8GB VRAM not enough (and 10 / 12)

[BFG10K]

8GB

• Dying Light 2, Battlefield 2042, Avatar Frontiers of Pandora, Call of Duty Modern Warfare 3, Starfield, Forza Horizon 5, Horizon Forbidden West, Alan Wake 2, The Last of Us, Tekken 8, FC 24, Detroit Become Human, Death Stranding, Alone in The Dark, Overwatch 2
  3060 12GB higher 1% low than 4060 8GB https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIfz57wmywg
• Cyberpunk 2077, Diablo 4, Hogwarts Legacy, Horizon Zero Dawn, Microsoft Flight Sim 2020, Witcher 3, Watch Dogs Legion skip to 4K + DLSS for each game https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPiaWWd0xGc
• Ratchet & Clank, Plague Tale Requiem, Last Of Us, Jedi Survivor, Far Cry 6, Hogwarts Legacy, Forza Horizon 5, Cyberpunk 2077 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wr3MckDxMfE&pp=ygUTMTZnYiB2cyA4Z2IgNDA2MCB0aQ==
• Far Cry 6, Godfall, Hogwarts Legacy, Forza Horizon 5, Forspoken, Doom Eternal, Watchdogs Legion https://youtu.be/fJc--C01P90?t=268
• Last Of Us, Resident Evil 4, Callisto Protocol, Plague Tale Requiem, Halo Infinite, Forspoken https://youtu.be/2_Y3E631ro8?t=429
• Last Of Us, Hogwarts Legacy, Resident Evil 4, Forspoken, Plague Tale Requiem, Callisto Protocol https://youtu.be/Rh7kFgHe21k?t=288
• Hogwarts Legacy, Last Of Us, Spider Man Remastered, Doom Eternal, Forza Horizon 5 https://youtu.be/R943CbDTq_s?t=1473
• Horizon Forbidden West 4060 has issues @ 1080p + DLSS unless you switch off frame generation and reduce settings to high https://youtu.be/3AyKvI23VGw?t=233
• Horizon Forbidden West 3070 requires reducing textures 2 notches https://youtu.be/xTwEGy6HHKo?t=351
• Deathloop https://youtu.be/lu_XHyO-6zY?t=918
• Ghost Recon Breakpoint https://youtu.be/iUGppQVpXzU?t=529
• Resident Evil 2 https://youtu.be/Aa-gsgRjMII?t=796
• Talos Principle 2 https://youtu.be/K6FATQAuEwI?t=337
• Spider Man Remastered https://youtu.be/vRVR_plVSlc?t=1060
• Witcher 3 https://youtu.be/vRVR_plVSlc?t=1240

Horizon Forbidden West 3060 is faster than the 2080 Super despite the former usually competing with the 2070. Also 3060 has a better 1% low than 4060 and 4060Ti 8GB.

Spoiler

Resident Evil Village 3060TI/3070 tanks at 4K and is slower than the 3060/6700XT when ray tracing:

Spoiler

Company Of Heroes 3060 has a higher minimum than the 3070TI:

Spoiler

10GB / 12GB

• Plague Tale Requiem 3080 10GB tanks if you enable ray tracing, would be fast enough if it had more VRAM because if you stop moving, the framerate stabilizes to >60FPS https://youtu.be/7zjrMww3fAc?t=496
• Hogwarts Legacy 4K + RT, 4060Ti 16GB is faster than 4070 12GB https://youtu.be/X-h_R488Mq8?t=191

Reasons why still shipping 8GB since 2014 isn't NV's fault.

Spoiler

1. It's the player's fault.
2. It's the reviewer's fault.
3. It's the developer's fault.
4. It's AMD's fault.
5. It's the game's fault.
6. It's the driver's fault.
7. It's a system configuration issue.
8. Wrong settings were tested.
9. Wrong area was tested.
10. Wrong games were tested.
11. 4K is irrelevant.
12. Texture quality is irrelevant as long as it matches a console's.
13. Detail levels are irrelevant as long as they match a console's.
14. There's no reason a game should use more than 8GB, because a random forum user said so.
15. It's completely acceptable for the more expensive 3070/3070TI/3080 to turn down settings while the cheaper 3060/6700XT has no issue.
16. It's an anomaly.
17. It's a console port.
18. It's a conspiracy against NV.
19. 8GB cards aren't meant for 4K / 1440p / 1080p / 720p gaming.
20. It's completely acceptable to disable ray tracing on NV while AMD has no issue.
21. Polls, hardware market share, and game title count are evidence 8GB is enough, but are totally ignored when they don't suit the ray tracing agenda.

