank you to its electric vehicle customers by making the Fast Charging Adapter available at no cost to new and existing customers enrolled in the BlueOval™ Charge Network through June 30, 2024. The adapter is required to charge at upgraded Tesla Superchargers. Ford retail EV customers are the first in the industry to have the opportunity to order the Fast Charging Adapter.

Retail customers will be eligible to receive a complimentary adapter if ordered by June 30, 2024. Future Ford EV customers can purchase the adapter from Ford for $230 (including estimated tax and shipping).

Ford Pro commercial customers will be contacted this Spring by mail at the address registered with Ford Pro or via their Ford Pro account manager to order an adapter.

The BlueOval™ Charge Network provides one seamless stored payment account through the FordPass App, or Charge Assist App (soon to be "Public Charge") in the vehicle’s touchscreen, which eliminates the need for onsite credit card use. Once owners have created an account and activated Plug & Charge, Tesla Superchargers will support Plug & Charge with Ford EVs. This means customers simply have to plug in and charging will automatically start with charges managed through FordPass.

In the future, Ford will begin offering next-generation electric vehicles with the North American Charging Standard (NACS) connector built-in, eliminating the need for an adapter to access Tesla Superchargers.

I reserved mine as soon as I read the news! How exciting!

 

[JTsyo]

So I'm hearing Fords will need to take up two spots to charge since the wires aren't long enough and Ford's port is opposite of Tesla's. Going to be some mad Tesla owners if they are blocked by Fords.