According to some people here, 8GB is neeeevaaaaah NV's fault and objective evidence "doesn't count" because of reasons(tm). If you have others please let me know and I'll add them to the list. Cheers!

 

[igor_kavinski]

OMG that's what I am saying. They are priced according to their performance and not their vram

So what about the documented cases of 4060 Ti 8GB tanking in performance? Why does it fail to offer "performance" in every case and justify its higher price?



RT 4K, SAME GPU (I'm frothing at the mouth now!)

WHY WHY WHY???

 

[Ranulf]

I will stand more on the GTX 1070 vs RTX 3060ti comparison. Largely different cards. Both 8GBs. The 3060ti could do 4k/epic/dlss/60 the 1070 only 1080p/60/high. Do you see the difference or do you not? How is the 8GBs handicapping the 3060ti? They do not. The card is doing what it was meant to do. Actually way more in this one, since the 3060ti is not a 4k/dlss card. The game was just very light before the Lumen patch.

Uh, I guess I do not see the difference. Apart from the fact that the 1070 will celebrate its 8th birthday next month.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Actually way more in this one, since the 3060ti is not a 4k/dlss card.

Any official URL?

How is the typical gamer supposed to know that?

 

[reggie_fils_aime]

What I should print and send to you however, is that I have told you a hundred times already, that I have THREE 8GB cards and they are nothing alike. For me, their value is exactly where it should be.

I have an RX6600 too. Great little card, especially for the price, I agree. However this is where we are now. I fired up Everspace 2, so to see the new Lumen upgrade. Lo and behold. The game is now unplayable on the rx6600. This is what it was before from gamegpu's testing.



The game went from 72fps to 46fps for the rx6600. What this means, is that game went from playable to unplayable. The 3060ti however, still manages a playable 1080p experience. The 4060ti is 2.13X faster than the rx6600, while also being faster than the 6800s once again. Are these 8GB cards anything alike? No! So how exactly you want them to be priced? Do you really want a flat price for all? What do you want, 30$ difference for each tier? Would you follow that pricing if you were the manufacturer? Do the rest of the monetary tiers in your life, work like that?

As a side note, also keep in mind that this game, went to +56% gpu power requirement, while it increased only 10-15% in vram requirement. Let that sink in and understand what I am talking about, when I am showing you were things are heading. The marveled rtx 3060 with its 12GB, still has framedrops below 60fps. Yeah, vram aint gonna help, even in 1080p.

Are you familiar with the saying "you're missing the forest for the trees"? That's what you're doing every time you single out one particular game with different settings outside of a wider context.

Yes, there are some instances where the restricted VRAM buffer on a 4060/ti isn't an issue, but there are also some games where the 4060/ti are being held back BECAUSE of that 8 gig buffer. That problem is going to increase in frequency as time goes on. Yes, you can 'fix' it temporarily by changing settings, but in the end the card will reach an expiry long before price competitors with larger buffers and a wider data bus; e.g. an RX 6800.

This is the crux of what dozens (hundreds?) of people have been trying to get through your skull for an eternity. Not that some 8 gig cards are faster than others (no duh), but that certain cards are a heinous value foisted upon consumers by a company that doesn't give two hot you-know-whats about whether or not their silicon is going to end up in a landfill in 5 years.

 

[GodisanAtheist]

Oh wow. When you see lesser performance on some test with exorbitant settings on 8GB cards, even if they are within acceptable playability boundaries, you are all grabbing the pitchforks. Now all of a sudden, 30fps is absolutely playable? On an action game that has extreme x+z axis movement? And I am the one doing goalpost shifting? lol

-From my point of view, you've unilaterally decided that if something doesn't run at 60FPS it's unplayable.

A steady 30FPS, I'd agree, is the lower bound for what can be considered playable, especially with bargain bin hardware, but it is still playable.

 

[maddie]

-From my point of view, you've unilaterally decided that if something doesn't run at 60FPS it's unplayable.

A steady 30FPS, I'd agree, is the lower bound for what can be considered playable, especially with bargain bin hardware, but it is still playable.

True.

Hah, even that glorified 60FPS is a relic of the old CRT monitors which itself is derived from the North American NTSC TV refresh rate standard, itself based on the USA's 60Hz AC power standard. The interested should check out the OLD anandtech video card reviews for some sanity check on frame rates. Latest and greatest reaching 60 if lucky.

 

[CouncilorIrissa]

Are you familiar with the saying "you're missing the forest for the trees"? That's what you're doing every time you single out one particular game with different settings outside of a wider context.

He's not missing anything, he's not dumb. He's doing it on purpose. We're long past giving the benefit of the doubt.

 

[MrPickins]

Oh wow. When you see lesser performance on some test with exorbitant settings on 8GB cards, even if they are within acceptable playability boundaries, you are all grabbing the pitchforks. Now all of a sudden, 30fps is absolutely playable? On an action game that has extreme x+z axis movement? And I am the one doing goalpost shifting? lol

The issues that have been highlighted generally are not those where average fps dips a bit, it's those where the 1% lows are in the single digits.

It's not that bad to play at a steady 30-60fps (although less than ideal); frequent dips to 5fps is unplayable, though.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Oh and something else, very very interesting. Gamegpu tested a tech demo, on both UE4 and UE5. I mean who does that? These guys are epic (pun intended)

These guys are IDIOTS.

Just saw the tech demo and it is nothing too special. These visuals could've been attained on even older hardware. They are doing something really bone-headed to drive up the rendering requirements. On top of that, these morons (or rather opportunistic amateurs) are charging almost $200 for the privilege to run their turd demo on our hardware. Enough said.

Please tell me how this tech demo's visuals beat Unigine Superposition visuals or how the techniques used in Superposition demo could not be used to mimic this tech demo?

 

[DAPUNISHER]

He's not missing anything, he's not dumb. He's doing it on purpose. We're long past giving the benefit of the doubt.

OP is MIA. If they do not return soon I'll recommend this one get locked up. I was aghast when someone pointed out how old this thread is. It's been going for almost 3 years. A consensus has been reached, and reviewers have covered the VRAM issues more than enough for anyone not in the know already to find out about it. If they still live under a rock, too bad so sad.

 

[igor_kavinski]

The game was just very light before the Lumen patch.

What are your findings after the Lumen patch?

 

[igor_kavinski]

OP is MIA. If they do not return soon I'll recommend this one get locked up.

If a new instance of VRAM insufficiency is discovered, can someone post a new thread for the purpose of informing people? The forum member can put in a link to this thread in their post, in case anyone is interested in the history.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

If a new instance of VRAM insufficiency is discovered, can someone post a new thread for the purpose of informing people? The forum member can put in a link to this thread in their post, in case anyone is interested in the history.

I'd suggest making it about just that game, and that game only. It would greatly limit the amount of spamming of nonsense allowed before warnings and infractions start. If any of you think this thread should continue even if the OP does not update it soon, now's the time to say so.

 

[igor_kavinski]

We could all agree to just post new URLs/charts showing either side of the argument without arguing...

 

[DAPUNISHER]

We could all agree to just post new URLs/charts showing either side of the argument without arguing...

How's the weather in FantasyLand? Message board discussions that are not user to user help and info are driven by - I can't go to bed! Someone on the internet is wrong! Besides, we are not there yet. If this thread is doing it for you? Cool I guess.

 

[Mopetar]

OP is MIA. If they do not return soon I'll recommend this one get locked up. I was aghast when someone pointed out how old this thread is. It's been going for almost 3 years. A consensus has been reached, and reviewers have covered the VRAM issues more than enough for anyone not in the know already to find out about it. If they still live under a rock, too bad so sad.

He posts in here still on occasion and actually keeps the first post updated, so it's probably one of the better managed threads.

It might become more relevant again when next generation cards launch, so I think closing it now is a bit premature if the same thread winds up being spawned all over again a few months down the road.

I'd also rather keep it around if only as a containment zone. No one is being forced to argue in here.

 

[igor_kavinski]

I'd also rather keep it around if only as a containment zone.

Dangerously argumentative user ahead!

Tread with caution!

 

[DAPUNISHER]

He posts in here still on occasion and actually keeps the first post updated, so it's probably one of the better managed threads.

It might become more relevant again when next generation cards launch, so I think closing it now is a bit premature if the same thread winds up being spawned all over again a few months down the road.

I'd also rather keep it around if only as a containment zone. No one is being forced to argue in here.

OP has not logged in for weeks, nevermind posted. The rest of your points are good ones. You guys decide. I'll take you and Igor as voting for this to stay active.

 

[igor_kavinski]

OP has not logged in for weeks, nevermind posted.

Based on his last post, he may well have rage quit

 

[GodisanAtheist]

I figure we keep it open and it can die a natural death when people lost interest in arguing the point.

If this forum was super active and this was bumping other more interesting threads off the front page then I can see an argument for closing it, but unfortunately that's not the case.

 

[Mopetar]

OP has not logged in for weeks, nevermind posted. The rest of your points are good ones. You guys decide. I'll take you and Igor as voting for this to stay active.

I guess it's been a bit longer than I had thought if that's the case. I think you'll have to forgive me though since time flows a little bit differently in this thread for reasons that I think you're aware of.

I don't know how often the average user posts, but I've gotten busy with life at times and don't log in or post for month long stretches on occasion.

 

[DeathReborn]

I'd suggest making it about just that game, and that game only. It would greatly limit the amount of spamming of nonsense allowed before warnings and infractions start. If any of you think this thread should continue even if the OP does not update it soon, now's the time to say so.

I'd say this thread is about 90 pages of P&N grade stuff. Time to put her down is what I say.

 

[nurturedhate]

I often come here just for this thread.

 

[psolord]

This is the most interesting thread I have seen in years. I want it to stay alive. I may fight here, but the technical aspects are through the roof. Also I want to see the error of my ways, in coming years. Meaning, I want to see that vram is more important than gpu power, in each card's respective tier (it isn't).

 

[psolord]

So what about the documented cases of 4060 Ti 8GB tanking in performance? Why does it fail to offer "performance" in every case and justify its higher price?

View attachment 98583

RT 4K, SAME GPU (I'm frothing at the mouth now!)

WHY WHY WHY???

You posted the answer, in your own post. I marked it for you. 4k+RT, lol. Why are you asking?

Because the 4060ti 8GB is a very strong, the strongest, 1080p card out there. It's not the card's fault if you try to use it wrong. The 4070ti is borderline a 1440p card, let alone the 4060ti at 4k, wtf.

edit also I have to add this. You got your screenshot from here.

NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4060 Ti 16 GB Review - Twice the VRAM Making a Difference?

Finally! Our GeForce RTX 4060 Ti 16 GB review is live. We're investigating what performance gains you can expect from doubling the VRAM size to 16 GB. Our review of the 16 GB version also looks at power consumption and how overclocking is affected by the additional four memory chips on the back...

www.techpowerup.com

lol, look at these results

A plague tale requiem = 26fps for both 8gb and 16gb models

Cyberpunk 13 vs 11 fps, wow much frames

Doom Eternal 85 vs 64fps, ok a difference, but still playable on the 8GB

Elden Ring 27fps for both

F1 24 vs 23fps

Far Cry 6, 45 vs 12fps, the only one worth a mention, while the same healthy 80fps at 1440p, which means just enable dlss on the 8GB model and you are good to go. You would do the same on the 16GB model anyway.

Hogwarts Legacy 19fps for both

Resident Evil 4, 40 vs 33, but the same at 1440p, same as above, just enable dlss, which you would do anyway for the 16GB model too, if you want to make it playable

Spider Man, 50 vs 49, pffff

Watchdogs Legion 26 vs 25 lol

Guys I mean seriously, get a grip. At the end of the day, we have unplayability vs unplayability, and in order to reach playability you would have to use the same settings (dlss essentially) for both cards. This is the mentality of this thread.

So, once again, results and percentages of ZERO value for the end user.